Why QF's changes to partner status earn are going to backfire on QF

[jpk]

In the future once QF has collapsed, business students will read about the last years of QF as a case study, and these program changes will be cited as one of the events that contributed to it's decline. People will scratch their heads and say "huh, how was that ever going to improve things?". Along with:
- EK tie up
- forcing everyone to fly JQ
- giving up on Asia
- giving the new hardware to JQ instead of QF
- mediocre in flight offering (hard & soft product)
- all the JQ asian ventures that lost money & stole attention/energy from mainline
- ordering new planes for JQ HK that sat on the ground in Toulouse for months
- fleet grounding in 2011
- lengthy damaging fights with their unions
- hanging onto a board and executive team that clearly didn't know what they were doing.

 

[JohnPhelan]

In the future once QF has collapsed, business students will read about the last years of QF as a case study, and these program changes will be cited as one of the events that contributed to it's decline.

Given that QF has more than $3 BILLION in cash in the bank, it's not going to be collapsing.

Worst case scenario would be that it becomes a domestic airline only. More possible is that it limits international operations to just the routes where it makes a lot of money (i.e. the Americas).

Saying that QF will "collapse" is either just ignorant of reality, or shows an inherent bias (i.e. it's your desired outcome - wishful thinking on your part). Either way, totally unrealistic and won't be happening.

 

[11sjw]

In the future once QF has collapsed, business students will read about the last years of QF as a case study, and these program changes will be cited as one of the events that contributed to it's decline. People will scratch their heads and say "huh, how was that ever going to improve things?". Along with:
- EK tie up
- forcing everyone to fly JQ
- giving up on Asia
- giving the new hardware to JQ instead of QF
- mediocre in flight offering (hard & soft product)
- all the JQ asian ventures that lost money & stole attention/energy from mainline
- ordering new planes for JQ HK that sat on the ground in Toulouse for months
- fleet grounding in 2011
- lengthy damaging fights with their unions
- hanging onto a board and executive team that clearly didn't know what they were doing.

Probably should add inherited legacy issues and government restrictions as well.

 

[jpk]

Given that QF has more than $3 BILLION in cash in the bank, it's not going to be collapsing.

Worst case scenario would be that it becomes a domestic airline only. More possible is that it limits international operations to just the routes where it makes a lot of money (i.e. the Americas).

Saying that QF will "collapse" is either just ignorant of reality, or shows an inherent bias (i.e. it's your desired outcome - wishful thinking on your part). Either way, totally unrealistic and won't be happening.

Well 3B won't last forever if they keep burning at a rate of 500M per year. And I'm not sure why AJ isn't more positive if things are actually not that bad...

But you're right, they probably won't collapse (and no it is not my desired income, why would anyone want that), but I am sure you know I was exercising some hyperbole there to point out that very little that they have done in the last few years has been a step in the right direction, or (keeping in line with the thread subject) a step that will win over punters. If we did the same list to point out the positive changes lately:
- new lounges in SIN, HKG, LAX
- announced a new lie flat J product for A330s (although hasn't actually appeared yet so currently just PR vapour)
- A380 to DFW
- others?

 

[Himeno]

Given that QF has more than $3 BILLION in cash in the bank, it's not going to be collapsing.

AA had over $2 Billion in the bank when they realized they needed to change things and entered chapter 11.
QF needs to realize the current management team isn't working and replace it with a proven team while they have the chance, before things get too far to save.

 

[Himeno]

Be very interesting to see if QF pay any attention to this issue and whether Red Roo has any response.

Qantas knows about the issue and has known since day 1 of the change announcements when everyone started asking about it and pointing out the problems. QF said they would look at it, no response since.

 

[moa999]

Re AA. If Australian law allowed Qantas to walk away from debt, leases, employee pension obligations, and renegotiate wages downwards without losing a chunk of cash and raising equity in the process then I'm sure management would have gone down that route.

But they can't here in Australia and are thus focussing on the most profitable routes whilst slowly reducing costs, and at the same time protecting overall market share via a lower cost subsidiary.

While I agree the changes impact those in Adelaide and Perth more than others, if QFF did what some above have suggested I suspect many on this board would instead be flying to ADL to catch a cheap MH flight for example.

 

[ftm]

AA had over $2 Billion in the bank when they realized they needed to change things and entered chapter 11.
QF needs to realize the current management team isn't working and replace it with a proven team while they have the chance, before things get too far to save.

AA was/is also a considerably larger airline than QF. So direct comparison isn't really meaningful.

 

[Himeno]

AA was/is also a considerably larger airline than QF. So direct comparison isn't really meaningful.

Of course it is.
AA realized there was a problem, acknowledged what that problem was and did something about it.
QF realizes they have a problem, blame everything except the cause of the problem, and keeps doing things that makes the problem worse.

 

[trippin_the_rift]

Of course it is.
AA realized there was a problem, acknowledged what that problem was and did something about it.
QF realizes they have a problem, blame everything except the cause of the problem, and keeps doing things that makes the problem worse.

The part of the group that is losing $$ (intl) - the CEO is making a lot of changes. Keeping in mind he was brought into that role after huge success with QFF and has great achievements under his belt.
Technically Jetstar made a loss last year if you normalise the figures - and JQ is making changes by taking over routes that QF currently flys.

QF won't die and they won't go broke. What they ARE screwing up is the BILLIONS OF DOLLARS in easy wins left on the table that other airlines/loyalty programs are freely helping themselves to.
Unfortunately QF won't feel the effect of this until the baby boomers start dying out as this is their core market.

 

[OATEK]

....
Unfortunately QF won't feel the effect of this until the baby boomers start dying out as this is their core market.

Us Baby Boomers are hoping this is a long time away, especially given the constant rhetoric about how we are going to weigh down the economy with our health and pension needs for years to come. But it is probably true that JQ has a strong connection with younger generations, and QF is relying on that to more than fill the gaps left by the disaffected.

 

[MH_fan]

QF can make whatever changes they want to the QFF. It's their right to. I just respond accordingly to my needs and change my loyalty to another programme that maximises my earning ability. They're doing what they think is best for them and I, as a customer, will do what's best for me. My typical travel plans usually involve 2 J trips to Europe, 1 J trip to North America and several J/Y trips to South-East Asia a year (all self-funded, no redemptions). I have worked out that this will be enough to earn me platinum and, therefore, emerald on OW, on MH's Enrich programme. I will divert the majority of my domestic flying (for work) to VA to give me a shot at achieving platinum with them, as I currently make gold comfortably now, and just have a few QF domestic trips to keep my points alive. I'm disappointed by the proposed changes that QFF want to implement and I would have preferred to continue my loyalty with them but I will simply move on without wishing them any ill will.

 

[DTM1]

Interestingly, I just received a request to complete a survey being undertaken by a third party on QF's behalf in relation to the recent changes and QF FF's performance as compared to other FF programs. My response should come as no surprise to QF (or any other posters on this board), but will be interesting to see if they take any notice.

 

[dmitri]

It a seems the back fire won't start as soon as expected

Qantas delays new points earning scheme for partner airlines - Flights | hotels | frequent flyer | business class - Australian Business Traveller

 

[juddles]

That Business Traveller article appears to suggest it is the points, NOT the SC earn that has been delayed?

 

[Isochronous]

Hopefully the partner airlines complain and help induce QFF to reverse some of these changes.

 

[cmon0005]

That Business Traveller article appears to suggest it is the points, NOT the SC earn that has been delayed?

I don't care if they don't increase the points on partner airlines, but I do care about SC earn on partner airlines, especially where QF don't fly!

Hopefully they see sense and return partner earning to normal...

 

[OATEK]

I don't care if they don't increase the points on partner airlines, but I do care about SC earn on partner airlines, especially where QF don't fly!

Hopefully they see sense and return partner earning to normal...

Sadly the SC earn appears to have been settled at half the QF earn. If that was under review for legs that QF no longer fly (eg SIN-LHR or HKG-LHR) I would feel that there might be some fairness in the changes. But as it stands I feel that QF are punishing anyone who is not on-board with their Middle-East routing and tie-up with EK.

 

[pm3207]

Like DTM1, I also received a QFF survey. I too am furious at the partner SC changes, particularly on sectors where QF does not fly. Expressed that view very firmly in the survey, plus my disappointment at the P1 programme. I have decided to move across to the CX programme, given I'll be needing to do business in both Asia and Europe and will be penalised by QF for flying between the two! So much for the "virtual network". How incredibly stupid.

 

[11sjw]

QF can make whatever changes they want to the QFF. It's their right to. I just respond accordingly to my needs and change my loyalty to another programme that maximises my earning ability. They're doing what they think is best for them and I, as a customer, will do what's best for me. My typical travel plans usually involve 2 J trips to Europe, 1 J trip to North America and several J/Y trips to South-East Asia a year (all self-funded, no redemptions). I have worked out that this will be enough to earn me platinum and, therefore, emerald on OW, on MH's Enrich programme. I will divert the majority of my domestic flying (for work) to VA to give me a shot at achieving platinum with them, as I currently make gold comfortably now, and just have a few QF domestic trips to keep my points alive. I'm disappointed by the proposed changes that QFF want to implement and I would have preferred to continue my loyalty with them but I will simply move on without wishing them any ill will.

Ditch the "few QF domestic trips" and just shop at Woolworths to keep your points alive. Better chance at VA Platinum.