Is QF ever likely to fly into Dubai again?

[Quickstatus]

EK’s lack of landing rights at BER

It's more than that. These airlines are not allowed to fly into LH not because they have maxed out their landing rights.
BER is an airport which serves Germany's largest city (at least by population) but receives very little international traffic. If it were a matter of capacity, there is nothing stopping foreign airlines operating into BER and reducing its flights into the other 4.

I recall the bilateral agreements actually exclude BER at least between DEU and the UAE.

I believe the only foreign airline who has a significant presence in BER is U2

The reason: politics
The actor: LH

 

[SYD]

It's more than that. These airlines are not allowed to fly into LH not because they have maxed out their landing rights.
BER is an airport which serves Germany's largest city (at least by population) but receives very little international traffic. If it were a matter of capacity, there is nothing stopping foreign airlines operating into BER and reducing its flights into the other 4.

I recall the bilateral agreements actually exclude BER at least between DEU and the UAE.

I believe the only foreign airline who has a significant presence in BER is U2

The reason: politics
The actor: LH

QR flies in/out of BER (some good fares ex ASIA also).

There was a whole seperate thread about QF setting up to go to BER…

[Conjecture]Qantas to move European base to Berlin (BER)?

I just got a rumour from a friend of mine who was on European holiday recently and he was speaking to a bunch TXL ATC guys. The new Berlin_Brandenburg_Airport is due to open 2012 and he was told that QF will be moving from LHR to BER, (including some QF A380's to the new airport). This is...

www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au

 

[Quickstatus]

QR flies in/out of BER (

. Good to know. In recent times the Berliners and especially the chambers of commerce or it's equivalent have been making noises about the difficulties their citizens face when trying to fly overseas and the cost to the city.

 

[SYD]

. Good to know. In recent times the Berliners and especially the chambers of commerce or it's equivalent have been making noises about the difficulties their citizens face when trying to fly overseas and the cost to the city.

I suspect that will change post Covid and now that BER is up and running properly - I did only open in Oct 2020 - just as things were really going pear shaped.

 

[dajop]

QR flies in/out of BER (some good fares ex ASIA also).

According to wikipedia, there are five other carriers flying or commencing scheduled medium/long haul flights (using 2500 miles, say, as the benchmark).

These include United (EWR and soon to be IAD), Delta (soon to start JFK), Hainan (PEK), Norse Atlantic (JFK, FLL and seasonal LAX) and of course closer to home for most here, Scoot (SIN). Not counting seasonal chart on SmartLynx to DXB!

 

[salimedwardo]

Not that much destinational demand into the UAE as both QF and VA1 discovered with their forays into Dubai and Abu Dhabi.

 

[RSD]

that much destinational demand into the UAE as both QF and VA1 discovered with their forays into Dubai and Abu Dhabi.

I don't see UAE as being a destination, more a good hub to feed into like QF do with flying into AA's hubs. Fly into Dubai and the passengers can then connect onto EK flights to wherever they want to go to - Africa or Europe. Way more convenient than QF to London then getting another flight down to say somewhere in Morocco etc.

 

[RichardMEL]

I don't see UAE as being a destination, more a good hub to feed into like QF do with flying into AA's hubs. Fly into Dubai and the passengers can then connect onto EK flights to wherever they want to go to - Africa or Europe. Way more convenient than QF to London then getting another flight down to say somewhere in Morocco etc.

Totally agree. The "power" of the ME3 hubs - specially DXB and DOH is their position geographically to provide good connecting options to/from most continents - specially with the subcontinent. Obviously access to oil and big gov subsidies help a great deal.

While there's obviously some O&D demand to the UAE or Qatar, it's trifling compared to the potentially hundreds of connecting opportunities.

EK, for example, is not filling all those 380's with people going to Dubai alone. Basically the same model SQ used from 80's/'90's with (relatively) large fleets of 747's.

DXB/DOH are pretty much the textbook example of connecting super hubs. AUH has fallen away due to EY's problems to a distant third imo (and let's just forget about somewhere like BAH since GF imploded)

 

[RSD]

Totally agree. The "power" of the ME3 hubs - specially DXB and DOH is their position geographically to provide good connecting options to/from most continents - specially with the subcontinent. Obviously access to oil and big gov subsidies help a great deal.

While there's obviously some O&D demand to the UAE or Qatar, it's trifling compared to the potentially hundreds of connecting opportunities.

EK, for example, is not filling all those 380's with people going to Dubai alone. Basically the same model SQ used from 80's/'90's with (relatively) large fleets of 747's.

DXB/DOH are pretty much the textbook example of connecting super hubs. AUH has fallen away due to EY's problems to a distant third imo (and let's just forget about somewhere like BAH since GF imploded)

I just wish that QF would see DXB as a hub like AA's hubs that they fly into and let us use QF/EK in that way.

 

[Quickstatus]

since GF imploded

Has it ever been profitable?

.......

QF would see DXB as a hub like AA's hubs

Its different to the AA hubs because EK operates a lot of seats between DXB and several ports in AUS
AA only has 1 daily into SYD

Because of this, it is better IMO for QF to concentrate on areas where it has an advantage

 

[HS-TQE]

Has it ever been profitable?

There's 1 common person that's been involved with Gulf Air and Etihad.

James Hogan.

 

[RSD]

There's 1 common person that's been involved with Gulf Air and Etihad.

James Hogan.

Isn't he the guy that is going to head up the new Saudi airline?

 

[dajop]

I don't see UAE as being a destination, more a good hub to feed into like QF do with flying into AA's hubs. Fly into Dubai and the passengers can then connect onto EK flights to wherever they want to go to - Africa or Europe. Way more convenient than QF to London then getting another flight down to say somewhere in Morocco etc.

Yes the difference is that AA do not fly their hub multiple times a day from multiple Australian cities. Ignoring LAX, which has significant origin/destination traffic what you’re talking about is DFW. If AA had double daily from MEL, SYD and BNE to DFW, QF would find it much more difficult to make DFW work too.

 

[jase05]

I just wish that QF would see DXB as a hub like AA's hubs that they fly into and let us use QF/EK in that way.

Who in their right mind would willingly choose to fly with QF over EK to DXB

Post automatically merged: Jan 15, 2023

Has it ever been profitable?

Sadly not. They offer a pretty good product too but they just haven’t been able to make it work

 

[RSD]

Who in their right mind would willingly choose to fly with QF over EK to DXB

Me due to the extra QF status credits!

 

[justinbrett]

Who in their right mind would willingly choose to fly with QF over EK to DXB

Me. EK is overrated.

Hard product is good but soft product is lacking - much prefer QF for that.

 

[p--and--t]

Who in their right mind would willingly choose to fly with QF over EK to DXB

Only travelled Y on EK (5times) would 200% choose QF over EK in Y where there is a choice

 

[dajop]

IME, EK A380. Fantastic in Y. Not that different to QF Y at all. EK 777 diabolical in Y.

 

[Quickstatus]

I have a little doubt about EK and rumours about treatment of its pilots

 

[RichardMEL]

As others have answered - QF *does* treat DXB like a hub - that's why they codeshare on all the EK services into DXB and then onwards. Thus QF can still offer one stop service to many cities.

As for SC's and the like - remember those that care about status etc are a minor population of QF flyers.

EK would be happy enough with the arrangement as QF's codeshares are guaranteed income for them and while they don't NEED QF per se, they definitely benefit. Costs to QF are less than putting their own metal into DXB and clearly they feel SIN is far better for them to deploy their own metal (and connections to/from SIN) from.

As for the EK product. F on the 380? Winds hands down for all the obvious reasons. J? it's good but it doesn't blow me away. yes, the bar is good fun and a point of difference, and the soft product is a lil better than QF (I'd rate ICE over the QF entertainment system, the F&B - specially Bev side is better... but the seats are boxy for mine and no pj's.. so it's a much more even comparision I guess). Y.. yeah the 3-4-3 in those 777's... no thank you. I'd prefer 3-3-3 on the QF 787's tbh.