Virgin Dominates Qantas in Domestic Market

[N860CR]

I beleive the ATR figures are excluded, purely operating flight figures.

Thanks. Not entirely sure what AJ's arguement is then. If Virgin included their Regional (ie: Skywest) flights in the figures then I could see a valid reason for concern if QFLink was intentionally excluded, however it seems it's a direct comparision between Virgin Domestic and Qantas Mainline Domestic and in that case, yes Virgin now holds the largest share of the market. It may be a little misleading in some eyes, but is still technically correct. Qantas/QantasLink/Jetstar are split by the choice of Qantas for cost saving reasons (and one could argue about that for hours on end, but it's not relevant here) so when it comes to reporting figures like this, it's only fair that they're split as well. Can't have it both ways!

 

[medhead]

I happen to agree with some other posters.......not sure how that can be interrupted as invalidating yours or anyone else's opinion

Post #19 is pretty clear in try to dismiss my point. I believe that is one of the posters you agree with.

It is a side point. IMO your point would hold some water if they stated QFd carried x JQ carried Y for a combined total of x + y.

They have not done so.

In which case you've totally missed my point. JQ has absolutely no place in the discussion. I'm not sure why it is so <redacted> hard to understand this point.


Sent from the Throne

 

[serfty]

Qantas Press Release issued today:
...
Virgin Australia (including its regional domestic flying) carried 15.53 million passengers.
...

Does "(including its regional domestic flying)" indicate that ATR's and Skwest are indeed counted in the 15.53 million figure?

 

[Sequel]

Including qflink I get (QF flight numbers, baggage interline, same uniforms etc) but trying to include Deathstar as well - please, they are not the same airline, its like dj trying to include tigers pax numbers.

Sent from my MB526 using AustFreqFly

 

[Foreigner]

Thanks. Not entirely sure what AJ's arguement is then. If Virgin included their Regional (ie: Skywest) flights in the figures then I could see a valid reason for concern if QFLink was intentionally excluded, however it seems it's a direct comparision between Virgin Domestic and Qantas Mainline Domestic and in that case, yes Virgin now holds the largest share of the market. It may be a little misleading in some eyes, but is still technically correct. Qantas/QantasLink/Jetstar are split by the choice of Qantas for cost saving reasons (and one could argue about that for hours on end, but it's not relevant here) so when it comes to reporting figures like this, it's only fair that they're split In well. Can't have it both ways!

+1. The fact is Virgin has dented QF business. Qantas's loss in JB is Virgin's gain.

 

[mannej]

In which case you've totally missed my point. JQ has absolutely no place in the discussion. I'm not sure why it is so <redacted> hard to understand this point.

Even without the hostility, just because I don't agree with your point doesn't mean I don't understand it.

 

[serfty]

...

In which case you've totally missed my point. JQ has absolutely no place in the discussion. I'm not sure why it is so <redacted> hard to understand this point.
...

I presume your point is that Jetstar should not even have been mentioned in the press release.

There are three sets of figures mentioned, QF (with regionals) at ~20m, JQ at ~10m and DJ (with regionals) at ~16m.

 

[mannej]

Re: Qantas Fights back

Including qflink I get (QF flight numbers, baggage interline, same uniforms etc) but trying to include Deathstar as well - please, they are not the same airline, its like dj trying to include tigers pax numbers.

Sent from my MB526 using AustFreqFly

Again, the JQ reference was a side point, alluding to the "strength" of the QF Group.

 

[medhead]

Even without the hostility, just because I don't agree with your point doesn't mean I don't understand it.

No, what you wrote in post #19 demonstrates you don't understand my point. As Serfty has outlined my point is JQ should not have been mentioned at all.

Using JQ + QF, JQ in addition to QF arguements to say my point doesn't hold water is hostile IMO, especially as such discussion misses my point that JQ should not have been mentioned at all.


Sent from the Throne

 

[yohy?!]

I'm more interested in the growth story rather than QF trying to stop the share price collapsing from press releases.

IE VA's huge growth numbers are coming from who else's piece of the pie, obviously it's a mix of mainline QF, JQ and QFlink but what % would be interesting to know

 

[N860CR]

Does "(including its regional domestic flying)" indicate that ATR's and Skwest are indeed counted in the 15.53 million figure?

Possibly... they could be trying to say that the E190's are flying "regional" routes (i.e.: head to head with QFLink).

 

[mannej]

No, what you wrote in post #19 demonstrates you don't understand my point. As Serfty has outlined JQ should not have been mentioned at all.

Using JQ + QF, JQ in addition to QF argues to say my point doesn't hold water is hostile IMO especially as such discussion misses my point that JQ should not have been mentioned at all.


Sent from the Throne

Just because I don't agree with your point doesn't mean I don't understand it.

I would agree with you if they were trying to include the JQ number in the total overall number, but they don't, it is a side point.

Again, just because I don't agree with you comment doesn't make my comment hostile...

 

[markis10]

Re: Qantas Fights back

Considering QFlink includes operators that are not QF owned, I think it's poor form for QF to say the figures are not correct, clearly when you look at mainline jet ops, DJ have won and have done so for sometime. The real story buried in the figures is the profitability, and the percentage of high yield business market that has been lost/ won!

 

[Standby]

Re: Qantas Fights back

Everyone has a view. Mine is that planes with a rat on the tail are Qantas. Including JQ is wrong but the fact is they operate a number of routes and carry a lot of punter where DJ opertates by design. If DJ can include their regional network then QF should as well.Its a beat up by JB.
Fact is QF has more frequencies/capacity on key capital routes(excluding HBA) than do DJ.And as for profit we can speculate but best wait for Aug when EOY $$ are reported

 

[straitman]

So in summary,
Qantas has 44.4%,
Jetstar has 21.6% and
Virgin has 34.0%

Read into it however you like.

 

[bodog]

Re: Qantas Fights back

We carry most domestic passengers: Qantas

Didnt think it would take them long

Already noted back here @ http://www.australianfrequentflyer....-qantas-domestic-market-41082.html#post640891

 

[medhead]

Already noted back here @ http://www.australianfrequentflyer....-qantas-domestic-market-41082.html#post640891

This thread was started 3 hours before that post, which has now been moved into this thread.


Sent from the Throne

 

[jakeseven7]

I think two things are clear.

VA PR bunnies need to learn how to count and to concentrate on improving their offer rather than continually sniping in the media. They are starting to look shrill and desperate!

 

[oz_mark]

I think two things are clear.

VA PR bunnies need to learn how to count and to concentrate on improving their offer rather than continually sniping in the media. They are starting to look shrill and desperate!

Is there any eveidence that this resulted from Virgin PR? I suspect that the journalists involved just got it wrong.

 

[777]

I think two things are clear.

VA PR bunnies need to learn how to count and to concentrate on improving their offer rather than continually sniping in the media. They are starting to look shrill and desperate!

Or alternately, Virgin has grown substantially in the last 12 months why Qantas mainline has shrunk. Perhaps they are just looking for excuses to point that out? Either way it's hardly desperate.