The interesting sound of silence.

[UP4014]

I don't think this is any one party policy. Rail services have been declining for decades, regardless of who's in power, and saying it's a Federal problem is wide of the mark.

Why is rail being given the back pedal? It should be the most efficient form of transport we have, short of sea transport.

Afraid I need to disagree with you on this one completely, rail has been on the increase for the last decade every year. 2014 has seen a decline start. I see it in equipment utilisation, km travelled and tonnages for freight and the ability to get a train through the network.

Rail is in decline on 2014 and 2015 because manufacturing is; and economy is slowing as unemployment rises. If you shipped 3 containers a week to Toyota, Ford and Holden and the Govt funding support is not renewed on idealogical grounds then guess what, the flow on is you don't need a train driver to move those any more or the guy who made them lunch each day.

I note the rumour is the Reserve Bank might even cut rates to try and stimulate. Half of Europe is dragging the other half down and the US is cranking up, we should be as well but China is potentially a house of cards and caution prevails while the Australia Govt does nothing.

Look at the Submarine issue, the Feds say they couldn't build a canoe.

The problem is this Govt is not pragmatic in the best interests of the residents, it's ideology is overriding logic.

Matt

 

[blackcat20]

Well, geez, how can I win?I'm damed either way.

I was glad to see a female PM. In fact, one of the most satisfying moments of my life occurred when the Queen arrived at Fairbairn to be greeted by a female Governor-General, a female Prime Minister and a female Chief Minister of the ACT. Positions of significant power, all of them. Regardless of politics, that's proof that gender inequality is changing. There should be more of it.

I wasn't pointing at you in particular. But unfortunately there are enough backwards people in this country who would have voted her our purely because she is female.

 

[Skyring]

I wasn't pointing at you in particular. But unfortunately there are enough backwards people in this country who would have voted her our purely because she is female.

I don't condone sexism, but this is a democracy, everyone's vote is worth the same as everyone else's, and we do our voting in secret.

I don't care why people vote. They can vote because they don't like the colour tie the candidate wears or his eyes are too close together or his taste in beer sucks.

It doesn't matter at all. It's not my business.

Likewise, tolerance isn't about getting on with people you like. It's about getting on with the people you don't like. It's about understanding that people are people, just like yourself. We start saying that some people aren't quite as good as others, before long we're firing up the gas chambers again.

 

[Durin's Bane]

I wasn't pointing at you in particular. But unfortunately there are enough backwards people in this country who would have voted her our purely because she is female.

Gillard was a dud. Political affirmative action at its worst.

I agree with you that were probably a number of bigots around that voted against her on the basis of her gender. But it was her performance that turned her off in the eyes of most Australians.

 

[Durin's Bane]

Thanks for this link - seems to say there were approximately 850 drownings under R/G/R between 2007-2013 and between 350-700 under Howard between 2000-2007. Pre 2000 stats are not given but would probably be less and even more fuzzy. The fuzziness has returned in spades so current stats are impossible to know.

1200 seems to be an exaggeration, but in this arena that's the norm.

If you read through the Monash Australian Border Deaths Database, you will see that the drownings under the Howard Government pre-date its 'Pacific Solution' policy, whereas the drownings under the Labor Government occurred following the removal of the Howard Government's arrangements. Between 2001 and the decision by the Rudd Government to disband the Pacific Solution, there were no reported drownings at sea i.e. for just over six years.

BTW, I've yet to see anyone from the Labor Party dispute the verbal figure quoted of 1200 deaths.

 

[medhead]

My major beef with Gillard was the relentless dishonesty. She rarely admitted any error in herself or her government, especially when it was such a shambles that she was removed by her own party in favour of Kevin Rudd, demonstrably one of the worst leaders the ALP has ever had. It was all someone else's fault.

Secondary was her seeking political solutions rather than practical ones. Her ideas all sounded good when announced, but they rarely worked out in practise. Her Mining Tax didn't raise any money. Her Carbon Tax didn't reduce emissions, and her Border Security caused a thousand deaths or more.

Wouldn't it be nice if our leaders stopped trying to win the daily media cycle and instead just shut up and governed well?

I had two words, but must expand. whatever imaged relentless dishonesty there was, it is eclipsed by Abbott. In fact it pales into insignificance against his broken promises.

Worst leader of the ALP - Umm, Latham!!!

The Carbon tax DID reduce emissions. the border security claim is already answered and it's not a thousand. (not that one death is to be dismissed). That whole list all sounds like a repeat of three word catchphrases that are baseless.

Gillard tried the govern well approach. That worked. Our saviour certainly can't be accused of governing well.

Afraid I need to disagree with you on this one completely, rail has been on the increase for the last decade every year. 2014 has seen a decline start. I see it in equipment utilisation, km travelled and tonnages for freight and the ability to get a train through the network.

Rail is in decline on 2014 and 2015 because manufacturing is; and economy is slowing as unemployment rises. If you shipped 3 containers a week to Toyota, Ford and Holden and the Govt funding support is not renewed on idealogical grounds then guess what, the flow on is you don't need a train driver to move those any more or the guy who made them lunch each day.

I note the rumour is the Reserve Bank might even cut rates to try and stimulate. Half of Europe is dragging the other half down and the US is cranking up, we should be as well but China is potentially a house of cards and caution prevails while the Australia Govt does nothing.

Look at the Submarine issue, the Feds say they couldn't build a canoe.

The problem is this Govt is not pragmatic in the best interests of the residents, it's ideology is overriding logic.

Matt

I read a letter to the AFR in the last week that was lamenting the route chosen for a freight rail between NSW and Queensland. Apparently longer than required and over land that should result in higher maintenance costs.

 

[medhead]

Gillard was a dud. Political affirmative action at its worst.

I agree with you that were probably a number of bigots around that voted against her on the basis of her gender. But it was her performance that turned her off in the eyes of most Australians.

No, it was the performance report given by Abbott that turned them off.

Now can we get onto the topic. Abbott's performance report. Surely you're not trying to avoid the topic by this obsession with irrelevance?

 

[Durin's Bane]

"relentless dishonesty"???? You will no doubt be able to back that up with copious examples. But anyway - I think you have highlighted the main problem with the previous incumbents - lack of courage to maintain the line. They were spooked when the media and mining companies flexed their muscles and dictated policy and approval ratings to the masses, so when the lynch mobs started baying for blood they acceded to their wishes and then were puzzled (twice) when that didn't silence the bleating. Unfortunately losing with dignity is no longer an option and lying your way into government is now expected. How else can you explain the "sounds of silence"?

If the previous government had 'maintained the line' with Gillard they would have gotten a historical wipeout. They should have stayed with Rudd in 2010 and would have won the election back then without the need for bed hopping with the Greens.

BTW, the mining companies protected their commercial interests as they have every right to do. No different to the Union movement in 2006 / 2007.

 

[Durin's Bane]

No, it was the performance report given by Abbott that turned them off.

Now can we get onto the topic. Abbott's performance report. Surely you're not trying to avoid the topic by this obsession with irrelevance?

No. Abbott didn't formulate her policies, blunders or media strategy.

I've already stated earlier my disappointment with Abbott, and also stated he's better than what we had in the recent past. What more needs to be said?

 

[UP4014]

No. Abbott didn't formulate her policies, blunders or media strategy.

I've already stated earlier my disappointment with Abbott, and also stated he's better than what we had in the recent past. What more needs to be said?

At least we can be secure in the knowledge Abbott doesn't formulate his policies, blunders and media strategy. He has Peta Credlin for that.

Matt

 

[Moody]

If the previous government had 'maintained the line' with Gillard they would have gotten a historical wipeout.

Yeah - that was my reference to losing with dignity. The last person to do that in Australia was Malcolm Turnbull

They should have stayed with Rudd in 2010 and would have won the election back then without the need for bed hopping with the Greens.

Agreed - the ALP should have stayed the course with Rudd (regardless of personality issues) and stared down the mining companies' advertising millions and Abbott's relentless negativity about climate change. But hindsight is in as short supply as vision these days.

BTW, the mining companies protected their commercial interests as they have every right to do. No different to the Union movement in 2006 / 2007.

Interesting comparison - billionaires vs the so-called working class. Both have their heroes and villains, but I suspect we will disagree on which group best represents the public interest.

 

[medhead]

No. Abbott didn't formulate her policies, blunders or media strategy.

?

That's right. That's why I didn't attribute those to Abbott. But he did develop a performance report for her, mainly consisting of three word slogans. That's what turned people off, because anyone with half a brain who looked at the actual policies won't be turned off.

 

[medhead]

At least we can be secure in the knowledge Abbott doesn't formulate his policies, blunders and media strategy. He has Peta Credlin for that.

Matt

He does make the captain's picks about knighthoods alone.

 

[dajop]

BTW, the mining companies protected their commercial interests as they have every right to do. No different to the Union movement in 2006 / 2007.

Aaah, mining companies & unions, pretenders. We all know who is most proficient at protecting his commercial interests and influencing the electorate. And he hasn't been an Australian citizen for 30 years.

 

[Durin's Bane]

Aaah, mining companies & unions, pretenders. We all know who is most proficient at protecting his commercial interests and influencing the electorate. And he hasn't been an Australian citizen for 30 years.

The Milky Bar Kid had old Rupert's support in 2007...

 

[Durin's Bane]

That's right. That's why I didn't attribute those to Abbott. But he did develop a performance report for her, mainly consisting of three word slogans. That's what turned people off, because anyone with half a brain who looked at the actual policies won't be turned off.

Do you mean the following light bulb moments?

Personally negotiated Mining Tax Mark 2
Never ending promises for a budget surplus
Eternal defence of Craig Thompson
Hypocrisy of the "misogyny" speech
Media 'reforms'
Playing the victim to the end


And the list above doesn't even include asylum seekers or carbon tax, or Rudd's disasters where she was the Deputy!

 

[drron]

When the previous government was in power we were assailed continuously about the mistakes of the Rudd/Gillard government.

Pushka and Skyring amongst others, as I recall, took great delight in lambasting the government and anyone who sought to defend them.

Now we have given Prince Phillip a knighthood, and have seen a lamentable performance all round. What do we hear? Silence.

Must be the opposition's fault.

Made my comment 2 days ago-OT post41422.
Saying anything else here is pointless as already being demonstrated.

 

[medhead]

Made my comment 2 days ago-OT post41422.
Saying anything else here is pointless as already being demonstrated.

Another soft issue critic. What about the budget fix?

 

[medhead]

Do you mean the following light bulb moments?

Personally negotiated Mining Tax Mark 2
Never ending promises for a budget surplus
Eternal defence of Craig Thompson
Hypocrisy of the "misogyny" speech
Media 'reforms'
Playing the victim to the end


And the list above doesn't even include asylum seekers or carbon tax, or Rudd's disasters where she was the Deputy!

Yep that is the Abbott song sheet.

How's that budge going now. $78 billion EXTRA debt. Thanks to the adults.

You might like to brush up about Craig Thomson.

Reality doesn't match Abbott fear campaign.

 

[blackcat20]

I don't condone sexism, but this is a democracy, everyone's vote is worth the same as everyone else's, and we do our voting in secret.

I don't care why people vote. They can vote because they don't like the colour tie the candidate wears or his eyes are too close together or his taste in beer sucks.

Yet two years ago I was blasted on here because my reasons for not liking Abbot were deemed to be not good enough for many. I'm still wary about engaging in this thread at all because of it.