IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALAEA

[simongr]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

They said 1000 so far. But you're right, 1000 jobs going OS is acceptable; I think 1200 job losses is the threshold for when it becomes inappropriate; but maybe you can clarify as to what that figure is?
"These people" won't be spited; but you will be delayed. When you are sitting in the airport all alone,bored and angry, just remember not to look across at the VA flights (and best not look in a mirror either).

I think you know that I was commenting on the hyperbole. Again - are these jobs going overseas as numerous people have pointed out that the jobs can not go overseas by their very nature.

I am not sure what "best not to look in a mirror" is meant to mean either. Should I be ashamed of having an opinion different to yours? I caution you to play the ball not the man.

 

[ausi ski bum]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

1. He's trying to both protect you and further his union's position by alerting you to the likliehood that your flight will be disrupted.
Why would you go ahead and book QF when you have so many other safe options available. You would just be irresponsible to go ahead with a QF flight at the moment when you have full knowledge of pending industrial action. Your holiday is only threatened if you book QF. So don't.
2. Their jobs are heading overseas anyway. They have nothing to lose.

I booked my tickets months ago, its not like I have a choice now but I do prefer Qantas to Jet* and JAL when heading to Tokyo especially when carting heaps of ski gear, I get my extra kilo allowance for starters.

This new practice of declaring a strike then cancelling it the day before after Qantas has already cancelled the flights is really bad, in other words we will maximise the damage to Qantas but expect you to still pay our members. I would look at legal ways of recovering the cost of this from the Union.

The Union in this matter has the public off side, no union can afford to do that. Those that have in the past allowed massive change in their industries and the union became irrelivant (Warfies, BLF)

 

[browski]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

Should I be ashamed of having an opinion different to yours?

You can have your own opinion, you just cannot have your own facts.

 

[nlagalle]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

You can have your own opinion, you just cannot have your own facts.

But you have had facts stated to you, yet you ignore them.

 

[FlyboyAl]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

I just checked in at LAX and the lovely lady here said she was not aware of any issues coming up fro Wednesday.
She also said they ought to be grateful to have a job at the moment rather than fighting QANTAS into the ground.

My wife has since told me the problems have moved to J*, and check in staff not charging for excess baggage, so hopefully its a smooth trip home to ADL.

 

[NM]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

I guess my choice to fly CX today instead of QF didn't avoid the delays. CX102/103 was delayed ex-CNS to my BNE-HKG is still going to be at least 75 mins late regardless of anything APIA or any other QF workers unions attempts to cause havock.

 

[drron]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

They said 1000 so far. But you're right, 1000 jobs going OS is acceptable; I think 1200 job losses is the threshold for when it becomes inappropriate; but maybe you can clarify as to what that figure is?
"These people" won't be spited; but you will be delayed. When you are sitting in the airport all alone,bored and angry, just remember not to look across at the VA flights (and best not look in a mirror either).

And where do they say a 1000 jobs are going OS?
1000 jobs are being made redundant-many of those jobs could not be sent OS.
A new airline in Asia is being set up.Makes sense to me as much more potential for growth there than here.These are not Aussie jobs but new Asian jobs.

You can have your own opinion, you just cannot have your own facts.

Haven't seen you give any facts yet.
And I am going to fly QF more to spite the Unionists.
And if my worst fears are realised and JQ takes over all QF longhaul then I will blame people with opinions such as yours.And i will get great satisfaction when you start complaining of ever increasing VA fares or decrease in standards.

 

[rechoboam]

1. He's trying to both protect you and further his union's position by alerting you to the likliehood that your flight will be disrupted.
Why would you go ahead and book QF when you have so many other safe options available. You would just be irresponsible to go ahead with a QF flight at the moment when you have full knowledge of pending industrial action. Your holiday is only threatened if you book QF. So don't.
2. Their jobs are heading overseas anyway. They have nothing to lose.

Oh thank you so much for this helpful advice. What you might have missed though is that businesses like mine might just have booked expensive and complex arrangements six months ago that can't be unwound at this time.

 

[markis10]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

And where do they say a 1000 jobs are going OS?
1000 jobs are being made redundant-many of those jobs could not be sent OS.
A new airline in Asia is being set up.Makes sense to me as much more potential for growth there than here.These are not Aussie jobs but new Asian jobs.

I beg to differ on the basis of being a past professional aviation participant with many friends on the frontline, if we forget the 5000 or so already gone in the last two big sweeps of 2009 and 2006 here is whats happening:

120 Pilots jobs to Emirates on furlough
350 Cabin crew in addition to the 150 from 2009

In terms of engineers:

20-30 in Base Maintenance Sydney due to the retirement of 4 x 747-400 aircraft.

128 LAMEs across the country due to the commencement of maintenance on demand.


Thats close to 800 jobs alone at the frontline that will be gone OS from this round, if we factor in Jetconnect, overseas heavy maintenance (OGG just got back from a repaint) and overseas cabin crew organisations, its very much a case of jobs going overseas, if your still not sure hop on JQ35 SYD-MEL and look at the crew makeup!

 

[nlagalle]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

I beg to differ on the basis of being a past professional aviation participant with many friends on the frontline, if we forget the 5000 or so already gone in the last two big sweeps of 2009 and 2006 here is whats happening:

120 Pilots jobs to Emirates on furlough
350 Cabin crew in addition to the 150 from 2009

In terms of engineers:

20-30 in Base Maintenance Sydney due to the retirement of 4 x 747-400 aircraft.

128 LAMEs across the country due to the commencement of maintenance on demand.


Thats close to 800 jobs alone at the frontline that will be gone OS from this round, if we factor in Jetconnect, overseas heavy maintenance (OGG just got back from a repaint) and overseas cabin crew organisations, its very much a case of jobs going overseas, if your still not sure hop on JQ35 SYD-MEL and look at the crew makeup!

But we have similar issues in many other industries too. Slimming down the workforce isn't unique to QF. I know in my industry there are plenty of staff being going and at the moment not replaced. some redundancies are around to and many things are centralised or outsourced.

 

[markis10]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

But we have similar issues in many other industries too. Slimming down the workforce isn't unique to QF. I know in my industry there are plenty of staff being going and at the moment not replaced. some redundancies are around to and many things are centralised or outsourced.

We sure have, usually followed a few years later by a retraction/reversal of strategy and the realisation of the true cost of such a move when skills are in short supply, which is exactly whats happening in the Aviation industry right now with both engineers and crew. As I have pointed out, CX have crew bases in each Australian capital city, so why does QF as the flag carrier feel they dont need the same, I would suggest one understands quality and consistency of service better than the other and time will prove this!

On the safety front, we are just following in the US LCC's directions, which makes this report interesting and very much applicable reading given the recent CASA dress down by the FAA and their own issues stated here:

DOT - Air Carriers' Outsourcing of Aircraft Maintenance | Office of Inspector General

 

[JohnPhelan]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

120 Pilots jobs to Emirates on furlough
350 Cabin crew in addition to the 150 from 2009

In terms of engineers:

20-30 in Base Maintenance Sydney due to the retirement of 4 x 747-400 aircraft.

128 LAMEs across the country due to the commencement of maintenance on demand.

Thats close to 800 jobs alone at the frontline that will be gone OS from this round

The jobs have gone, not "gone OS".

 

[Pushka]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

Cant help but think that the CEO has contributed to the sense of entitlement amongst Union members by the announcements of his salary packaging in the last few weeks. Imagine the power and Public support he would have now if he had said he was suspending his package increases for the next 12 months because the Airline couldn't afford it in the current environment.

 

[nlagalle]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

Cant help but think that the CEO has contributed to the sense of entitlement amongst Union members by the announcements of his salary packaging in the last few weeks. Imagine the power and Public support he would have now if he had said he was suspending his package increases for the next 12 months because the Airline couldn't afford it in the current environment.

Problem is that every CEO's remuneration package is available for all to see. And from what I have seen, there are CEO's getting paid a lot more than him (I'm not defending him in any either). Just look at the banks!

 

[markis10]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

The jobs have gone, not "gone OS".

Really, well the jobs have gone overseas even if some lucky folks get to live in Australia while working for a NZ company etc

 

[oz_mark]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

Problem is that every CEO's remuneration package is available for all to see. And from what I have seen, there are CEO's getting paid a lot more than him (I'm not defending him in any either). Just look at the banks!

Since Qantas like to compare how much their employees get versus employees at other airlines in the world, perhaps it is worth noting that Joyce is amongst the highest paid airline CEO's, worldwide.

 

[JohnPhelan]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

Since Qantas like to compare how much their employees get versus employees at other airlines in the world, perhaps it is worth noting that Joyce is amongst the highest paid airline CEO's, worldwide.

This is interesting. Could you give us a link to wherever this comparison is able to be viewed?

 

[nlagalle]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

This is interesting. Could you give us a link to wherever this comparison is able to be viewed?

i found one from the Geoff Dixon era circ 2008:

Airlines' CEO Top Pay List — Civil Aviation Forum | Airliners.net

[FONT=ARIAL,]Glenn Tilton - UA - $US10.3 million
Geoff Dixon - QF - $AUD11.92 million
Douglas Steenland - NW - $US7.73 million
Larry Kellner - CO - $US7.31 million
Douglas Parker - US - $US5.4 million
Gerard Arpey - AA - $US3.1 million
Willie Walsh - BA - £701,000
Jean-Cyril Spinetta - AF-KLM - €1.39 million
Wolfgang Mayrhuber - LH - €2.4 million
Chew Choon Seng - SIA - $S3.5 million[/FONT]

 

[QF WP]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

Hmmm, some 2009 data from US based airlines' CEO paypackets here and the AP data set for all S&P500 companies in 2009 here.

Still trawling for other relevant up-to-date data for 2010....this is an interesting site

 

[Pushka]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

Problem is that every CEO's remuneration package is available for all to see. And from what I have seen, there are CEO's getting paid a lot more than him (I'm not defending him in any either). Just look at the banks!

Yes, I understand that his salary is public knowledge, I am not saying he should have hidden it, but he should not have accepted the pay rise, because his prime objective at the moment is sending jobs offshore. And it seems from later posts he earns much more than other airline CEO's. I am NO union lover, quite the opposite, but he can hardly winge about what the Unions are trying to do when he himself is rather greedy.