VISA Waiver Program to USA

[JohnK]

Is the actual form, similar to the picture of the actual form that I posted?

The link you posted has a sample I-94W.

Does the actual I-94W, handed out before entering the USA, request the same information/questions as the sample?

 

[serfty]

Yes, I filled one out only two weeks ago.

 

[LondonGenie]

I would say the correct answer is "no" in this case, given my interpretation I posted here:

http://www.frequentflyer.com.au/community/81862-55-post.html

No, because DD/DWI/DUI is not a crime of 'moral turpitude', so there is no problem entering on the visa waiver scheme.

See the US Foreign Affairs Manual if you need more convincing... http://foia.state.gov/masterdocs/09fam/0940021aPN.pdf

 

[LondonGenie]

The link you posted has a sample I-94W.

Does the actual I-94W, handed out before entering the USA, request the same information/questions as the sample?

Yes!??
(Bit mystified why you will not accept that the quoted sample form, is not the actual form. IT IS THE ACTUAL FORM! )

 

[serfty]

Yes!??
(Bit mystified why you will not accept that the quoted sample form, is not the actual form. IT IS THE ACTUAL FORM! )

Actually, I think there was a slight varience with the Departure details on the bottom of the right hand side image.

I filled one out on the 8th and methinks there were dotted lines to write the info on.

 

[NM]

Actually, I think there was a slight varience with the Departure details on the bottom of the right hand side image.

I filled one out on the 8th and methinks there were dotted lines to write the info on.

The two forms I have here both look the same as the sample, including the Departure Record section with the only difference being the Departure Number shows in different.

 

[Leecy]

Hi there,

I know this has been done and dusted, but I'm just wondering...

When I was 14 (9 years ago) I stupidly stole a small chocolate bar in a shop. Naturally I got caught and taken to the police station, but there were no charges, no fingerprints were taken and all the cop did was set me straight and sent me home. He said if I came back for any reason within 5 years I would not only be charged for the choccie offense but the new offience.

Well I didn't end up getting into more trouble, but my question is, would that affect my eligibility for the VWP? I thinking it might be ok, since I was never formally charged for anything, the cop sent me on my way (after a barrage of lectures from Mum) I didn't sign anything or have any fingerprints taken.

I'm only worried because it asks if I have ever been arrested or convicted, I was only really taken to the police station in the back of the van (no handcuffs - no reading of the rights (?) or anything ). My Mum says that he only wrote it in his personal book, so I'm not too sure.....


What are your experiences with getting in on the VWP and is it likely they are going to know about this experience? Looking at Victoria Police, any crime which was done when you were a minor gets wiped after 5 years (and I'm 24 next month) so I'm thinking I'm ok??

Sorry this is long and it has been done before, but this is my first trip overseas and I want to cover all bases early so there are no troubles. Also, apologies for the n00b questions.

Thanks in advance,
Elise

 

[Maca44]

From experience, I believe the Police Officer would have only recorded details of the incident in his notebook, and thats where it remains. Having been in the legal field for 30+ years, for a 14 year old child, and on a first offence, it is usually a scare tactic which usually works. So, even though you were technically in custody I would put down that you were not arrested and/or charged, and you would be fine with the VWP

 

[LondonGenie]

http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/86942.pdf

On checking when I previously posted a link to the Foreign Affairs Manual, I posted an incorrect link.

This is what you need to review re: moral turpitude.

Theft is larceny. So that would suggest you're ineligible for the waiver scheme. But you were not arrested for anything, which would suggest that you have no need to apply for a visa.

But as you'll see (link) you're forgiven for crimes of moral turpitude committed when under 18, so it looks like you're ok for the waiver scheme after all!

As you can see there are apparent contradictions between the requirements of the waiver scheme, and when the need arises to get a visa.

Read the manual is all I can say, oh and that many many people would not be sweating about declaring far more serious things as stealing a chocolate bar as a child.

 

[Leecy]

Thank god! Thank you so much for clarifying this, I've been worried that I'd be stopped over in the US because of that offense.

Thank you so much for your help Maca44!, you really have eased my mind! I was just worried that I'd tick no,then be deported because that offense was on some record.

Once again, thanks for you help, really eases the mind! :mrgreen:

Also, thanks LondonGenie, I feel so much better - I knew that theft is classed as moral turpitude, that's why I was really worried, but I'll have a read through this manual as well, so I'm better informed.

Thanks again!

Elise

 

[Skyring]

http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/86942.pdf

I wouldn't give long odds on a "reasonable person" reading that and coming up with a unified, complete understanding.

My guess is that the average desk jockey would be able to read into that whatever they wanted to get out of it. If they don't like the cut of your jib, they won't let you in. If they think you're a good bloke, they'll pick one of the many exemptions.

Of course, a lawyer or senior bureaucrat could come up with a completely different interpretation.

On a practical basis, unless your name is on a computer database, or you admit to a conviction for an act of moral turpitude, you will be admitted. I doubt that we send the Yanks lists of every adult Aussie conviction, so what they keep on record would be US crimes, or lists of terrorists, or Interpol alerts.

They can't keep too many details on file, otherwise there would be so many false positives (your name is the same as a cat burglar) and false negatives (you changed your name to Unique Innocent and it shows up on no lists, even though you have a string of catburglar convictions under your previous name) that the system would be useless.

Mind you, if they pull you up for some other reason (maybe you are trying to evade customs duties) and they go looking back into your past with inquiries to Australia, all bets are off. They'll find any dirt if it's there to be found.

My experience, and I've entered the USA six times over the past couple of years, is that they take your card, look over it to see if you've declared any misdeeds, they scan your passport (which presumably brings up your name) and if no bells ring, you are OK. They also take thumbprints and photograph, but I doubt that these are used for any sort of instant biometrics search, but rather they can file these away for later use if need be.

 

[Leecy]

Thanks for that info Skyring, I'm studying all of their customs and immigration proceedures (ie; what I can take in and can't) because I want to be fully prepared for as much as I can. I was more worried about the criminal side of the VWP because I wasn't sure what info was given to officials over there. But given I was 14, nothing was electronically recorded, no fingerprints taken I wanted to be sure that I wouldn't be deported for something very small.

I have found a lot of the documents in relation to the VWP are pretty contradictory, and because of that I wanted to see if anyone has gone through this process.

But it sounds like I should be alright, provided I stick by the rules and I am curteous and patient to those who are helping me.

Thanks for you help,
Elise

 

[Leecy]

Thanks for the heads-up on this issue! I just want to make sure that this indescretion will not rear it's ugly head at me!
I have noticed though that the documents relating to the VWP are quite contradictory and confusing.
By the sounds of it though, as long as I follow the rules and I'm curteous and patient I should be right?

 

[Evan]

My opinion only !

If i had commited such an offence at only age 14 i would apply for VWP.

That infomation should never ever makes its way to the USA, of course there is always a chance of a stuff up in the process but i am sure we have all taken much bigger risks.

E

 

[Skyring]

My opinion only !

If i had commited such an offence at only age 14 i would apply for VWP.

It doesn't look as there was even a formal arrest, let alone a conviction. It was underage, there wasn't anything on paper, and looking at previous discussions on this subject it looks like even if you do come clean and apply for a visa, there isn't going to be any documentation to support the story. No court documents, no arresting officer's name, no photographs with circles and arrows on the back.

Forget it. They ain't interested.

On the other hand, if anyone has done something that fulls under the "moral turpitude" mantle as an adult, you can probably get in under the VWP radar, but if they start looking at you carefully, (say) if you make a joke about bombs in an airport and you attract the attention of the nice TSA officers, then you are going to be in the poo.

 

[Leecy]

Yeah, you are right, I was only taken to the police station via the divvy van and held at the station until Mum came and got me. I was never fingerprinted, and he just told me if I came back he'd charge me for that offense and the new one (if I offended again - which I haven't). And from what Mum had told me, he was doing it to scare me and that it should mean nothing now as I hadn't gone back since. She also seems to think it was just in his notebook, which she thinks that by now it would have been destroyed.

So does that mean no fingerprints=no charges?

 

[Skyring]

Yeah, you are right, I was only taken to the police station via the divvy van and held at the station until Mum came and got me. I was never fingerprinted, and he just told me if I came back he'd charge me for that offense and the new one (if I offended again - which I haven't).

I'd say that you may enter the USA under the VWP with that best of all possible visas: a clear conscience.

No formal arrest, no charge, no conviction. You're clear.

 

[Leecy]

I'd say that you may enter the USA under the VWP with that best of all possible visas: a clear conscience.

No formal arrest, no charge, no conviction. You're clear.

Hooray! Thank you so much for easing my mind! It's been on my mind for awhile, ever since I read the VWP conditions. I passed all of the other ones, it was just the 'criminal' bit I was concerned about.

So all I do is fill out that form in transit and 'rock up'? Then that's awesome.

 

[simongr]

The fun part will be when you arrive and make your way into the queue

Mind you, if you are travelling there on business or into Asia on business you could apply for the APEC Business Traveller Card and skip this entire process

 

[Leecy]

Naw, not travelling on business, just pleasure - going on a Contiki tour actually. I fly over to LAX and I heard about how bad it is, so I'm fully prepared for that.