Hotel Management penny pinching with aircon motion sensors

[exceladdict]

I experienced this in some early stays at a hotel in AU when they were new, but have not noticed it in more recent stays - a positive indication that feedback can change policy.

 

[Seat0B]

Novotel Suites Berlin Potsdamer Platz did this in reverse during our stay in December when it was freezing. We are from Canberra so don't mind sleeping cool. Set the aircon to the lowest setting overnight 18 degrees. Woke up every night about 4 am freezing cold as the aircon seemed to be set on a timer - or maybe it was the motion thing. Mr Seat 0A checked on his travel thermometer (yes, it's a thing, he buys them in Japan every time we go there) and found that our room got down to 12 degrees overnight - which is pretty brisk. We did not mention it - by the time we had hard evidence other than "I'm freezing cold", we only had one more night to go, and given there had been a bit of attitude from reception at this place when we checked in, I could not be bothered. Just wore more clothes to bed. It's much easier to warm up if you are cold, than to cool down if you are hot and already sleeping naked with no bed covers on .

So I guess it would do the same thing and get hot overnight in summer.

 

[RooFlyer]

I just discovered that the Royce Hotel in St Kilda, Melbourne does this. Set 19 degrees, woke up hot in the middle of the night with reading 23 degrees. Reset but warm again by morning.

Asked at reception and they confirmed that motion sensors are used.

I shall provide feedback - its otherwise a very good hotel.

 

[albatross710]

I recall a household aircon system that we had in Townsville. It had a mode designed to lower consumption during the night as a sleeping body can tolerate a higher room temperature.

Then a few years later I came across this in a Milan hotel, room was great before going to bed but we were all waking up about 3:30 when the aircon was off.

I would be annoyed at a hotel if they were inconveniencing those annoying customers which actually pay their bill.

 

[jastel]

Most hotels have a switch to shut off a/c if you open the balcony doors as well to save power and condensation damage in humid places.

 

[tdimdad]

Ooh, I'd love a warm room overnight! More seriously, I hate having aircon on while I sleep and always turn it off, if possible. Or, in locations like Singapore, set it to a much higher temperature overnight (ideally 24-26C). Or, in Darwin, a through-breeze with the fan quietly circulating the air.

In other words, just let the customer to decide how they want their room temperature at any given time they are in. A smarter way would be to connect the aircon to the keycard slot at the entry which controls the electricity outlets & lights in the room: keycard in = aircon control is active, keycard off = aircon is in an automated mode.

 

[VPS]

I think all new hotels should be built with ceiling fans - most time you want some air circulating especially above the bed

 

[dajop]

Ooh, I'd love a warm room overnight! More seriously, I hate having aircon on while I sleep and always turn it off, if possible. Or, in locations like Singapore, set it to a much higher temperature overnight (ideally 24-26C). Or, in Darwin, a through-breeze with the fan quietly circulating the air.

I think it's very much a matter of having a consistent sleeping temperature. No good starting at 22 and ending at 27.

I'm also Ok with 24-26 but only if I have a sheet to sleep under - if I'm in the tropics I don't want or need a thick doona/duvet/quilt that's more suited to Scandinavia in the winter. Even though it looks plush and luxurious.

 

[eric2011]

A smarter way would be to connect the aircon to the keycard slot at the entry which controls the electricity outlets & lights in the room: keycard in = aircon control is active, keycard off = aircon is in an automated mode.

Sorry, but when its 30 degrees outside as it is very often in Brisbane, when I get back to the hotel in the evening after dinner etc I want my room to already be 21. And now that we have a digital drivers licence I don't have a spare card to leave in the slot.

 

[docjames]

I don’t interpret it as a primary money saving exercise (although no doubt helps) but more an an environmental approach t reduce electricity consumption and therefore reduce carbon usage.

I think the overnight is not the primary target - it the hours in the middle of the day when no-one is in the room.

Agree - as a process it doesn’t work well (for all the reasons others have illustrated).

 

[Comoman]

Hilton Canopy London City has the movement sensors on the aircon.

 

[Gold Member]

I don’t interpret it as a primary money saving exercise (although no doubt helps) but more an an environmental approach t reduce electricity consumption and therefore reduce carbon usage.

I think the overnight is not the primary target - it the hours in the middle of the day when no-one is in the room.

Agree - as a process it doesn’t work well (for all the reasons others have illustrated).

Let me assure you, these measures are predominantly a cost cutting exercise purely designed to drive the property’s bottom line. Multiply the small financial benefit over several hundred rooms over 365 days a year and you have a huge source of cost savings.

The hotels on the other hand, will proudly tell you that this is all part of their environmentally friendly Green initiatives etc. Hogwash. Or should I say Greenwash.

I’m sure they’re already devising a carbon offset program that you can pay for keeping your aircon on all night. While they’re at it, why not turn the mini-bar off because it’s better for the environment, reduce the wattage to room lights, or only change bed linen and towels when you remember to ask and/or find some obscure note or object next to your bed. Oh, they already do that.

 

[wombatpatties]

Like the airlines, Hotel Management have figured out another way to save a buck - configure the aircon to automatically turn off when the guest is asleep. It’s been around for ages. And while this might be OK in temperate climates, in warmer climates or summer periods this is a nightmare.

I don’t need to remind you how it goes - After falling asleep in a comfortably cool room that you carefully set on the aircon display before tucking in, within 10-30 minutes the aircon detects no movement and is configured to switch off - to save money of course. Over the next hour or so, the room heats up to an unbearable temperature which wakes you from your sleep. Your movement in bed or trudging back to the aircon display to find out that the aircon is no longer switched on triggers the infrared movement sensor to reactivate the aircon. The room takes another hour or two to cool down again to your defined setting. Rinse and repeat several times throughout the night and you have a recipe for an unhappy and cranky guest that didn’t get much sleep for one or many consecutive nights.

It‘s pure penny pinching to save a buck at the expense of the customer’s comfort. Never mind the fact you spent a shedload on that room/suite - your comfort and ability to sleep is of no concern to hotel Management if they can save a buck. And to make it worse, when you ask them to fix it, they lie and tell you it’s been done after maintenance comes visit, or that it can’t be done, or they move you to a different room without the same aircon and motion sensor problem.

I’m over it. This has to be one of my biggest frustrations with hotels nowadays. So in recent times I have taken a stand against hotels that employ this penny pinching policy with their aircon. I have successfully managed to get full/partial refunds for several stays at different hotels around the world over the past year or two by explaining how I endured restless nights due to this cheap penny pinching policy that Management has very deliberately employed. It has taken patience and a constructive approach with the right hotel staff to help them understand the issue, let alone seek recourse. Some properties were unwilling to compensate me appropriately, if at all. In these circumstances, upon returning home I escalate to hotel chain management (eg. Diamond/Platinum desk) who duly acknowledge the problem, apologise and try to make things right by compensating me with an appropriate amount of points.

Considering the extortionate prices the hotels are charging these days, we deserve much better than this. I encourage everyone to stand up to this type of hotel Management behaviour by calling it out and seeking a resolution that you feel is appropriate for your circumstances. If we make them pay, eventually it will start costing the hotels too much (both financially and reputationally) and the feedback might actually resonate. They may even end up reversing their aircon penny pinching policy. (Does that leave you with a reverse cycle aircon?? ).

In the meantime, can anyone suggest a cheap and quiet mechanism that will trigger movement in the room every so often to avoid this issue? I assume most if not all sensors use infrared detection, so it would need sufficient intermittent movement of a hot/cold source to differentiate from the ambient room temperature.

Yes, how about a cat toy? Solar powered through the day, moves at night with swaying actions, or jumping parts to re activate that rotten air con?

 

[AshM]

Like the airlines, Hotel Management have figured out another way to save a buck - configure the aircon to automatically turn off when the guest is asleep. It’s been around for ages. And while this might be OK in temperate climates, in warmer climates or summer periods this is a nightmare.

I don’t need to remind you how it goes - After falling asleep in a comfortably cool room that you carefully set on the aircon display before tucking in, within 10-30 minutes the aircon detects no movement and is configured to switch off - to save money of course. Over the next hour or so, the room heats up to an unbearable temperature which wakes you from your sleep. Your movement in bed or trudging back to the aircon display to find out that the aircon is no longer switched on triggers the infrared movement sensor to reactivate the aircon. The room takes another hour or two to cool down again to your defined setting. Rinse and repeat several times throughout the night and you have a recipe for an unhappy and cranky guest that didn’t get much sleep for one or many consecutive nights.

It‘s pure penny pinching to save a buck at the expense of the customer’s comfort. Never mind the fact you spent a shedload on that room/suite - your comfort and ability to sleep is of no concern to hotel Management if they can save a buck. And to make it worse, when you ask them to fix it, they lie and tell you it’s been done after maintenance comes visit, or that it can’t be done, or they move you to a different room without the same aircon and motion sensor problem.

I’m over it. This has to be one of my biggest frustrations with hotels nowadays. So in recent times I have taken a stand against hotels that employ this penny pinching policy with their aircon. I have successfully managed to get full/partial refunds for several stays at different hotels around the world over the past year or two by explaining how I endured restless nights due to this cheap penny pinching policy that Management has very deliberately employed. It has taken patience and a constructive approach with the right hotel staff to help them understand the issue, let alone seek recourse. Some properties were unwilling to compensate me appropriately, if at all. In these circumstances, upon returning home I escalate to hotel chain management (eg. Diamond/Platinum desk) who duly acknowledge the problem, apologise and try to make things right by compensating me with an appropriate amount of points.

Considering the extortionate prices the hotels are charging these days, we deserve much better than this. I encourage everyone to stand up to this type of hotel Management behaviour by calling it out and seeking a resolution that you feel is appropriate for your circumstances. If we make them pay, eventually it will start costing the hotels too much (both financially and reputationally) and the feedback might actually resonate. They may even end up reversing their aircon penny pinching policy. (Does that leave you with a reverse cycle aircon?? ).

In the meantime, can anyone suggest a cheap and quiet mechanism that will trigger movement in the room every so often to avoid this issue? I assume most if not all sensors use infrared detection, so it would need sufficient intermittent movement of a hot/cold source to differentiate from the ambient room temperature.

I've experienced this too - and also complained to hotel management about it, attaching a link to formal guidelines on the scientifically recommended temperatures for sleep. It's cheap, it's nasty and it's often done in the name of environmental responsibility (reducing carbon emissions, etc). There are other ways of achieving this (such as key activation, daytime only motion sensors, etc), I noted.

The other thing I've encountered is a thermostat that cannot be reduced below, say, 21 degrees celsius. Similar issue.

The primary purpose of a hotel is to provide a place to sleep. A dark, quiet, cool room with decent bedding is non-negotiable. Most other things, while valued, are decoration.

 

[Spacetravel]

So any chance that you dudes who claim to have experienced this might post hotel names / locations?

I had 2 stays at Hilton Garden Inn Singapore recently and they are a big offender of this. After 20 minutes without movement the aircon shuts off. Spending my stay on the top level was very unpleasant, returning to a very hot room and during sleep being woken up several times by how hot the room would get. In addition, the aircon temperature was centrally controlled and wasn’t able to be manually adjusted.

It was so bad (there were also noisy construction issues) I cancelled my up coming stay and booked at Hilton Singapore Orchard which I found also has an occupancy sensor. However it is nowhere near as bad as HGI. It seemed to do a better job of knowing when I was in the room vs out and it would only set the AC temp to 24 degrees instead of turning off completely. Also the AC seemed to work pretty well, so even at 24 it was only slightly warm. It was still frustrating as at least once a night I’d have to change the temp back to my preferred temperature.

 

[Primrose]

Like the airlines, Hotel Management have figured out another way to save a buck - configure the aircon to automatically turn off when the guest is asleep. It’s been around for ages. And while this might be OK in temperate climates, in warmer climates or summer periods this is a nightmare.

I don’t need to remind you how it goes - After falling asleep in a comfortably cool room that you carefully set on the aircon display before tucking in, within 10-30 minutes the aircon detects no movement and is configured to switch off - to save money of course. Over the next hour or so, the room heats up to an unbearable temperature which wakes you from your sleep. Your movement in bed or trudging back to the aircon display to find out that the aircon is no longer switched on triggers the infrared movement sensor to reactivate the aircon. The room takes another hour or two to cool down again to your defined setting. Rinse and repeat several times throughout the night and you have a recipe for an unhappy and cranky guest that didn’t get much sleep for one or many consecutive nights.

It‘s pure penny pinching to save a buck at the expense of the customer’s comfort. Never mind the fact you spent a shedload on that room/suite - your comfort and ability to sleep is of no concern to hotel Management if they can save a buck. And to make it worse, when you ask them to fix it, they lie and tell you it’s been done after maintenance comes visit, or that it can’t be done, or they move you to a different room without the same aircon and motion sensor problem.

I’m over it. This has to be one of my biggest frustrations with hotels nowadays. So in recent times I have taken a stand against hotels that employ this penny pinching policy with their aircon. I have successfully managed to get full/partial refunds for several stays at different hotels around the world over the past year or two by explaining how I endured restless nights due to this cheap penny pinching policy that Management has very deliberately employed. It has taken patience and a constructive approach with the right hotel staff to help them understand the issue, let alone seek recourse. Some properties were unwilling to compensate me appropriately, if at all. In these circumstances, upon returning home I escalate to hotel chain management (eg. Diamond/Platinum desk) who duly acknowledge the problem, apologise and try to make things right by compensating me with an appropriate amount of points.

Considering the extortionate prices the hotels are charging these days, we deserve much better than this. I encourage everyone to stand up to this type of hotel Management behaviour by calling it out and seeking a resolution that you feel is appropriate for your circumstances. If we make them pay, eventually it will start costing the hotels too much (both financially and reputationally) and the feedback might actually resonate. They may even end up reversing their aircon penny pinching policy. (Does that leave you with a reverse cycle aircon?? ).

In the meantime, can anyone suggest a cheap and quiet mechanism that will trigger movement in the room every so often to avoid this issue? I assume most if not all sensors use infrared detection, so it would need sufficient intermittent movement of a hot/cold source to differentiate from the ambient room temperature.

We had the same problem in Europe recently. Hotels had turned the cooling off even thought they were advertising cooling on the booking sites. False advertising. When we fronted them of course there was nothing they could do because management further up had made the decision to turn the air conditioning off at a certain date no matter if the weather was still hot!! It is robbery and false advertising.

 

[RooFlyer]

The primary purpose of a hotel is to provide a place to sleep. A dark, quiet, cool room with decent bedding is non-negotiable. Most other things, while valued, are decoration.

110% !

That’s exactly what I tell them when I encounter noisy aircon, poor insulation between rooms, rooms positioned over bars and terraces, ‘special event’ blaring noise into all the small hours.

I don’t need any view - I can’t see that while I’m sleeping, but I can hear and be woken up during the night

A cool to cold room promotes best sleep.

 

[JohnPhelan]

I'm far more concerned about the temperature in aircraft cabins for overnight flights - certain airlines set the temp waaay too high, given that you are wearing clothes (of one sort or another) and under the provided blanket!

 

[Beano]

I found one room in a hotel in Melbourne where the lights are controlled by motion sensors. All the lights went off when I was reading on the bed, but I think that was an error. I have stayed in different rooms of the same hotel with no problem

 

[Spacetravel]

I'm far more concerned about the temperature in aircraft cabins for overnight flights - certain airlines set the temp waaay too high, given that you are wearing clothes (of one sort or another) and under the provided blanket!

Agreed, almost all airlines set it too hot for me. Some are worst offenders than others. I’ve actually found Qantas one of the best for not overheating the cabin though. Even then I have seen on the screen the cabin crew set the temp at 24 degrees at sleep time.