Article: Qantas Pleased with Classic Plus Uptake

[levelnine]

I just looked and next week, SYD-LAX is available in J for 5/7 days.

Undoubtably the release pattern has changed (there has been AFF articles on this), but that doesn’t mean there’s fewer seats.

Spin that would make Qantas Marketing shed a tear of joy.

For anyone interested in the truth, here is SYD-LAX J availability on Qantas for the next year.

A more accurate figure would be 11/365.

 

[kamchatsky]

I think they are just releasing all the Classic Plus Rewards in Premium cabins, and withheld most of the Premium Classic Rewards for the next batch of massive CR batch releases. This will generate massive "goodwill" for the people who happened to grab those Premium CR rewards on the release day.

 

[justinbrett]

Spin that would make Qantas Marketing shed a tear of joy.

For anyone interested in the truth, here is SYD-LAX J availability on Qantas for the next year.

A more accurate figure would be 11/365.

View attachment 397863

And before people were setting alarms to snap up the CR seats at exactly 353 days before.

If anything the new unpredictable release schedule makes it easier for many to book as most are not that organised to book a year out.

 

[levelnine]

And before people were setting alarms to snap up the CR seats at exactly 353 days before.

If anything the new unpredictable release schedule makes it easier for many to book as most are not that organised to book a year out.

To the contrary, classic award availability in long haul J is very predictable — predictably bad.

 

[DC3]

The wordsmiths are watching

 

[justinbrett]

To the contrary, classic award availability in long haul J is very predictable — predictably bad.

I'm not talking about availability, I'm talking about how many seats are being offered & utilised. I'm yet to see any evidence that has changed for the worse.

Availability was pretty poor under the old system too.

 

[levelnine]

I'm yet to see any evidence that has changed for the worse.

You're asking for something that no one can provide. It's very easy to play games with the burden of proof.

I'm yet to see any evidence that it is not 100x worse than it was prior to COVID-19.

See?

 

[justinbrett]

You're asking for something that no one can provide. It's very easy to play games with the burden of proof.

I'm yet to see any evidence that it is not 100x worse than it was prior to COVID-19.

See?

Yes, but this all started because someone claimed as fact there are fewer CR seats.

The onus is on those who believe that to provide evidence.

I’ve never claimed it as fact they haven’t been reduced, but my experience and observation makes me believe they haven’t. Coloured with stats released from QF that over 10% of pax flown are done so on CRs. We don’t know the route / cabin make up of that, but that is a huge number.

Just look in all the old threads of people trying to book CR at 353 days exactly and well remember that things weren’t so rosey before. AFF has made articles showing QF are releasing seats but under a different pattern.

 

[downloadingdata]

There is no point to this argument. Those who are deemed to have the burden of proof instantly lose because no one has access to definitive data on how many CR seats QF releases.

 

[justinbrett]

There is no point to this argument. Those who are deemed to have the burden of proof instantly lose because no one has access to definitive data on how many CR seats QF releases.

No, we have that. It's about 5 million a year. Source was in my post above.

What we don't have is a break down on routes & cabins.

 

[DC3]

You can leave a comment or discuss this topic below.

Now look what you’ve started.

 

[encryptededdy]

I too would like to see Qantas report how many long haul business class seats they have released in the past 12 months compared to the same period 5 and then 10 years ago. I would gladly stand corrected if my anecdotal evidence is way off the mark. In fact, Qantas would immediately dispel all the negative comments and prove all the naysayers (including myself) wrong regarding long haul premium Classic Reward seat availability if it did publish the actual figures.

I think people would still complain even if they released this information

To be honest, I suspect it's more than likely the amount of long-haul business seats being released hasn't decreased. It's the growth in QFF members, and probably just as importantly, more and more people being into "point hacking" and actually spending their points on high-value redemptions, such as business seats.

It's hard to have any hard numbers for the latter point, but anecdotally from my friends and colleagues it looks like a lot more people are churning credit cards etc. to get that elusive business class redemption now vs. pre-covid or even before that. Previously people would be members of QFF, but would likely just redeem a few economy flights and/or toasters. And no, it's not me introducing them to this world (I don't talk about it that much), it's them coming across it on social media (e.g. TikTok influencers peddling credit cards) and then coming to me for advice since they know I fly a lot and know the FF programs well.

Of course, the end outcome is the same for us regardless, but it certainly matters for Qantas Loyalty's bottom line. If you're getting a lot more points being purchased by banks for credit cards etc. but aren't increasing availability of your most expensive* redemption (Classic Rewards), then that's an easy path to Loyalty's current growth... well, until people catch on that the availability doesn't match their expectations.

*expensive as in the cost to Qantas Loyalty

---

As for the original article, I think it would be good to have a section on the general feelings of AFF members towards CR+

 

[levelnine]

What we don't have is a break down on routes & cabins.

Which is the only thing that matters.

No one is complaining about the lack of availability on short haul domestic routes in Y.

 

[justinbrett]

Which is the only thing that matters.

No one is complaining about the lack of availability on short haul domestic routes in Y.

Well there's no shortage of longhaul Y either.

Yes there is an availability issue with longhaul J, but this existed before CR+, and before covid, so that doesn't correlate to a reduction of CR seats on those flights, especially with the well documented changes to their release patterns.

 

[jase05]

Well there's no shortage of longhaul Y either.

Yes there is an availability issue with longhaul J, but this existed before CR+, and before covid, so that doesn't correlate to a reduction of CR seats on those flights, especially with the well documented changes to their release patterns.

There does seem to be a heap more availability on long haul premium cabins about a week or two out these days (or at least when I’ve looked) so perhaps they are still releasing the same number of premium seats just not at times that suit all people.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Most people will, at one stage in their life, redeem for "toasters".

That day is when the member finally gives up on collecting QF points and likely all airline points.
That day is closer than most people think.

People don't redeem for toasters because they're good value - they redeem as a way to extract value from whatever remaining balance they have as they exit the ecosystem, even if it's only temporary.

Indeed! I had some orphan SQ points, didn’t want to fly anywhere, needed a new ipad, bought one! Not the greatest value, but it was 100% more value than i would have got with the points expiring and leaving me with nothing!

 

[justinbrett]

How about people just read the AFF article:

Reward Seat Release Patterns Have Changed Fundamentally

Qantas no longer releases most Classic Reward seats on international flights 353 days in advance. Instead, airlines are releasing frequent flyer redemption seats in batches closer to departure.

www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au

 

[levelnine]

How about people just read the AFF article:
https://www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au/reward-seat-release-patterns/

That article says nothing about the number of seats, which is the subject of discussion.

FWIW, my guess would be that the number of classic award seats on the most in-demand routes (eg J to Europe) is more than many people think, but it is primarily occurring out of the public eye through release requests.

QF seem to have a rough quota of classic awards for each flight. CL are free to pick whichever days they want and are probably taking a chunk of them. P1 get relatively good access from what is leftover (you see reports of P1s getting seats to LHR on a semi-regular basis in the release thread). WP get limited access on low days in low seasons. Everyone else is left to fight amongst themselves during a batch release 1-3 times per year.

 

[justinbrett]

Everyone else is left to fight amongst themselves during a batch release 1-3 times per year.

How is that any different to fighting on day 353 which was the old system?

The whole argument in this thread is that CR+ has lead to a reduction in CR seats. I personally think that's a bogus argument but it can't be proved either way.

 

[aikman]

If I was buying a car worth $50k and the car dealer said I’ll sell it to you for $100k I’d walk out without purchasing it. Classic Plus Rewards leave a similar bad taste.

Except that you have a $100k gift card valid for that store only. So you'll probably sleep on it then come back the next day and buy it anyway.