Virgin Business Class Lottery - Pay for Business, get Premium Economy! Now 0 for 2.

[addyoni]

Re: Virgin Business Class Lottery - now 0 for 2. Pay for Business, get Premium Econom

View attachment 5682

Is that screencap from Virgin website or another? Have wanted to see a website where all the aircraft types of each flight & days flying are listed plainly on one page. I think FlightStats.com has that info.

Used to have a 5" wide 1.5" thick Timetable book from Emirates that I got from this luggage office thingy in Dubai airport. I say 'used' to as my sister took it! She didn't get me a replacement one. I remember some airlines have electronic ones you can download. Think Qantas has one.

Off-topic I know. Just thought I'd ask 'cos you post a lot and seem to know heaps.

 

[markis10]

It's the timetable from the DJ website.

 

[jaspon]

Re: Virgin Business Class Lottery - now 0 for 2. Pay for Business, get Premium Econom

Each of the three times I have been ripped off with this scam its been on the SYD to ADL legs, twice on DJ402. Its interesting to read the comments about there only being 2 737-700's in the fleet with the old fitout I have been told as well by 2 different Dj Staff. Is that correct? I thought I read there were still about 12 or 15 of these things still in the fleet.

TC

As August 2012, with 700's only VBU, VBV, VBY, VBZ will remain in the fleet, and these will have the full Business seats by June 2012

 

[MichaelD]

Re: Virgin Business Class Lottery - now 0 for 2. Pay for Business, get Premium Econom

...full Business seats by June 2012

So after June 2012 I can buy a business seat and ACTUALLY get what I paid for? (E190s excepted).

 

[markis10]

The E190s are being refitted from Feb, why exclude them?

 

[haydensydney]

Re: Virgin Business Class Lottery - now 0 for 2. Pay for Business, get Premium Econom

It seems like everyones blood pressure is rising quickly on this issue.

Most of us know there is a chance we could still get a rogue aircraft, yet you still bought the full J tickets? I won't be buying full fare J tickets until I know that every flight has proper J, but until then - I will do Points+Pay which lessens the disappointment if I do get a rogue aircraft.

All this banter about ACCC, Misleading Conduct... what a crock. Like muppet said, where is the chorus of rage against Qantas and it's 734 substitutions?

Get over it.

 

[Fruitcake]

Re: Virgin Business Class Lottery - now 0 for 2. Pay for Business, get Premium Econom

I agree - the E190 business class hard product is exactly as described on the website. Two leather seats per pax, with no mention being made of a cabin divider. If you don't perceive that as being of equal value to the 737-800 product, then don't pay the same price for it. I won't be.

Of course, the situation muddies in the case of aircraft subs, 'rogue' non-refurbs, and missed connections which put a happy 737 J pax onto an E190. For those who have broader J flying experience than me, what do other airlines do in this situation? ie if QF subs a 734 for a 767, or one of the international carriers subs a 'regional' J product for a 'long-haul' J product, what compensation is offered? Is it an 'automatic' process or dependent upon the airline's complaints procedure?

 

[dfcatch]

Again - to me at least, the issue is that the "non-business" product shouldn't be advertised and sold as "business".

It' a premium economy product and should be advertised and sold explicitly as such.

Subs happen, missed connections happen, but VA can control the way they advertise and sell the product.

 

[MichaelD]

Re: Virgin Business Class Lottery - now 0 for 2. Pay for Business, get Premium Econom

Most of us know there is a chance we could still get a rogue aircraft, yet you still bought the full J tickets?

I was completely unaware that despite Virgin now selling full Business tickets that they are not actually capable of consistently delivering the product.

When I forcibly was made aware of this, I looked into it much further and discovered quite a widespread and systematic problem.

I also discovered that Virgin have a history of doing this (having done the same with their Premium Economy product).

What riles me the most was that having been made aware of this, and making it abundantly clear to Virgin that I would not accept a PE product they then misinformed me THREE times, including on check-in, that I was getting a proper J product.

I won't be buying full fare J tickets until I know that every flight has proper J, but until then - I will do Points+Pay which lessens the disappointment if I do get a rogue aircraft.

Good for you. Virgin have certainly lost my paid J business for now as well. Pay for something and then *hope* you get it? That's nonsense.

where is the chorus of rage against Qantas and it's 734 substitutions?

Something else I am unaware of and will now need to look into. I have never paid for J on Qantas and got anything other than proper J.

One thing I will say about Qantas is that I have found that compensation and damage control is by-and-large proactive, instead of "if we feel like it, we'll get back to you in 21 days".

 

[lovestotravel]

It seems like everyones blood pressure is rising quickly on this issue.

Most of us know there is a chance we could still get a rogue aircraft, yet you still bought the full J tickets? I won't be buying full fare J tickets until I know that every flight has proper J, but until then - I will do Points+Pay which lessens the disappointment if I do get a rogue aircraft.

All this banter about ACCC, Misleading Conduct... what a crock. Like muppet said, where is the chorus of rage against Qantas and it's 734 substitutions?

Get over it.

Nothing to do with a crock, it's Virgin advertising a product that they fully know they can NOT fully deliver!

Qantas is quite clear is what they offer, and it's a very very small chance of an aircraft substitution! and NOT selling J when they fully know they can NOT deliver it

Again, IF, I end up on a non-refitted 737, I expect a 50% refund, or a large number of VFF points OR I would be making a complaint to the ACCC and consumer affairs!

One thing I will say about Qantas is that I have found that compensation and damage control is by-and-large proactive, instead of "if we feel like it, we'll get back to you in 21 days".

Indeed - I have found on several occasions a "gift" waiting for me when I get home from my trip when something goes wrong on Qantas.

Usually it's been the form of a very generous gift voucher for future travel which is much appreciated

 

[haydensydney]

Re: Virgin Business Class Lottery - now 0 for 2. Pay for Business, get Premium Econom

I remain inunspired by your retort but I wish you both well in your endeavours.

PS... I would both hate to see both of you surivive in the intra-European business class market where the seats are plain and simple economy seats - yes, just like VA's rogue Y+

 

[VOZZY]

Re: Virgin Business Class Lottery - now 0 for 2. Pay for Business, get Premium Econom

You know what really gets be abou VA's conduct here is also the lack of upfront honesty. There is no asterix or fine print in the ads which says 800 series only, There is an indication when booking flights under 2 weeks out as to whether you will get a 700 or 800 series airfraft but nowhere do they explain the two are different. If you look at the cabin classes section of their website the language doesn't even hint at 2 layouts.

Joe public has no chance against this passenger trap.

See link below

Virgin Australia's Business Class | Virgin Australia

TC

 

[mannej]

PS... I would both hate to see both of you surivive in the intra-European business class market where the seats are plain and simple economy seats - yes, just like VA's rogue Y+

How is that relevant to this?

 

[eastwest101]

Re: Virgin Business Class Lottery - now 0 for 2. Pay for Business, get Premium Econom

How is that relevant to this?

I think what haydensydney was trying to say was that its quite common to get PE type seating sold as J class in Europe. For research I just looked at Lufthansa flights Frankfurt to Madrid (about 2:45hr flight) on their A321 in Feb for abound EUR740 one-way. Its PE style with the middle seat blocked or convertable like VA PE configuration. Having said that - it is clear from the seatmaps and flight details on the LH web site that this is in fact what you are getting.

Who pays that sort of money anyway? As uncompetative as that product is - at least it seem to be more consistently advertised and delivered.....

 

[simongr]

Re: Virgin Business Class Lottery - now 0 for 2. Pay for Business, get Premium Econom

All this banter about ACCC, Misleading Conduct... what a crock. Like muppet said, where is the chorus of rage against Qantas and it's 734 substitutions?

Get over it.

There are frequent posts about the poor quality of the 734s. I would have to say though that I have never had a 734 subbed for a 763 or 738 SYD-MEL-SYD.

 

[MichaelD]

Re: Virgin Business Class Lottery - now 0 for 2. Pay for Business, get Premium Econom

I think what haydensydney was trying to say was that its quite common to get PE type seating sold as J class in Europe. Having said that - it is clear from the seatmaps and flight details on the LH web site that this is in fact what you are getting.

The key here is that it is clear what you are actually getting, allowing an informed choice.

I have flown "J" on JAL fully informed that it was a PE type seat. In JAL's case, the extra cost was trivial for 4 x the status credits and a little bit more room, so I was very happy to pay this and very happy with the product.

 

[haydensydney]

Re: Virgin Business Class Lottery - now 0 for 2. Pay for Business, get Premium Econom

Apologies - I wasn't trying to be condescending (though, it easily rolls off the tongue with me, my bad!)

There are operational reasons, as discussed previously on this thread, where it would be impossible for VA to manage customers expectations effectively - which really is the crux of this issue isn't it.

Hopefully Virgin Australia can chip in with some feedback or advice for those concerned.

 

[markis10]

Re: Virgin Business Class Lottery - now 0 for 2. Pay for Business, get Premium Econom

Operational Issues do seem to be a factor, XFB went offline Saturday night and has not come back AFAIK, coupled with extreme weather events I would imagine the aircraft have been mixed up a fair bit, from the VA source: The VA Source - Virgin Australia News & Information

[h=2]30th January 2012 - Flight Cancellations.[/h] The following flights did not operate today:
DJ782 Cairns - Brisbane
DJ862 Sydney - Melbourne
DJ883 Melbourne - Sydney
DJ960 Brisbane - Sydney
DJ1293 Melbourne - Cairns
DJ1829 Coolangatta - Townsville
DJ1834 Townsville - Coolangatta.
[h=2]29th January 2012 - Flight Cancellations.[/h] The following flights did not operate today:
DJ337 Melbourne - Brisbane
DJ344 Brisbane - Melbourne
DJ732 Coolangatta - Melbourne
DJ733 Melbourne - Coolangatta.
[h=2]29th January 2012 - VH-VUU Positioned to Melbourne.[/h] Boeing 737-8FE VH-VUU positioned Sydney - Melbourne this evening as DJ9062.
[h=2]28th January 2012 - 737-800 Christchurch Maintenance Swap.[/h] Boeing 737-8FE VH-VUV positioned Christchurch - Melbourne today using callsign VHVUV with sister VH-VUG moving in the other direction using VHVUG as its callsign.
[h=2]28th January 2012 - DJ428 Birdstrike.[/h] An unidentified Boeing 737-700 operating DJ428 Sydney - Adelaide encountered a birdstrike shortly after take off and returned to Sydney shortly afterwards. The aircraft was cleared to continue with the flight after around an hour on the ground.
[h=2]27th January 2012 - 737-800 Christchurch Maintenance Swap.[/h] Boeing 737-8FE VH-VUU positioned Christchurch - Melbourne today as DJ9073 with sister VH-VOT moving in the other direction using VHVOT as its callsign.
[h=2]27th January 2012 - Flight Cancellations.[/h] The following flights did not operate today:
DJ190 Port Moresby - Brisbane
DJ191 Brisbane - Port Moresby
DJ512 Coolangatta - Sydney.
[h=2]26th January 2012 - Flight Cancellations.[/h] The following flights did not operate today:
DJ189 Auckland - Brisbane
DJ482 Maroochydore - Sydney
DJ905 Sydney - Brisbane
DJ950 Brisbane - Sydney
DJ982 Coolangatta - Perth
DJ989 Sydney - Brisbane
DJ993 Sydney - Brisbane.

 

[lovestotravel]

Re: Virgin Business Class Lottery - now 0 for 2. Pay for Business, get Premium Econom

VA have already said what they needed to say...

We appreciate the expectation of purchasing a particular fare, and we will do our very best to provide the best product and service at the time.

I am pretty sure we all get last minute changes and the like, but what is causing the issue is that VA is selling J class on aircraft they fully know will NOT have J class operating...

That IS misleading and deceptive conduct, which is why they would be calling and offering 50% refunds or to change flights.

Now for all my whining about this, I have just booked a MEL-ADL-MEL flight for the weekend, in J, on the 737-800....

Will report back next week with the outcome

Also will do another weekend away, the following weekend, but likely Brisbane or Sydney (weather dependent)

These flights will get me well over gold and close to Platinum :mrgreen:

My long-haul Air NZ flights in J over the next few months will get me well past Platinum and close to partner Gold I think

 

[mickeyc747]

Re: Virgin Business Class Lottery - now 0 for 2. Pay for Business, get Premium Econom

These flights will get me well over gold and close to Platinum :mrgreen:

My long-haul Air NZ flights in J over the next few months will get me well past Platinum and close to partner Gold I think

You do understand that you need to become Platinum then earn 1500SC to get partner gold. As your year to date SC will reset when you qualify the first time for Platinum.