Two reasons I can't take Virgin & Velocity seriously

[andyhui01]

I'm not sure the OP is the target of the program. Don't get me wrong. Qantas is a nice airline but it's really very stuffy. Even the flight crews are older than me. I feel like I'm flying my grandfathers airline. As a 32rd old exec, virgin is mostly pitched towards people like me.

Well said. Same age as you and that's how I feel about VA vs QF. Love the energy and vibe of The VA brand + crew. Unless something changes drastically I think it's fit me almost perfectly Inc alliance with SQ.

 

[docjames]

Still strikes me as odd that you can't select seats online other than at initial booking and then after checkin opens.

We have a flight (not until october!) that had the 737-700 sub in for the 738 so our carefully selected 24AB and 25AB were reallocated to 22CDEF.

Once I finally had time to call, i managed to get it fixed easily enough (now 11AB and 12AB) but I could have fixed it in three minutes if online seat selection was possible.

I wasn't going to wait until checkin opened as risk of not getting two AB pairs near each other.

 

[Jack_OC]

I'm not sure the OP is the target of the program. Don't get me wrong. Qantas is a nice airline but it's really very stuffy. Even the flight crews are older than me. I feel like I'm flying my grandfathers airline. As a 32rd old exec, virgin is mostly pitched towards people like me.

Family pooling so I get access to my full spend as status. Nice lounges that don't feel like libraries (looking at the Canberra Qantas business lounge in particular). Easy access to J with Singapore airlines for my dashes to other counties for work. A Flexi ticket point earn that more or less pays for the upgrade on domestic travel. Fly ahead on the intermediate ticket for when I finish early.

I don't half mind those chilli chips in economy plus a hayburner and economy x generally means I now get lots of legroom on my flights that aren't in business. Just retained platinum easily and probably not going to switch. Could kill those lamb empanadas as they look really sad.

I have no idea what age the OP is, but I'm only a few years older than you, so with all due respect, I don't think you have to be elderly to see the flaws with VA/Velocity.

As others have said - VA has some good points, including Economy X, Fly Ahead and Family Pooling. Lower thresholds to earn/retain status is another advantage of Velocity, and as I said previously, if you don't fly enough to get status with QF, then of course that makes VA an attractive option. However, status with VA is worth less than equivalent status with QF. Furthermore, many of us fly enough to have Platinum or higher status with QF despite the higher qualification hurdles, and for anyone in that situation, this is a moot point.

The VA lounges are nice enough, but the food is a joke for the most part (especially in the evenings) - just like their onboard offerings. IMHO, it would be ridiculous to suggest that VA lounges are better than QF Business Lounges by any measure.

Not sure what you mean by easy access to J for overseas work trips - it's fairly easy to travel overseas in J with QF and OW partners.

Overall, it sounds like the VA branding and image appeals to you - which is fair enough - but I think many people who spend a lot of their time travelling care more about service and benefits than branding, image or the age of the airline's staff.

 

[craven morehead]

Last time I was in QC at noon that's when the bar opened at least in Sydney.

Definitely noon in EMD

 

[Deleted member 29185]

I don't think you have to be elderly to see the flaws with VA/Velocity.

Very true. Age has little to do with an airlines performance. When DJ first started flying, Branson believed he needed giggling air-heads as flight crew to appeal to the younger set. That changed as even the early-mid 30ish exec's (of which, I was one at that point), didn't want that and nor did the older flyer. We know what it is that we want and to take an example you gave, the QF business lounge is head and shoulders over VA's tied old salad bar. Every time I try to log into Velocity, I get an error and have to click the back button to get my account page to display. If I have Velocity open and VA, often the VA site doesn't pick up my membership but also won't let me log in, I have to close out of Velocity and reload the VA page to log in! They honestly make it hard to buy a tix! Agree totally that lower status hurdles, YX, fly ahead and family pooling are the type of features that are allowing VA stay flying. Take them away and I'd suggest many would say "Why bother"! VA are also lucky that QF haven't seen the need to match them with those features. If QF offered family pooling for example, I'd struggle to keep an interest in VA. As it stands, when my wife and kids travel with me, we go VA as they gain the same FFer benefits as I and their points and SC's are not always wasted. QF obviously don't need that and therefore any SC's from the family in particular on QF are lost. It's currently working in VA's favour and I'd say if either changed (VA dropping family pooling or QF introducing it) VA would certainly feel the pinch. Pretzels are rubbish, but don't even factor into the decision to fly, but it's certainly not helping VA one iota!

 

[Pleb Status]

Very true. Age has little to do with an airlines performance. When DJ first started flying, Branson believed he needed giggling air-heads as flight crew to appeal to the younger set. That changed as even the early-mid 30ish exec's (of which, I was one at that point), didn't want that and nor did the older flyer. We know what it is that we want and to take an example you gave, the QF business lounge is head and shoulders over VA's tied old salad bar. Every time I try to log into Velocity, I get an error and have to click the back button to get my account page to display. If I have Velocity open and VA, often the VA site doesn't pick up my membership but also won't let me log in, I have to close out of Velocity and reload the VA page to log in! They honestly make it hard to buy a tix! Agree totally that lower status hurdles, YX, fly ahead and family pooling are the type of features that are allowing VA stay flying. Take them away and I'd suggest many would say "Why bother"! VA are also lucky that QF haven't seen the need to match them with those features. If QF offered family pooling for example, I'd struggle to keep an interest in VA. As it stands, when my wife and kids travel with me, we go VA as they gain the same FFer benefits as I and their points and SC's are not always wasted. QF obviously don't need that and therefore any SC's from the family in particular on QF are lost. It's currently working in VA's favour and I'd say if either changed (VA dropping family pooling or QF introducing it) VA would certainly feel the pinch. Pretzels are rubbish, but don't even factor into the decision to fly, but it's certainly not helping VA one iota!

The advantage of a competitive marketplace is if you do not like what is being offered, you do not have to take it.

So move your business elsewhere like the OP has promised to do....

 

[Daver6]

One comparison being made that I think is a little unfair is to compare the VA lounge to the QF J lounge. In reality, it should be compared to the QP. What VA lacks is a J lounge for J pax and WPs.

It is also interesting how some people think the QF crew and airline can be "stuffy". Personally, I find that sometimes the QF staff come across as being a little too familiar. I'd also suggest if people find QF crew to formal/stuff, certainly do NOT fly Etihad, CX or QR in J (and I'd imagine F).

 

[Mattg]

I'm not sure the OP is the target of the program. Don't get me wrong. Qantas is a nice airline but it's really very stuffy. Even the flight crews are older than me. I feel like I'm flying my grandfathers airline. As a 32rd old exec, virgin is mostly pitched towards people like me.

I have no idea what age the OP is, but I'm only a few years older than you, so with all due respect, I don't think you have to be elderly to see the flaws with VA/Velocity.

Interesting comments and I appreciated reading your view points.

I'm afraid I have to disagree with Rigs though. I'm actually younger than you, so I don't think age has much to do with it.

As somebody in their 20s, I agree that the Virgin branding seems appealing. But it doesn't take long to notice when things don't work and/or an airline does not live up to its promises. Virgin's poor catering and flaky airline partnerships may be acceptable to some, but I don't see the point in sticking with Virgin when Qantas does both things so much better.

I also have to disagree about Qantas being "stuffy". I've almost always had excellent service on Qantas, and there are plenty of "younger" flight attendants (although they are more commonly found on QantasLink and international flights staffed by QCCA and/or Jetconnect crew). I've also received plenty of good service on Virgin, however I've also had very disinterested service.

Earlier in the year I flew to Queensland, flying Virgin up and Qantas back. Both flights were in business class. On the Virgin flight I asked what type of wine was available and was told "red or white". On Qantas, by comparison, the FA was able to tell me exactly where each of the wines were from, what flavours they had and which foods they paired well with, without me even asking. Of course, some people may not care what type of wine they're drinking - and that's fine - but I think this summaries quite well my experiences with service on both airlines. I personally appreciate Qantas' attention to detail.

 

[Lemon_Party]

I think you have been unlucky Mattg.

Certainly Y food is dreadful and the snacks are a joke, but in J I've always had a great meal and very good service.

Friday night I used my last complementary upgrade for the year, the service was excellent in a very full cabin, the salmon fillet with thai curry sauce and rice was genuinely fantastic and the flight was very enjoyable. I can't compare this to QF as I've never flown J with them, but in J on VA I've always been very happy.

It almost made me change my previous comments on here - I fly VA as I would struggle to maintain gold QF. I would prefer the oneworld status for international travel, but I've got to be honest, the 4 upgrades are a big positive for me as I travel coast to coast every month or two and I'd miss them for sure if I jumped ship.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

The advantage of a competitive marketplace is if you do not like what is being offered, you do not have to take it.

So move your business elsewhere like the OP has promised to do....

That's too simplistic. The better response is to seek what best suits on the day. We really don't have to over think it!

 

[Pleb Status]

That's too simplistic. The better response is to seek what best suits on the day. We really don't have to over think it!

What is the point of your rant then if you are going to do absolutely nothing about it?

At least the OP has committed to moving all of their business to QF.

 

[serfty]

Ross - are there 2 types?

I have never signed up for the global wallet thing yet they keep sending me the Visa card one.

PLATINUM is vaguely there is some wanky screened off text.

So one can ask for a "standard" Platinum card?

Mine was replaced this year when I lost my wallet and got the VISA card looking version again.

Log onto your velocity account and at the bottom of the "Member Benefits" seaction lok for:

Membership card with Global Wallet® functionality

You should be able to use that to turn it off (i.e. it's an "opt out" function.)

After that, you can either wait for your next renewal or call to have a new card sent.

 

[Rigs]

Some of the comments on this thread are weird. People obviously take their program as a team sport, fainting while clutching their Qantas biscuits. Qantas is an established player, I want virgin to be different and then to pick based on my purpose. Take your business where you like but people will make other decisions.

One comparison being made that I think is a little unfair is to compare the VA lounge to the QF J lounge. In reality, it should be compared to the QP. What VA lacks is a J lounge for J pax and WPs.

For or someone who generally now mostly eats on board upgrading when it's a dinner time flight (with more certainty with VA which is very important to me), the lounge is mostly for a drink before takeoff. Qantas lounges often just look less engaging.

The Qantas J lounges certainly offer more stuff and better food. However, so does the private room in Singapore. My criticism of both is the same, they are dark and stuffy. The Qantas first lounge in international is just a nicer style of decor. They should stick with the more open feel. The biggest offender to me is the J lounge in Canberra which never gets enough light.

 

[Nnlsbin]

I'm a bit confused - are you suggesting that one should fly from Australia to South America via Abu Dhabi?

And what if you want to fly within South America?

Can't you fly with Air New Zealand, from Auckland to Buenos Aires direct? Flying within South America there doesnt seem to be any options, but I could be wrong

 

[Jack_OC]

Some of the comments on this thread are weird. People obviously take their program as a team sport, fainting while clutching their Qantas biscuits. Qantas is an established player, I want virgin to be different and then to pick based on my purpose. Take your business where you like but people will make other decisions.

TBH, I think some of the weirdest comments have come from you - first you incorrectly assumed that anyone who prefers QF must be old, and now you are suggesting that anyone who speaks ill of VA must have some sort of blinkered and unshakeable allegiance to QF.

You seem to have missed the fact that several of us who have criticised VA/Velocity currently hold Velocity Platinum status, so by definition, we have all given VA a fair crack of the whip. In my case, I have no pre-conceived preference for either side - my posts are just reflections of my experience with both. FWIW, I flew almost exclusively with VA and Velocity partners for several years. About a year ago, I decided to give QF another try - for many of the reasons discussed above, coupled with a narrowing of the fare gap. I now hold Platinum status in both programs, and I'll continue to do so for at least the next 15 months. I still fly with VA a bit domestically, and with Velocity partners >50% of the time on my overseas trips.

 

[RooFlyer]

Some of the comments on this thread are weird. <snip>.

Quite. Jack3193 well said.

<snip> Qantas is a nice airline but it's really very stuffy. Even the flight crews are older than me. I feel like I'm flying my grandfathers airline. <snip>

<snip> People obviously take their program as a team sport, fainting while clutching their Qantas biscuits. <snip>The biggest offender to me is the J lounge in Canberra which never gets enough light.

Qantas remains the airline for grownups. Having flown VA on Sunday and seen the J cabin with 3/8 seats occupied by what looked for all the world like bikie gang security enforcers (mohawks and all), I'm content to usually leave the airline to the 'youngsters'.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

What is the point of your rant then if you are going to do absolutely nothing about it?

At least the OP has committed to moving all of their business to QF.

Rant? You and I have a totally different concept of the word. I was simply stating fact. Whether you like that or not is relevant to neither the discussion, nor me. As for the "move your allegiance" quip, well that's the point of my reply to you ... that individually we choose what is right for us at the time. I was comfortably in the VA camp with NB status with QF a very short while ago. I'm now almost QF WP as well as VA WP. Thank you for your ill informed drivel, but I'll continue to do as I said in my reply, that being to choose what is right for me on the day. What you want to do is for you to decide, but obviously the head in the sand approach is working pretty well for you, so I'd suggest you stick with it!

 

[serfty]

[Moderator hat]This thread has undergone some pruning.

Personal attacks are not permitted.

Please abide by the conditions of use of this site.[/Moderator hat]

 

[cove]

Meanwhile we have a set of flights coast to coast on Velocity A330 in J because QF had dust. It is really pretty good to have points in both programs.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

One comparison being made that I think is a little unfair is to compare the VA lounge to the QF J lounge.

That is true for those who can't access the QF J lounges, but for all those that can, it's a very valid and fair comparison.

Qantas is an established player, I want virgin to be different and then to pick based on my purpose.

I think the claim that QF is the established player is stretching it a bit. DJ/VA are fast approaching 20 years in the AU market and have transitioned through a number of incarnations in an attempt to find what the people want in an airline. To be honest, what you state you want is probably what many or possibly even most want as well. Look at the benefits just about everyone applauds VA over ... they are mostly what QF don't do, or don't do well or consistently. DJ had a product that differed totally from QF and was profitable but it was changed dramatically in search of higher profits. It's VA that seem to want to be exactly like QF. We had what you want 6-7 years ago and that was discarded as a model to go forward with, by the management of DJ rather than the flyers.

Having said that, I think there is a niche between QF and JQ/TT but VA are presently failing at that. Their prices are too high, plain and simple. I foresee VA making further change in the coming year or two to better position themselves between QF and JQ but they can't do that whilst pretending to be a full service airline and charging full service fares. I foresee the fares being dropped and options being exploited, which will be marketed with much gloss and fanfare, but will in reality be a return to DJ with a J cabin rather than a W one.