Article: Qantas Points “The Envy of the World”? Absolutely Not!

[aikman]

Qantas should convert one 787 into an all J configuration and use it as a permanent points plane and shuttle it to and from London. This should fix the reward availability issue. I think.

 

[Jenp]

Qantas Points “The Envy of the World”? Absolutely Not! is an article written by AFF editorial staff:

Qantas Points "The Envy of the World"? Absolutely Not, Mr Joyce!

Qantas CEO Alan Joyce recently told a room full of business leaders and journalists in Perth that the airline's frequent flyer scheme and points "are the

www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au

You can leave a comment or discuss this topic below.

So true! I’m a platinum qff / life time gold and have been for many years and my husband earns a lot of points via his business. In the past we have cobbled together some great trips with one world. Simply no point in trying now. We have swapped to KrisFlyer and move credit card points into that as needed for everything except Australian domestic flights. You don’t seem to need any status to gave outs of awards flight choice. I think Qantas will find their FF business somewhat devalued unless they address the issues with availability.

 

[dajop]

Surely there have not been thousands of these "points flights".

Why not?

I don’t think they have used the terminology points only flights. Basically I think j they’re just being cute with words.

Probably a theoretical exercise - where when releasing a flight for sale, in theory all 12 business class seats and all 162 economy seats (let’s face it most likely these flights are domestic 737 flights) are available for purchase using classic awards. Of course the language used doesn’t preclude these seats being purchased using cash.

Feed 5-6 of these into they system per day and you get to 2000 over a year.

 

[smckay]

I'll chip in. Like Kacymru I have been a QF fanboi for years. Mainly due to the operational reliability and record. JB747 comments in the ask the pilot thread confirms for me that QF air crew are absolutely the best (overall, I think domestic they could improve).
Thanks to this forum I have been able to complete around 4 OW award trips in J around the world - LHR, FRA, JFK, DFW, AMS, EDI all being destinations - by simply being smarter with my choice of points use. Now I have turned left, I am struggling to turn right, so I am a confirmed premium cabin inhabitant. I even stumped up for Qantas Club access for 4 or so years.
I chased points like a nutcase, churned cards, calculated, schemed and worked the system. Always had the 636,000 needed for my Big Trip every 18 months or so.
However, as I only ever achieved the lofty heights of Silver, I accepted my lot and dealt with the left-over rewards seats and made it work. Often time I was on split flights, connecting in HKG to another carrier.
However, this year through a combination of factors I hit Gold (toot toot!).
Now, I thought something magical would happen and I would see all these seats previously reserved for the Elite suddenly come free on my booking screen.
Alas, this has not been the case. I want to go to South Africa next year and there is no premium cabin seat available any time in a 3 month period. Very little in the way of circular routes either.
Alternate is Europe, but again very little options available.
So, Gold has been a fizzer for me. Sure, I got a new card, a luggage tag, a nice email and a special welcome from one CSM but no perks of a decent seat. (Disclaimer, I did get a J return trip to NZ with a few days notice and I was grateful for that).
In the next month, I should then qualify for Platinum. This will really be the only time I make that status so I will probably be a one-hit wonder (and I will be hitting the F lounge hard....)
I will be seeing what this level of status means from Qantas; I will certainly be dialling them up asking for some SYD-JNB J awards flights to come my way. If Computer Says No, I will be most disappointed.

So for me, Qantas is not the envy of the world. I have posted before that if a business does not look after every customer they will loose them. I have spent over 170 hours on the phone to QF (not including the times they did actually call back) to sort out a rewards flight that was disrupted due to Covid; in that sense I make no complaints to QF but their staff, systems and attitude has been so low that I cannot believe no one in charge is making changes. Their staff and systems caused the delays alone. And to put that in perspective, I have spent a minimum of 21 working days on the phone. 21 days!

I have been thinking this for a while now; Qantas FF program is so easy to earn and so quick to deliver points that is is devaluing itself, and therefore making the clients find fault with it. Take my example - as a bronze with nil status I was able to secure business class seats on at least 6 flight legs without setting foot on a plane which must hurt the bottom line.

So, QF CEO might spruik envy to fellow CEO but that to me would be to gloat how easy they earn income from a product they do not need to offer and do restrict the product being offered. The other Airlines may well think, well, we play fair by offering decent seat levels but making the people pay for them whereas this little fella is not playing fair. And the fanboi's still worship him despite cancelled flights and old planes with busted arm rests in J, along with J food that drops to a single option by row 2 on a 3-row 737.

For me, if I don't receive a suitable benefit from Platinum, which for me would be quick phone access to competent and enabled staff, a within-reason availability of premium seats then I would have to say that Qantas as a valued partner for me is finished and I will look at *A.

 

[mviy]

For me, if I don't receive a suitable benefit from Platinum, which for me would be quick phone access to competent and enabled staff, a within-reason availability of premium seats then I would have to say that Qantas as a valued partner for me is finished and I will look at *A.

Calls normally get through fairly quickly as WP, but you may/may not get through to the preferred call centres.

Platinum may be able to get seats released in some cases but you'd still most likely need to be looking soon after classic reward seats QF already made available have been bought.

 

[siri]

We have paid to our London Business class flight via Japan Air and now in London and will do the same again and Qantas will be not even on our picking list in future since life gold and half a million points suddenly becomes inert due to this useless ceo which is killing the Qantas brand. High value Citi card points and Amex platinum points all point to Qantas and I think Sing Air and other neighbours should get their marketing teams to Australia, then people will have better loyalty choices. I got screwed with Virgin Atlantic, before they left and lost so many points and never trust virgin again and it comes to availability or lack of it..

 

[AVV]

Qantas Points “The Envy of the World”? Absolutely Not! is an article written by AFF editorial staff:

Qantas Points "The Envy of the World"? Absolutely Not, Mr Joyce!

Qantas CEO Alan Joyce recently told a room full of business leaders and journalists in Perth that the airline's frequent flyer scheme and points "are the

www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au

You can leave a comment or discuss this topic below.

Yes points are easy to obtain but often cannot use one world carriers. Within Australaa abd S.E Asia I pay all extras and use JQ. THEY ARE helpful, caring and are easy to contact. Just take the bundles.

Qantas Points “The Envy of the World”? Absolutely Not! is an article written by AFF editorial staff:

Qantas Points "The Envy of the World"? Absolutely Not, Mr Joyce!

Qantas CEO Alan Joyce recently told a room full of business leaders and journalists in Perth that the airline's frequent flyer scheme and points "are the

www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au

You can leave a comment or discuss this topic below. Easy try booking a flight MELKUL. Normally shows JQ via SIN.

I Prefer JQ with bundles , better service as QF have left most to JQ and on domestic. They (JQ) have brilliant customer service within minutes and staff helpful and considering its only a fast form of transport as many still think they are special , look at fares 20 years ago . But many think they are special. Some train fares are dearer than air, so instead of complaing use a different carrier or JQ and pay the bundles. You would be surprised.

 

[AustraliaPoochie]

Don't forget, Aer Lingus was were AJ started, according to a websearch. in 1988.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I'm actually going to defend Qantas a little bit here: I think the award availability is a result of a perfect storm right now of;

• Post-COVID many people have more points balances than usual
• Reduced schedules
• More people travelling
• More people wanting to travel in a premium class than pre-pandemic (e.g., but also anecdotally)
  • Most likely resulting in a reduction in last-minute releases of award space
• Cancellation/change fee waivers

Call me naive, but I think the situation will improve over time. I also (unless someone has information to the contrary) doubt Qantas has released meaningfully less award seats vs. previous years on a per-flight basis. Of course, there's less flights so in terms of absolute numbers it is probably less.

What actually is problematic in my opinion is the continuing ticketing/flight change issues with award tickets, especially complex OWAs. The limited availability I can understand, but what really gets me is I have to sweat every time I get a flight change email hoping that Qantas will issue a new e-ticket in time.

I'm not blaming the flight changes themselves (and they're often partners making the changes anyway), but in no world should a simple flight change by a partner cause one to lose their entire itinerary because Qantas didn't re-ticket in time.

IIRC qantas says it wants to maximise profits by reducing flights and charging higher fares.

That would make the reduction in flights a deliberate policy, not a perfect storm.

Qantas and other airlines claimed they knew the market, yet got it so wrong. Instead of bringing back A380s they brought back 787s with a fraction of the seats.

 

[Alberto]

Qantas Points “The Envy of the World”? Absolutely Not! is an article written by AFF editorial staff:

Qantas Points "The Envy of the World"? Absolutely Not, Mr Joyce!

Qantas CEO Alan Joyce recently told a room full of business leaders and journalists in Perth that the airline's frequent flyer scheme and points "are the

www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au

You can leave a comment or discuss this topic below.

Unfortunately you have captured the problems very succinctly and accurately. Disappearing bookings and tickets, and endless unmet promises to call back by Suva and CapeTown have also been my experience with an around the world classic reward ticket over many months. Waiting for a request to reinstate One World (QR) ticketing that has dropped off, over 1-2 months, meant that what few alternative reward tickets are available simply dry up In the meantime. To make matters worse if you find an alternative flight, Qantas call centres have been incapable of making the change to the booking because they are awaiting confirmation from the partner airline. if you are lucky to have enough points and money for the taxes, as I was, and a flight reward seat miraculously appears, you need to make a new booking on line and then ring the call centre to cancel your original booking (but don’t give them your original booking number as you run the risk the’ll cancel the new one by mistake). Now to sweat that there isn’t a cancellation or flight time change which could mean the house of card ticket could be cancelled without notification. (Oh and Olivia Wirth had better things to do than refer the problem to Hobart or another competent operator.). Envy of the world indeed.

 

[kaktusdigital]

Gosh I had made a booking roughly a year a ago on EK via Qantas and seats were still somewhat plentiful. As someone who mentioned previously, I do hope this is JUST a case of a perfect storm. In the past a trip to Europe would have at least a few carriers, notably CX, MU, EK, BA available. Its understandable with the reduction in capacity to China and HK rules out CX and MU, but what about the others? Are airlines just super hungry for cash tickets that they're quite happy to not meet their FF obligations for now? I certainly hope when the mad rush to exit the country has somewhat returned to normal, so shall our award availability. #optimistic

 

[Nomads]

Our experience during a recent trip around the world on F.F. Award P.Econ I would accept almost any reasonable offer to dispose/exchange my QF F.F. points. The call centre cancelled our JFK-LHR sector without our knowledge and due to further changes made because of a cancelled flight reward points refunds were challenged. Only after many calls did we can some but not all points credited. I would be happy to be rid of QF F.F. points and simply chase best price.

 

[gerrybu]

What can we do with our modest 400,000 points. Can't redeem, don't want to waste on Qantas shop purchases. Are they transferrable to another Oneworld partner programme ? (or to KrisFlyer for example)

Use Award Flight Assist - Frequent Flyer Solutions to tell you how to book - cost $500 but they did all the work & I just booked RTW business class 318K points

 

[JCD]

After 20+ years as a Qantas Platinum FF and over 5.5 million QFF points in my account I'm about to change credit cards to those that I can credit to another airline. I've found Asia MIles much easier to redeem and I'm totally sick of trying to redeem Business Class international rewards with Qantas.

 

[oldies on tour]

We have had many of the same bad experiences that have been mentioned above and are now stuck with lots of useless points. So we have given up, and for some time now we have been accumulating Velocity points instead. Qantas used to be a well respected company but it has treated so many customers and staff appallingly, and that is apart from Covid and points redemption issues. Perhaps it the misplaced loyalty of it's customers that's the only thing keeping it afloat.

 

[drron]

I'm sorry but in 2002 I learn't that QFF wasn't the envy of other airlines in the world and I switched to AA.
Just did a search on mrsdrron's WP account for 11/7?2023. A J award on QF or EK comes in at 1.092000 points plus several hundred dollars as the cheapest J award.
Then searched my AA account as a OWS member. Could get QF J to HND then AY HND-HEL-LHR in J for 2 people at a cost of 85000 points plus $US 121.30. AA are only doing awards 330 days out so latest you could book is 12/7/23.

No QFF is a joke to others not an envy.

 

[Happy Dude]

After 20+ years as a Qantas Platinum FF and over 5.5 million QFF points in my account I'm about to change credit cards to those that I can credit to another airline. I've found Asia MIles much easier to redeem and I'm totally sick of trying to redeem Business Class international rewards with Qantas.

You're not the Lone ranger here but do you see Asia Miles redemptions going forward? I'd have thought the reduction in CX capacity would limit options. Or do you mean transferring to Asia Miles and redeeming from there on OW carriers?

 

[Princess Fiona]

I'm sorry but in 2002 I learn't that QFF wasn't the envy of other airlines in the world and I switched to AA.
Just did a search on mrsdrron's WP account for 11/7?2023. A J award on QF or EK comes in at 1.092000 points plus several hundred dollars as the cheapest J award.
Then searched my AA account as a OWS member. Could get QF J to HND then AY HND-HEL-LHR in J for 2 people at a cost of 85000 points plus $US 121.30. AA are only doing awards 330 days out so latest you could book is 12/7/23.

No QFF is a joke to others not an envy.

Can you get that to ticketing ?
I can’t. There is a lot of phantom availability on AA especially with AY and JL and that seems to be one of them.

The QF example is a points plus pay Award. AA has them too on a regular Award search if no U availability.

 

[drron]

Can you get that to ticketing ?
I can’t. There is a lot of phantom availability on AA especially with AY and JL and that seems to be one of them.

The QF example is a points plus pay Award. AA has them too on a regular Award search if no U availability.

I did go through to ticketing but obviously didn't hit pay. That was on the 11/7/23 one. The previous availability that came up was early June.
However you are probablly right for January february march 2023 as virtually all days had availability.

 

[Anna]

There is one part of QFF that is worth bothering with, and that is the SCs that grant what is amusingly called 'status'. It opens lots of doors all over the world, sometimes literally in the case of certain lounges.

QFF points on the other hand are basically a scam. I gave up on them years ago. Too tired of only being able to get a one way trip on points and not a return trip, or being denied a points upgrade then having to sit and look at the half empty J cabin for the entire flight, or even twice being downgraded at the airport after having a confirmed points upgrade.