Australian Reports of the Virus Spread

[james4321]

Though you missed my point.I certainly don't advocate border closures but I don't trust the Premiers of QLD and WA.I was just suggesting they have easier ways to do things than lock the borders.

OK but only as long as those "easier" ways are both practical and effective. I guess thats the challenge for all who are in the unenviable position of having to make decisions - there are multiple interests to consider and impossible to please everyone. I'm happy with how its all been handled so far, and happy for the Premiers to continue to make decisions as they see fit based on the advice they are taking. I think they all have done a great job in incredibly difficult circumstances, they deserve lot less criticism and a lot more support.

 

[DC3]

... I certainly don't advocate border closures but I don't trust the Premiers of QLD and WA.I was just suggesting they have easier ways to do things than lock the borders.

Not sure why we would trust any politician? They are all programmed for re-election. We vote them in and hope that they can do something positive for us. Generally, it’s a matter of picking what many see as the lesser of two evils.

 

[scallops]

The science says that if they arrived from a low risk country, which is what we are talking about here, then the borders would not have to be shut at all.But I realise that people in QLD and WA ,although most don't realise it ,have been taken in by a scare campaign.
Why would you want to close the border in QLD for travellers from a low risk country such as NZ or a Pacific Island?

But what if that pax came through a high risk country, this would throw the process of Australian hotel quarantine back to where we were in Victoria a few months ago. ALL pax should be tested before flying to Australia, from any overseas country. No exceptions!
We did it too hard in Victoria to go back to lockdown.

 

[drron]

But what if that pax came through a high risk country, this would throw the process of Australian hotel quarantine back to where we were in Victoria a few months ago. ALL pax should be tested before flying to Australia, from any overseas country. No exceptions!
We did it too hard in Victoria to go back to lockdown.

I was talking about low risk countries.From high risk countries testing is not enough they need to be quarantined.
On the cruise thread there is a report of a Carribean cruise on a small ship where you had to have had a Covid test 3 days before and again on the day of departure.despite all testing negative there was a Covid case 24 hours later and several ended up positive in the next couple of days.
So pointless to test pax before flying to Australia.

 

[HappyFlyerFamily]

O

But what if that pax came through a high risk country, this would throw the process of Australian hotel quarantine back to where we were in Victoria a few months ago. ALL pax should be tested before flying to Australia, from any overseas country. No exceptions!
We did it too hard in Victoria to go back to lockdown.

Pre-testing does not guarantee covid won’t arrive in Australia. There have been a few cases of pre-testing a few days earlier and then positive after arrival.

 

[ethernet]

Will a coronavirus vaccine *actually* stop you getting COVID? - ABC listen

As the world eagerly awaits the rollout of a coronavirus vaccine, it’s worth looking at exactly how it might and might not work. While we know from trials that the vaccines are very good at stopping people from getting sick from COVID, that’s not the same as a vaccine protecting against getting...

www.abc.net.au

My earlier comments were spot on, reflected in this interview. Operations Research or OR makes this a no-brainer for the UK. It explains Australia's lets kick this down the road for 3 months. The skinny is don't expect international travel soon - there is no way, say WA will accept lower risk, for vaccines that did not measure asymptomatic spreaders. However the Oxford one did measure a subset - only that data is not in the public domain.

I also express political distrust when politician spokepersons say things like Pfizer mRNA first followed with an Oxford Booster. There are no combo studies like this as far as I know of. It feels like our pollies are drip feeding the news to keep that North Korea fly ban active.

 

[RooFlyer]

So pointless to test pax before flying to Australia.

O

Pre-testing does not guarantee covid won’t arrive in Australia. There have been a few cases of pre-testing a few days earlier and then positive after arrival.

I'm in favour of pre-testing say 1-3 days prior to departure - it will catch at least some who are either asymptomatic or possibly not quite yet infectious (I think) and who would be a danger to other passengers in the air and the arrival personnel. Not saying it will eliminate all imports of course, but anything to reduce the number of imported cases is OK as far as I'm concerned..

 

[RAM]

Better yet ditch exemptions for domestic transfers there is no reason for any one at all to fly domestically without quarantining at city of arrival its too risky for everyone else.

Secondly why are non citizen, non permanent residents being approved to travel to Australia ahead of those that live here. Whomever approved their travel owes Australia an explanation. In last 2 weeks ive had 2 different uber drivers tell me they have had tourists in their car who admitted they willingly did 2weeks quarantine so they could freely holiday in Australia, which is wrong if seats and hotel places are being taken for tourism ahead of genuine returning residents.

Short answer because the Federal Govt wants it that way. Just as the Fed Govt closed the borders (supposedly), they could simply state that only people registered with DFAT will be allowed into Australia from date X/Y/202Z. But they won't.

The last update I received about ratio of foreign nationals to Aust permanent residents or citizens coming in to Australia was it has dropped from the 60%+ levels seen in June/July to around the 45-50% level currently. The 'close relatives' exemption continues to be pushed from some countries in particular.

As Lynda2475 went on to detail in a subsequent post there are many exemptions allowing foreign nationals in.

One of those exemptions there are nearly 700 hundred 'occupations' such as artist, entertainer, Cinema mgr, clothing trades worker, complementary health therapist, conference/event organiser, cook (no chef is separate class - ABC reported on young Indonesian arriving in Darwin as part of International student 'test' flight to do cooking course = on graduation can become Aust Perm resident, cheap way to purchase Australian citizenship?), cotton grower, dance teacher (for private tuition not school), dancer (exotic or otherwise), drama teacher (for private tuition not school), driving instructor, equipment hire mgr, fitness centre mgr, FLIGHT ATTENDANTS (occupation 451711), florist, flower grower, footballer, fuit/nut grower, funeral workers, gardener (general), hairdresser, HR advisor, HR mgr, importer/exporter??, kennel hand, market research analyst (aka dinner time call centre operator), PA, swimming coach/instructor including learn to swim (which to be acredited in NSW only requires ten days all-up as one of our children did the course in February after discovering the hourly pay rates, was due to go full time during school holidays when CV hit ) etc etc. Not happy Jan!

Can someone please explain this one to me? "Member of Parliament" occupation # 111312 under the 'Regional Sponsor Migration Scheme' - don't we have enough 'skilled' party hacks already in Australia? Come to think of it.....

111312 MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT

• Alternative Title:
  • Parliamentarian
• Represents the interests of people in a constituency as their elected member to national, state or territory parliament.
  Skill Level: 1
  Specialisations:
  • Chief Minister (Aus)
    Government Minister
    Member of the Legislative Assembly (Aus)
    Member of the Legislative Council (Aus)
    Premier (Aus)
    Prime Minister
    Senator (Aus)

If you have the time it is very revealing on just how great a shortage there is in Australia of 'skilled' personnel. No flight attendants to be found anywhere currently!!!!

Equally you can call yourself the CEO or Chairman of a company (costs $1,500 or so to establish) & you're in.

Perhaps that provides an understanding why there is an ever growing queue of Australian citizens or permanent residents registered with DFAT who cannot get flights home. All up 35 pages of 20 occupations per page, 'sports official' is another one where we obviously can't get any good Rugby Union sports officials anymore!

https://immi.homeaffairs.gov.au/visas/working-in-australia/skill-occupation-list#

So say there's an IT worker on a PR basis then they're able to bring in foreign national wife/partner, children of each & 'dependents' which seems to be interpreted quite generously. ABC reported on Monday about a 93 yr old male coming in recently on that basis into Sydney - no he was not the 'partner'. Exemption was sought for non-hotel quarantine but refused. Due to health of 93 yr old, an Australian-based relative was allowed to pay & go into quarantine (although already in Australia not arriving from overseas) to care for him.

Similar questions for the international student experiments so far. Media have not asked the question - why are they being brought in late Nov/ early Dec? Reason: most are required/need to take English or maths bridging 'private courses' run by these 'public' colleges/universities before entering their college/uni courses in Feb/March 2021.

Typically a pre-condition for being accepted into a 'public' course is participation in a 'bridging' or 'transition' program that requires the overseas students to pay for College/University supplied full board accomodation as well as the bridging course'. Often the cost of this bridging course is greater than the annual fees for the subsequent public course.

UNSW AFAIK is not involved in any of these recent student flights but here is an excerpt from their 'private' wholly owned subsidiary - UNSW Global:
UNSW Global provides leading university pathway programs, comprehensive language courses and flexible English language teacher training. We also equip educators with cutting-edge assessment solutions to support highly targeted learning strategies.

A strong legacy of innovation underpins everything we do. We were the first provider of foundation studies in Australia, offering students a seamless transition to university. We also pioneered the development of independent assessment programs for schools, allowing teachers to better harness data about their students.

That's why around 250 international students have been brought in Nov/Dec.

 

[RooFlyer]

Short answer because the Federal Govt wants it that way. Just as the Fed Govt closed the borders (supposedly), they could simply state that only people registered with DFAT will be allowed into Australia from date X/Y/202Z. But they won't.

Well, I tried to wade through that a couple of times, but came up short. Are you conflating the so-called 'priority' (?) of "non citizen, non permanent residents being approved to travel to Australia ahead of those that live here" during COVID repatriations with the entry requirements under the Migration Act, or usual rules for entry into Australia of skilled/unskilled labour?

 

[jakeseven7]

Gold standard....? maybe silver now as VICs process of screening airside seems more sensible

Luckily this is historical

——

Another traveller found to have breached Sydney quarantine and flown to Melbourne


Victorian authorities have confirmed another case of someone evading hotel quarantine in Sydney and flying into Melbourne, after a man arrived from San Francisco in July.

The breach was identified by airline staff on July 14 and the man was forced into quarantine at a Melbourne hotel, where he later tested negative to COVID-19.

Another traveller found to have breached Sydney quarantine and flown to Melbourne

Victorian authorities have confirmed a second case of someone evading hotel quarantine in Sydney and flying into Melbourne, after a man arrived from San Francisco via NSW in July.

www.smh.com.au

 

[RooFlyer]

Two cases, Lady and 2 children, international arrivals in hotel quarantine, tested positive for COVID in Hobart. Being moved to Royal Hobart Hospital because of the age of the kids, rather than medi hotel, in first instance.

Accepted as expected by the Premier.

 

[justinbrett]

I love how Victoria is now throwing stones after the complete debacle they've displayed all year.

Reading into the story it sounds like the pax used his airline employee status to fool NSW into getting an exemption. Back then people were getting exemptions - you may recall a pax to MCY who tested positive after arriving in QLD via SYD.

 

[RooFlyer]

The pax to Tasmania came in a Qantas repatriation flight. All pax were tested prior to departure and had to test negative to board, but ‘Qantas policy’ is not to test children under 12.

 

[pagingjoan]

I love how Victoria is now throwing stones after the complete debacle they've displayed all year.

Reading into the story it sounds like the pax used his airline employee status to fool NSW into getting an exemption. Back then people were getting exemptions - you may recall a pax to MCY who tested positive after arriving in QLD via SYD.

“Victoria is now throwing stones”?
Perhaps you could attribute that to the AMA.
But “Victoria”?

 

[justinbrett]

“Victoria is now throwing stones”?
Perhaps you could attribute that to the AMA.
But “Victoria”?

A Victorian government spokeswoman said the examples of NSW breaches could not happen in Melbourne due to all international arrivals being processed ‘air-side’. She called on other states to tighten their protocols.

 

[pagingjoan]

Yes. I did read that. Sounds a sensible course of action.

 

[justinbrett]

Yes. I did read that. Sounds a sensible course of action.

Yep, throwing stones....

 

[dajop]

I love how Victoria is now throwing stones after the complete debacle they've displayed all year.

Victoria throwing stones or the media being the media and trying to make a mountain out of a molehill in pursuit of commercial interests? When asked by a reporter what’s DHHS supposed to say, yeh it was our fault he came through? It was their fault though they didn’t alert other pax on the same flight.

 

[Lynda2475]

Even with airside processing, Victoria can still have issues given there are many exemptions in place.

If we want to remove the risk of domestic connections without qurantine we need to remove all exemptions and insist everyone even diplomats do 2 weeks hotel quarantine, but international law means this isnt possible.

 

[justinbrett]

Victoria throwing stones or the media being the media and trying to make a mountain out of a molehill in pursuit of commercial interests? When asked by a reporter what’s DHHS supposed to say, yeh it was our fault he came through? It was their fault though they didn’t alert other pax on the same flight.

I just find it incredibly condescending when the only state to have a major quarantine failure was Victoria, and they're not even a week into resuming international flights and they have the gall to tell other states to tighten their protocols. Meanwhile NSW have been doing the heavy lifting and processed somewhere in the order of 100,000 pax.