Virgin Australia and Air NZ to Form New Partnership

Probably, "flying" forward, VA (and new owners of VA) will not do this, as its cheaper to code share with AirNZ, and share costs between the 2, ie, between VA & AirNZ.
Bonza in a hiatus, or death now, would also be a lesson to VA, and its previous flights to HKG on large planes would also have taught them a lesson, about not getting too ambitous.
Mid range carrier and all that jazz.
Without having to pay flight crew expenses (pilots and inflight crew flying rates of pay, cleaning, or paying for more slots, etc), or buy more planes, or put their current planes on the flight route rotation to NZ.
They now also do not have any lounges of their own in the int terminals either, except ADL maybe quasi int and dom.
AirNZ from this will also pay less expenses, and the difference VAi will pay them, will save them (VAi) having to pay for unnecessary non core activities.
AirNZ will also gain, as the VA & AirNZ agreement, does not extend to say, AKL - US/Canada, so if a VAi flier wants to go to NZ then US/Canada, the flier has to be a member of Airpoint $.
No lounge expenses for the VAi sector, also means they (VA) saves $, just have to pay AirNZ for the VAi pax on the AirNZ planes, / loose a bit or revenue
AirNZ will also have a say, as to which of their flights will carry the VAi flight #.
To sum up, AirNZ will probably gain more from this than VAi will.
Not an even playing field, its skewed towards AirNZ.
---
Not forgetting that QF also is crooked, in that they JQ NZ dom flights flying around NZ, where as VA doesnt.
QF now linking AirNZ flights into QFi to dom booking in NZ, not only with JQ NZ d which they own, but also can put pax onto AirNZ turbo prop small planes.
 
Probably, "flying" forward, VA (and new owners of VA) will not do this, as its cheaper to code share with AirNZ, and share costs between the 2, ie, between VA & AirNZ.

This isn't a "shared costs" agreement like the old NZ/VA JV of 2010-2018. This is a unilateral agreement where NZ carries 100% of the costs, and VA buys seats on the NZ services and "resells" them as a "authorised reseller" for NZ. This is a even lower risk for VA as opposed to the old shared costs JV where VA had still lost money on the former agreement.

Bonza in a hiatus, or death now, would also be a lesson to VA, and its previous flights to HKG on large planes would also have taught them a lesson, about not getting too ambitous.
Mid range carrier and all that jazz.
Without having to pay flight crew expenses (pilots and inflight crew flying rates of pay, cleaning, or paying for more slots, etc), or buy more planes, or put their current planes on the flight route rotation to NZ.
They now also do not have any lounges of their own in the int terminals either, except ADL maybe quasi int and dom.

As you were told 1000+ times, VA had NEVER operated any lounges in any International Terminals in Australia. They were ALL contract lounges where VA had an agreement with the contractor to put their name as one of their main tenants.

AirNZ from this will also pay less expenses, and the difference VAi will pay them, will save them (VAi) having to pay for unnecessary non core activities.
AirNZ will also gain, as the VA & AirNZ agreement, does not extend to say, AKL - US/Canada, so if a VAi flier wants to go to NZ then US/Canada, the flier has to be a member of Airpoint $.
No lounge expenses for the VAi sector, also means they (VA) saves $, just have to pay AirNZ for the VAi pax on the AirNZ planes, / loose a bit or revenue

NZ will be getting codeshare revenue/commission from VA at most for the unilateral agreement. As stated above, NZ are carrying 100% of the operating costs of operating the Trans-Tasman services.

There is no need for VA to extend the unilateral agreement or any future expanded agreement beyond AKL to USA/Canada when they have a larger partnership with UA/AC from mainland Australia.
Plus as argued on another thread, any VA travellers going through NZ to North America are likely to be low yielding/budget/VFR, which would not help NZ's bottom line on their own long haul services if the plane is filled with VA's low yield/budget/VFR in addition to NZ's own low yield passengers.
 
Wouldn't this be a disincentive for VA to launch these routes (not that I think they're considering launching anything other than ZQN at this time).
Not necessarily as you've mentioned exactly:
it depends how much value VA derives from these NZ codeshares
And the ACCC has addressed that point specifically in 4.66 (emphasis mine)
The ACCC also notes interested party concerns that the Proposed Conduct mayreduce Virgin Australia’s incentive to enter new trans-Tasman routes. The ACCC has carefully considered confidential information provided by the Applicants comparing therevenue and margins Virgin Australia expects to earn under the Proposed Conduct from reselling Air New Zealand trans-Tasman services to the revenue and margins itcurrently earns across its current network operations. The ACCC is satisfied that theProposed Conduct would not be likely to materially reduce Virgin Australia’s incentiveto enter new trans-Tasman routes to compete with Air New Zealand during the periodfor which authorisation is sought.
The ACCC took a look at VA's book, decided the margin VA gets from reselling NZ tickets would be substantially less than if it were to operate its own metal on this route in a commercially sustainable way. It would be a no brainer for VA to ditch the codeshare and operate its own flight if VA is able to make money on a particular route.

This codeshare will be pretty marginal for revenue in terms of ticket sales for VA, you'd expect the margin to be pretty similar to that of a travel agent. The win here is mostly on FFP benefits and when it comes to NZ VA had a significant disadvantage compared to QF which this agreement addresses.
 
As you were told 1000+ times, VA had NEVER operated any lounges in any International Terminals in Australia. They were ALL contract lounges where VA had an agreement with the contractor to put their name as one of their main tenants.
Ah, I see, when I used the BNE lounge, the girls that did the works, ie, top up coffee dispenser, etc (this was pre covid), had the khaki skirt, which I thought was VAs uniform at one time, before they went to red.
 
Declaring OT (but related) and didn’t want to start whole new thread for something hopefully simple to answer.

If you have a domestic NZ flight booked on QF code and it’s a Q300, is it possible to select a seat? QF.com refers to NZ to do it but NZ doesn’t accept the QF PNR?
 
If you have a domestic NZ flight booked on QF code and it’s a Q300, is it possible to select a seat? QF.com refers to NZ to do it but NZ doesn’t accept the QF PNR?
Air New Zealand has their own PNRs that all end in H. You even if you have the Air NZ PNR it’s not possible to manage codeshare flights online and require a phone call. They should be able to add a seat via the contact centre (they can lookup details without the NZ PNR just require name/flight details/contact info).

You do raise an interesting point, during the NZ/VA partnership seat selection on NZ operated but VA marketed was possible on the Air NZ website but not the other way around. Hopefully if this launches then seat select is possible and it’d be icing on top if VA Gold/Plat got HVC seating on Air NZ.
 
It'll be a while off (if ever) if the VA to NZ 'one way' partnership expands beyond that to a two-way codeshare before any IPO. Thus the "reselling NZ tickets (under the VA code) as an authorised travel agent" announcement, which is the lowest risk partnership that is above a simple interline.

VA's Current owners aren't willing to put their CapEx/Costs into proper JVs (let alone Alliance memberships) before any IPO. Preferring to leave those problems to whoever the post IPO shareholder(s)/Trade Sale 'cornerstone' shareholder(s), whenever that may be.
 
The feedback period for the initial tentative approval has now elapsed. Does anyone know how long until there's official approval and the actual ability to buy a VA-coded NZ transTasman flight?
 
Australia's highest-earning Velocity Frequent Flyer credit card: Offer expires: 21 Jan 2025
- Earn 60,000 bonus Velocity Points
- Get unlimited Virgin Australia Lounge access
- Enjoy a complimentary return Virgin Australia domestic flight each year

AFF Supporters can remove this and all advertisements

The claim by Virgin Australia that its previous operation of trans-Tasman services was economically unviable does not provide justification to exclude re-entering the market in the future.
Canberra airport submission - I was surprised to see this. Did they not read ACCC’s draft determinations carefully? CBR is just restating things they’ve already said without responding to ACCC’s reason in allowing a 5 year authorization period.

Jumpjet airlines limited - what is this? Are we running fantasy airlines now?
The definition of a Cartel is:
I don’t think the ACCC needs some fantasy airlines CEO lecturing them what’s the legal definition of cartel.
 

Seems like another Avatar Airlines or Global Airlines.

Also, as funny as all of that sounds, that "company" makes a very legitimate point regarding Virgin Australia in their application.
Screenshot 2024-05-11 at 2.38.38 PM.png

They are absolutely right here. Virgin Australia is not an Australian airline, despite a decent portion of our population thinking that it is. They are American. It's why they shouldn't be treated equally with our Australian-owned national carrier. There is only one Australian airline group in Australia.
 
Last edited:
They are American. It's why they shouldn't be treated equally with our Australian-owned national carrier
The ACCC doesn’t care though. Feel free to write to the transport minister Katherine King or her New Zealand counterparts if you think Australia’s airlines shouldn’t be owned by foreigners but this is absolutely not within ACCC’s jurisdiction. The way this is raised is amateur or unprofessional to say the least.

I’m sure you’d love for more (foreign owned) airlines to go bust in Australia, Qantas (our benevolent national carrier) would be very happy indeed. I mean why not, who wouldn’t trust our national treasure the flying kangaroo.
 
Jumpjet airlines limited - what is this? Are we running fantasy airlines now?
Look to be
JUMPJET HOME

The Home page contains planning information in relation to the Jumpjet Business Model and future operations of the airline. Also overviews the work of Company Consultants and interested parties.

Portfolio
The Portfolio adds tourist venues to visit at your destinations, pay them a visit to view the interesting attractions offered. Featured attractions also appear on the Home page.

FAQ
Want more info on Jumjet? Go to the Frequently Asked Questions page? You can also make further inquiry by going to the Contact page, complete the form and submit to admin.
--------------
Jumpjet Airlines Trans Tasman
Proposed Airline Services
Value Based
Scheduled Passenger
International
Major Airports
Regional Employment
Regional Ownership

Business Hours – Head Office
Mon – Fri: 0900 – 1700
Saturday: 0900 – 1200
Sunday: Closed
# Zoom: Available
# Questions: Contact Us

Info
Phone: (+644) 586 0900
Email: Please Ask
P O Box 30031, Lower Hutt
New Zealand 5040
 
Must be the same mob(s) running the infamous Baltia/USGlobal and Family/Avatar airline outfits.
 
Jumpjet airlines limited - what is this? Are we running fantasy airlines now?
This is good comedy, according to their website they started as an idea in 1999...


I'm no airline business expert but I didn't think it took 25 years to try and launch an airline.

Edit: Oh wow!

There is a pin on google maps which appears to be someones house:

They opposed a QF/NZ merger in 2002:

Tried to get costs from Wellington airport in 2018 when the runway extension was being discussed:

The ACCC better take their submission seriously because I didn't realise we are dealing with professional here 😂
 
Last edited:
This is good comedy, according to their website they started as an idea in 1999...


I'm no airline business expert but I didn't think it took 25 years to try and launch an airline.

Edit: Oh wow!

There is a pin on google maps which appears to be someones house:

They opposed a QF/NZ merger in 2002:

Tried to get costs from Wellington airport in 2018 when the runway extension was being discussed:

The ACCC better take their submission seriously because I didn't realise we are dealing with professional here 😂
The website looks like it was written by AI. Have they really Been around 20+ years?
 
I'm no airline business expert but I didn't think it took 25 years to try and launch an airline.

Edit: Oh wow!

There is a pin on google maps which appears to be someones house:
That's 10 years later than Baltia Airlines (aka USGlobal). They started in 1989 with the aspirations of flying NY-JFK to St Petersburg in Russia. Since then they've failed a few certification tests and had issues raising financing over the years.

 

Become an AFF member!

Join Australian Frequent Flyer (AFF) for free and unlock insider tips, exclusive deals, and global meetups with 65,000+ frequent flyers.

AFF members can also access our Frequent Flyer Training courses, and upgrade to Fast-track your way to expert traveller status and unlock even more exclusive discounts!

AFF forum abbreviations

Wondering about Y, J or any of the other abbreviations used on our forum?

Check out our guide to common AFF acronyms & abbreviations.
Back
Top