US Dividend Miles - Award Booking Questions and General Discussion

[smit0847]

I think you should ring their US number, they are still pretty clueless over there, you are more likely to get away with what you want

I haven't been able to get through to the US number for the past week. They're not taking any calls.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I would say stopover in non-hub would be easier to get around than MPM. Routing to Shang Hai via HKG is a massive detour! TBH... I'd take JAL. Nice, short, sharp, sweet, simple. And the food is generally pretty good on that flight. They do yummy steaks!

 

[smit0847]

I would say stopover in non-hub would be easier to get around than MPM. Routing to Shang Hai via HKG is a massive detour! TBH... I'd take JAL. Nice, short, sharp, sweet, simple. And the food is generally pretty good on that flight. They do yummy steaks!

Boom! Booked it first call this afternoon after finally getting through to the US call centre. 30 min call - she put me on hold several times but it was all fine.

HND-HKG CX J
HKG-PVG KA J (dest)
PVG-HKG KA J (overnight)
HKG-NRT CX J.

30k pp + $52 tax + $50 fee. No questions about MPM or what was the actual destination.

Finally! Looking forward to never calling USDM again!

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Boom! Booked it first call this afternoon after finally getting through to the US call centre. 30 min call - she put me on hold several times but it was all fine.

HND-HKG CX J
HKG-PVG KA J (dest)
PVG-HKG KA J (overnight)
HKG-NRT CX J.

30k pp + $52 tax + $50 fee. No questions about MPM or what was the actual destination.

Finally! Looking forward to never calling USDM again!

well there you go!!

both into and out of PVG actual, or did you get the KA flight to SHA?

(just for noting if you have a KA A320 flight out of HKG... it may leave from the 500+ gates).

 

[smit0847]

well there you go!!

both into and out of PVG actual, or did you get the KA flight to SHA?

Pvg actual. Is there much difference?!

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Pvg actual. Is there much difference?! 

depends where you need to be. If you're staying/working on the Pudong side, PVG is ok (and has the Maglev).

For the rest of Shanghai, SHA is around 20 minutes, and very cheap, by cab. Plus with SHA you get from curb to lounge in around 10 mins tops (there are only half a dozen flights leaving there for the whole day).

 

[smit0847]

depends where you need to be. If you're staying/working on the Pudong side, PVG is ok (and has the Maglev).

For the rest of Shanghai, SHA is around 20 minutes, and very cheap, by cab. Plus with SHA you get from curb to lounge in around 10 mins tops (there are only half a dozen flights leaving there for the whole day).

You had me freaking out for a minute there!

We're there for leisure and have plenty of time- not fussed about slightly longer travel time.

Edit: just checked and there's only 1 return KA flight into SHA each day anyway and it leaves both cities at the wrong time compared with the high frequency PVG flights.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

You had me freaking out for a minute there!

sorry! no no, it's just like London City airport compared to heathrow (for inconvenience) and Gatwick (for distance).

worth noting as well for anyone else flying to Shanghai - flights to SHA generally arrive on time, whereas PVG is anyone's guess (rolling delays of 1-2 hours are common).

 

[Beta4Me]

A shout out to the Canadian and UK call centres. I always use the Canadian number and either get it or the UK call centre. I have never ever waited on hold and have always been connected straight to someone who seems to have double the competence and efficiency of their US counterparts. Just thought I'd share that!

 

[smit0847]

A shout out to the Canadian and UK call centres. I always use the Canadian number and either get it or the UK call centre. I have never ever waited on hold and have always been connected straight to someone who seems to have double the competence and efficiency of their US counterparts. Just thought I'd share that!

UK call centre seem to be stricter on the rules though and HUACA can go back to the same agent because it's a smaller call centre! !

 

[Beta4Me]

UK call centre seem to be stricter on the rules though and HUACA can go back to the same agent because it's a smaller call centre! !

That's true. Depends on how far you're pushing the envelope. There's no way some of stunts I pulled back at the end of the *A days would've flown with them. Open jaw at original plus destination and two stopovers...mmm those were the days!

 

[rogerkambah]

While the latest offer is not as good asbefore, its a hell of a lot better than the lousy buy points from the likes of Qantas. Also one can buy in both programs and once merger is on will be combined.

I've read some of the blurb on the merger, but can't find the answer to a question, but feel sure someone will know.

I'm expecting that the USDM oneworld award return flights chart will disappear and the AA one way chart will prevail? Does anyone know?

 

[smit0847]

I've read some of the blurb on the merger, but can't find the answer to a question, but feel sure someone will know.

I'm expecting that the USDM oneworld award return flights chart will disappear and the AA one way chart will prevail? Does anyone know?

That is almost certain to happen. The AA routing rules will also apply

 

[appaz]

That's true. Depends on how far you're pushing the envelope. There's no way some of stunts I pulled back at the end of the *A days would've flown with them. Open jaw at original plus destination and two stopovers...mmm those were the days!

Couldn't agree more!

Can you please pass on the Canadian and UK call numbers? I have to change a trip booked for the end of this month and can't get thru to the US one :/

 

[smit0847]

Couldn't agree more!

Can you please pass on the Canadian and UK call numbers? I have to change a trip booked for the end of this month and can't get thru to the US one :/

US Airways Not Answering Your Phone Call? Call Abroad for Better Customer Service | TravelSort

Canadian one routes through to the UK one in my experience.

 

[smit0847]

After my experiences the last few weeks with numerous agents, I'm trying to understand how the role of the supervisor/rates desk works and those with more experience may know more about this.

- The call centre agent looks up the flights and then makes various assessments themselves about whether the itinerary is valid. If they are unsure about anything they can ask the supervisor/rates desk to calify.
- They are supposed to calculate MPM themselves (which they usually do), if they are struggling they can get the supervisor/rates desk to do it for them.
- *Some* agents can calculate taxes themselves but most will go to the rates desk to ask them to calculate. Am I right in saying the rates desk will not assess the validity of the itinerary unless the agent asks them to check something, from as simple as 'does this exceed MPM' to 'can you check if this is all valid?'.

Is the supervisor and the rates desk the same thing? Will the rates desk deny an invalid itinerary if they have only been asked to calculate taxes?

I ask these questions because I've had instances where the agent thinks everything is valid but then the supervisor/rates desk denies the itinerary because they remind the agent of a rule the agent has forgotten. I've also had itineraries that exceed MPM go off to the rates desk and come back fine.

I remember in the *A days agents used to be able to do the whole thing themselves without putting you on hold but nowadays every single agent will put you on hold because the rates desk has to at least calculate the taxes, if not assess various parts of the itinerary based on the request from the agent. Everytime I hear an agent say 'I'll just have to put you on hold for a moment' my heart sinks but actually the longer I'm on hold I think the better my chances get - a 5-10 minute hold is checking validity, a 20 minutes hold may well be calculating the actual taxes because its considered valid.

 

[burmans]

I'm expecting that the USDM oneworld award return flights chart will disappear and the AA one way chart will prevail? Does anyone know?

No-one "knows" apart from AA themselves (and they aren't telling), but this is what is generally predicted.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

After my experiences the last few weeks with numerous agents, I'm trying to understand how the role of the supervisor/rates desk works and those with more experience may know more about this.

- The call centre agent looks up the flights and then makes various assessments themselves about whether the itinerary is valid. If they are unsure about anything they can ask the supervisor/rates desk to calify.
- They are supposed to calculate MPM themselves (which they usually do), if they are struggling they can get the supervisor/rates desk to do it for them.
- *Some* agents can calculate taxes themselves but most will go to the rates desk to ask them to calculate. Am I right in saying the rates desk will not assess the validity of the itinerary unless the agent asks them to check something, from as simple as 'does this exceed MPM' to 'can you check if this is all valid?'.

Is the supervisor and the rates desk the same thing? Will the rates desk deny an invalid itinerary if they have only been asked to calculate taxes?

I ask these questions because I've had instances where the agent thinks everything is valid but then the supervisor/rates desk denies the itinerary because they remind the agent of a rule the agent has forgotten. I've also had itineraries that exceed MPM go off to the rates desk and come back fine.

I remember in the *A days agents used to be able to do the whole thing themselves without putting you on hold but nowadays every single agent will put you on hold because the rates desk has to at least calculate the taxes, if not assess various parts of the itinerary based on the request from the agent. Everytime I hear an agent say 'I'll just have to put you on hold for a moment' my heart sinks but actually the longer I'm on hold I think the better my chances get - a 5-10 minute hold is checking validity, a 20 minutes hold may well be calculating the actual taxes because its considered valid.

From what I can work out, they're three different components... agent, supervisor, rates desk (although maybe the supervisor and rates desk are co-located, or the same staff?)

Agent will take the booking, looking for anything that looks out of place. Sometimes they don't like the look of something, and might quote an invalid rule (for example, a transit can only be 4 hours). If you press, they'll go to the supervisor who will confirm, for example, that for international itineraries a transit can be up to 24 hours. Nothing has passed the rate desk at this stage (but the supervisor is a different, supposedly more experienced operator).

The system should then generate a price and taxes and fees. If the system doesn't auto-generate this, it will go to the rate desk. This seems to happen quite frequently on multi-sector, multi-carrier itineraries.

It seems at least some of the time, the system doesn't auto-price because there is a problem with the itinerary (ie it's invalid). At that stage the rates desk will advise accordingly, and may (or may not), give the correct reason for the rejection. Sometimes the rates desk will assume it's an invalid stopover point when in fact it might be MPM (or vv).

The rate desk (and possibly a supervisor) seem to be able to overrule the system. An agent doesn't seem to have that ability. Being able to overrule the system makes sense because there are cases of irrops and canceled flights where changes might force an itinerary outside the rules.

While a supervisor can overrule an agent on something clearly within the rules (for example, the transit 4 vs 24 hours), if an agent has made a subjective determination on one of the more fluid rules (for example 'routing not the most direct', or 'only 8 segments'), it is not that often that a supervisor or the rates desk will overrule that. And then you possibly end up with notes in the system (best thing to do is cancel the whole thing and start fresh).

 

[smit0847]

From what I can work out, they're three different components... agent, supervisor, rates desk (although maybe the supervisor and rates desk are co-located, or the same staff?)

Agent will take the booking, looking for anything that looks out of place. Sometimes they don't like the look of something, and might quote an invalid rule (for example, a transit can only be 4 hours). If you press, they'll go to the supervisor who will confirm, for example, that for international itineraries a transit can be up to 24 hours. Nothing has passed the rate desk at this stage (but the supervisor is a different, supposedly more experienced operator).

The system should then generate a price and taxes and fees. If the system doesn't auto-generate this, it will go to the rate desk. This seems to happen quite frequently on multi-sector, multi-carrier itineraries.

It seems at least some of the time, the system doesn't auto-price because there is a problem with the itinerary (ie it's invalid). At that stage the rates desk will advise accordingly, and may (or may not), give the correct reason for the rejection. Sometimes the rates desk will assume it's an invalid stopover point when in fact it might be MPM (or vv).

The rate desk (and possibly a supervisor) seem to be able to overrule the system. An agent doesn't seem to have that ability. Being able to overrule the system makes sense because there are cases of irrops and canceled flights where changes might force an itinerary outside the rules.

While a supervisor can overrule an agent on something clearly within the rules (for example, the transit 4 vs 24 hours), if an agent has made a subjective determination on one of the more fluid rules (for example 'routing not the most direct', or 'only 8 segments'), it is not that often that a supervisor or the rates desk will overrule that. And then you possibly end up with notes in the system (best thing to do is cancel the whole thing and start fresh).

Thanks MEL.

I’m interested in trying to work out if a supervisor checks anything, do they check everything? Ie if the agent asks the supervisor to check MPM do they also check valid stopover etc? It seems a bit crazy for someone competent to check one thing but not another. Im convinced the supervisors do (at least occasionally) check/discover one thing when just asked to check something else because I’ve had a number of agents say to me ‘I asked my supervisor to check it was within MPM but they’ve told me your stopover is not in a hub city’.

I *think* ive had itineraries recently go to the rates desk without going to a supervisor but I agree these are sometimes one and the same person.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Thanks MEL.

I’m interested in trying to work out if a supervisor checks anything, do they check everything? Ie if the agent asks the supervisor to check MPM do they also check valid stopover etc? It seems a bit crazy for someone competent to check one thing but not another. Im convinced the supervisors do (at least occasionally) check/discover one thing when just asked to check something else because I’ve had a number of agents say to me ‘I asked my supervisor to check it was within MPM but they’ve told me your stopover is not in a hub city’.

I *think* ive had itineraries recently go to the rates desk without going to a supervisor but I agree these are sometimes one and the same person.

supervisor is not a requirement. 99% of my calls are settled either by the agent or by the rates desk.

I suspect what might happen is if the system auto-rejects, the agent may go to a supervisor for assistance to see why if they can't work it out for themselves. Supervisor then comes back with (a) and (b) and (c).

Agents (and supervisors/rate desk) often come back with the right answer (invalid itinerary), but the wrong reason. That's why places such as AFF are useful in trying to work out the correct things that need to be changed to make an itinerary work... otherwise if you fixed what USDM tells you, you might still have an invalid itinerary.