USA doesn't use 24 hour clock ?

[Franky]

And as we've got the time, is midnight the end of the day (before) or the beginning of the day (after). I always thought it was the end of the day, until a telco expired my ph plan the (midnight) before. Writing 24:00 or 00:00 would be clearer to me.

In the Navy it was 2359, followed by 0001... We had no such time as 2400.

 

[NM]

Why am I feeling so chronologically challenged right now?

 

[AIRwin]

Why am I feeling so chronologically challenged right now?

Time for a drink...

 

[Forg]

In the Navy it was 2359, followed by 0001... We had no such time as 2400.

Do you mean followed by 0000?
Or do they really drop a minute per day?

One of the more annoying issues I had to troubleshoot a few years back was a customer whose fuel-data vendor was sending them files which had a mix of 0000 and 2400 in it … erk!

 

[SYD]

Do you mean followed by 0000?
Or do they really drop a minute per day?

No. There are seconds in there. Just not shown in the example.

 

[Forg]

No. There are seconds in there. Just not shown in the example.

What do they do for the 60 seconds between 23:59:59.999 and 00:01:00.000?
I’m not being facetious (I was when I assumed it’d been a typo ), I’m just not getting it.

 

[justinbrett]

How can you even have 'pm' in your morning (12 pm) or 'am' in the evening (12 am)???

Because am literally means before noon, and pm means after. It doesn't meaning morning and night. I'm not sure why some non-English countries use 12pm to mean midnight and 12am to mean noon particularly as many of them are a lot closer to Latin than English!

Makes a lot more sense if you swap 12 for 0, which it effectively is. English didn't use zero until around 1600.

In the Navy it was 2359, followed by 0001... We had no such time as 2400.

There's definitely no such time as 2400. It's 0000.

It's an old school thing in Navy to be afraid of 0000. It's in common use in Air Force and it really grinds the Navy's gears. From my understanding it's because of antiquated computer systems that wouldn't accept 0000, it had to have a value > 0. Occasionally you'll see a Flight Plan or NOTAM using 0001 and you just know it's an oldie who filed it. Certainly no requirement to use it in modern aviation systems.

 

[Forg]

There's definitely no such time as 2400. It's 0000.

I’d have to look it up to find further details, but from a formatting POV there as a format used in general coding/data-transfer parlance which recognises 2400 but not 0000. I might think it’s nonsensical, but it is a Thing.

 

[tdimdad]

I'm not sure why some non-English countries use 12pm to mean midnight and 12am to mean noon particularly as many of them are a lot closer to Latin than English!

This is getting interesting now! Without knowing anything about linguistics, I'd hazard a guess that it's actually simply derived from English. Natively, the local languages might refer to 24 hours or another way of marking time. The few languages I studied happened to all be fluent with the 24-hour clock but I'd be interested to hear how this is handled in some of larger languages, e.g. Mandarin, Arabic, etc.

 

[justinbrett]

I’d have to look it up to find further details, but from a formatting POV there as a format used in general coding/data-transfer parlance which recognises 2400 but not 0000. I might think it’s nonsensical, but it is a Thing.

Hence reference to antiquated systems above. From a UI perspective, no modern aviation system I know of does this. And I've used a lot.

I'm sure older ones did this as a hack due to limits in computing at the time.

Often it's prefixed with 2-6 digits of the date, so you might have 060000 for midnight on the 6th.

This is getting interesting now! Without knowing anything about linguistics, I'd hazard a guess that it's actually simply derived from English. Natively, the local languages might refer to 24 hours or another way of marking time. The few languages I studies happened to all be fluent with the 24-hour clock but I'd be interested to hear how this is handled in some of larger languages, e.g. Mandarin, Arabic, etc.

am is Latin for ante meridiem (before noon) and pm for post meridiem (after).

Maybe the continentals assumed am/pm was an English term for morning and night, not realising it was Latin and the subtle difference in meaning.

 

[Franky]

Time for a drink...

Agree - it must 1700 somewhere in the world right now…

 

[justinbrett]

What do they do for the 60 seconds between 23:59:59.999 and 00:01:00.000?
I’m not being facetious (I was when I assumed it’d been a typo ), I’m just not getting it.

I'm not sure @Franky meant there was literally no such time as precisely mightnight.

More that they would avoid scheduling anything to start/end at that time, or recording a time as that - using 2359 or 0001 instead.

 

[Franky]

Because am literally means before noon, and pm means after. It doesn't meaning morning and night. I'm not sure why some non-English countries use 12pm to mean midnight and 12am to mean noon particularly as many of them are a lot closer to Latin than English!

Makes a lot more sense if you swap 12 for 0, which it effectively is. English didn't use zero until around 1600.



There's definitely no such time as 2400. It's 0000.

It's an old school thing in Navy to be afraid of 0000. It's in common use in Air Force and it really grinds the Navy's gears. From my understanding it's because of antiquated computer systems that wouldn't accept 0000, it had to have a value > 0. Occasionally you'll see a Flight Plan or NOTAM using 0001 and you just know it's an oldie who filed it. Certainly no requirement to use it in modern aviation systems.

Navy is the Senior Service, and therefore has the call. I joined up when I was 15 and we just accepted that this was the way it was…. The RAAFy chappys are always out of step with both the Navy and the Army. As an aside, to my wife’s eternal chagrin, the Naval clock in my study chimes the bells from 1 chime at half past the hour, then 2 chimes for the next hour up to 8 chimes at 0800, 1200, 1600, 2000, 2359 and so on…

 

[NM]

Time for a drink...

What time would that be, again?

 

[AIRwin]

What time would that be, again?

Time after time

 

[Franky]

I’d have to look it up to find further details, but from a formatting POV there as a format used in general coding/data-transfer parlance which recognises 2400 but not 0000. I might think it’s nonsensical, but it is a Thing.

Agree, but in the days of sail when King Arthur formed the Royal Navy in the 1600s, they didn't have computers, usually only two people on the ships could afford or needed a watch, and they were the Captain, and the Navigator. As the sailors needed to know when there was a change of watch, the duty sailor on the quarterdeck would ring the ship’s bell every half hour, beginning at say 0830 with one ring, followed by 2 rings at 0900 and so on up to 8 at 1200. All watches were 4 hourly. And as there was no broadcast system, and some ships such as HMS Victory had 7 decks, the ship’s bell and the Bosun’s Pipe(or whistle) governed the daily routine of the ship.

 

[justinbrett]

Navy is the Senior Service, and therefore has the call. I joined up when I was 15 and we just accepted that this was the way it was…. The RAAFy chappys are always out of step with both the Navy and the Army. As an aside, to my wife’s eternal chagrin, the Naval clock in my study chimes the bells from 1 chime at half past the hour, then 2 chimes for the next hour up to 8 chimes at 0800, 1200, 1600, 2000, 2359 and so on…

There's an old saying - Air Force moves at 600KT, Navy moves at 6KT.

In all seriousness, 2359/0001 doesn't work for Air Force as things need to be precise. You can get away with fudging the numbers when things work in slow time.

However I'm fairly certain modern Navy is now using 0000.

 

[Captain Halliday]

No matter your country of origin or language spoken, surely half two is one?

 

[Hvr]

Why am I feeling so chronologically challenged right now?

Because, as Bob said; The times, they are a-changin'.

 

[Brissy1]

Time for a drink...

So I had that drink and pondered 2359/0001.
If you're having an evening walk, intially very slowly where your next step is ½ the remaining time to midnight (a step at 10pm, then 11pm, then at 11:30 etc) before it gets to midnight it you would have walked to the end of the universe.
Time for bed.