VA Cancellations, Delays growing?

[lovestotravel]

Just wait until QF move pilots and crew from 737 to A320 contracts

 

[papeto]

We're talking about cabin crew here, that's the current dispute. Your getting mixed up with your pilots cut.

Pilots issue to follow.
Care to share your pilots got 20% pay cut link?
Thanks in advance.

Here is an article on cabin crew cuts. From $60k a year to $48k a year.

https://www.airlineratings.com/news/virgin-australia-cabin-crew-salary-conditions-slashed/

 

[papeto]

My initial response was based on discussions with people in the industray ( I don’t work in aviation for the record), but these articles confirm what they have said.

 

[twinaisle]

Apparently the cabin crew who only do day trips only earn 50/55k. For a 24/7 roster that isn’t great.

If you go back 10-15 years, they will find the number has barely moved. I can understand the frustration. That sort of wage is just pocket money in 2023.

Virgin still has Pilots to deal with also.

Around 48k base.

Crew don't get overtime until they go over 12 hours.
Crew do not get penalty rates
Crew do not get paid public holiday rates

The incentives are purely to stop crew from taking PIA. The offered the same last year as crew didn't turn up to work and it still resulted in crew not turning up for work.

Crew get $65 per overnight and its usually around 12 hours rest in some ports.

Post automatically merged: Dec 4, 2023

So, 12 hour shifts and 40 hour week equals about three days working a week. $450 a week or $1800 for the whole of december, before tax. Worth it? probably not in the long run

I did 57 hours in 6 days last week.

 

[kyle]

If pay is low, then enough ppl leave and they have to increase the pay. Or ppl are staying with an expectation that they should be paid better? Everyone has an opinion on how much a job is worth. Ppl with kids might think child care workers should be paid more, but maybe childless couples think otherwise, just as an example. It's a free labour market after all.

 

[TheInsider]

Around 48k base.

C'mon $48k is more than enough

Post automatically merged: Dec 4, 2023

If pay is low, then enough ppl leave and they have to increase the pay. Or ppl are staying with an expectation that they should be paid better? Everyone has an opinion on how much a job is worth. Ppl with kids might think child care workers should be paid more, but maybe childless couples think otherwise, just as an example. It's a free labour market after all.

In theory you may think it works like that, in reality it doesn't.
Its not that simple to just drop a job and get a new one.

 

[justinbrett]

Also worth noting that the last three years of CPI (Sep 20 - Sep 23) equals 15.0%, so even a 30% increase is only 15% in real terms.

 

[lovestotravel]

If pay is low, then enough ppl leave and they have to increase the pay. Or ppl are staying with an expectation that they should be paid better? Everyone has an opinion on how much a job is worth. Ppl with kids might think child care workers should be paid more, but maybe childless couples think otherwise, just as an example. It's a free labour market after all.

Where I work we had a group of staff that were constantly leaving and citing "pay" as their main reason for leaving.

This meant HR went on a review period and compared what other companies in similar roles were offering.

6 months later a 25% pay increase for all current staff in this group and any new staff joining

Since the pay increase, no-one has left and it's been 12 months.

 

[kyle]

Where I work we had a group of staff that were constantly leaving and citing "pay" as their main reason for leaving.

This meant HR went on a review period and compared what other companies in similar roles were offering.

6 months later a 25% pay increase for all current staff in this group and any new staff joining

Since the pay increase, no-one has left and it's been 12 months.

So it's economics at play. But I'm just making the point that ppl go into a job with full knowledge of how much they get paid.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

What’s the base at Qantas and Rex?

 

[twinaisle]

If pay is low, then enough ppl leave and they have to increase the pay. Or ppl are staying with an expectation that they should be paid better? Everyone has an opinion on how much a job is worth. Ppl with kids might think child care workers should be paid more, but maybe childless couples think otherwise, just as an example. It's a free labour market after all.

There's a whole chunk of ex VA crew who have left for QF already. Most crew are holding out to see what the negotiations will bring and if it doesn't cut it then another whole chunk of crew will leave.

They keep recruiting but cannot maintain or keep crew as the conditions aren't ideal after they fly for under one month.

 

[kyle]

C'mon $48k is more than enough

Post automatically merged: Dec 4, 2023

In theory you may think it works like that, in reality it doesn't.
Its not that simple to just drop a job and get a new one.

Yes I realise that, but whose problem is it?

 

[twinaisle]

What’s the base at Qantas and Rex?

QF base pay for international is $50,700.
Allowances boost a lot of their $ up.
Allowances for a DFW trip can be around over 1K

 

[TheInsider]

What’s the base at Qantas and Rex?

https://www.australianunions.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2023/06/ANAPR_QANTAS_v7.pdf

 

[lovestotravel]

So it's economics at play. But I'm just making the point that ppl go into a job with full knowledge of how much they get paid.

I think for aviation, lots go in with blinkers on, blinding by shiny planes, the joy of travel and fun overnighters.

A pay cycle or two wakes them up to reality

But I agree, if you don't like the pay, don't take the job or leave, which is what is happening at VA now.

Sadly, means I'm booking a few QF flights as I can't trust VA to get me there

 

[TheInsider]

Yes I realise that, but whose problem is it?

Ultimately yours and the business, because there would be industrial action being taken.

 

[MooTime]

The pilots article claiming 20% pay cut comes with reduced hours so let's be fair and state what the articles states.
17% cut with basically 17% reduced hours. Leaving out key info, hmm.

Other article from 2020, very different times.

To say VA base is 48k and QF is 50$ is hardly a carrot. Now what other perks or allowances is an unknown.

Eg the DFW example bring upto 1k, international compared to domestic is apples to oranges, if one wants long haul international travel, why be employed by VA?

Note; I'm all for a genuine decent payrise to VA, we want / need 2 equal in pay Airlines in this beautiful country.

 

[kyle]

Note; I'm all for a genuine decent payrise to VA, we want / need 2 equal in pay Airlines in this beautiful country.

Umm... is that like cartel behaviour?

 

[Saab34]

24hr stoppages will essentially wipe the airlines profit for the half if goes ahead. Now this is the 6 month period Bain will be basing its IPO off, so you would assume a deal would come together.

Next month is a different story however, outside of the IPO audit half.

Bonza is advertising for crew, $52k base, $18 per flight hour, so you will hit mid 60s.

 

[ben95]

Umm... is that like cartel behaviour?

Not if it’s market force driving it to that equilibrium. It would be cartel behaviour if VA and QF secretly agree they would pay X amount.