Is QF ever likely to fly into Dubai again?

[justinbrett]

plus wonderful rail experiences in UK

Not at the moment! A friend of mine just had to get a bus from Edinburgh to London to catch her flight due to the rail issues.

Also at the best of times, three words you'll come to know intimately - "rail replacement bus".

I know we can't throw stones as Australians, but "wonderful rail experience" in terms of UK is very wishful thinking. At the best of times it's still way over priced, often cheaper to fly.

 

[jb747]

From an aviation perspective it was a terrible place. The sector from Oz was long. Long enough to be quite fuel inefficient. Huge amounts of holding, meaning that the overall fuel burn was much higher than a two stop with a stop closer to the middle.

 

[SYD]

From an aviation perspective it was a terrible place. The sector from Oz was long. Long enough to be quite fuel inefficient. Huge amounts of holding, meaning that the overall fuel burn was much higher than a two stop with a stop closer to the middle.

OT, but the tech stop in Bahrain was before my time but I was pondering just other day why there and not other ports? DXB didn’t exist but I guess other geo-political things in play? Besides cheap gas?

 

[Melburnian1]

Not at the moment! A friend of mine just had to get a bus from Edinburgh to London to catch her flight due to the rail issues.

Also at the best of times, three words you'll come to know intimately - "rail replacement bus".

I know we can't throw stones as Australians, but "wonderful rail experience" in terms of UK is very wishful thinking. At the best of times it's still way over priced, often cheaper to fly.

Agree that strikes are a problem (including 3 to 7 January, perhaps the longest so far) with one union apparently holding out despite some others having come to an agreement with rail operators and the government, but on a recent trip over three weeks I did not have to use a 'rail replacement bus' once on either short or numerous long distance trips, including London to Edinburgh and Glasgow to London. A tiny number of trains (3) were more than 10 minutes late of the 50 plus boardings around most areas of the confederation (bar Northern Ireland) that I had.

There was one cancelled train on a non-strike day but unlike Australia, an alternative rail route was available. On one strike day, an operator whose employees were not members of the union striking still operated, so I could travel to my intended destination. This wouldn't be possible in every case though.

When there are strikes, sometimes rail managers (suitably qualified) drive trains to provide a limited service. I couldn't see this ever occurring in Australia.

 

[Quickstatus]

Long enough to be quite fuel inefficient

What was difference in payload between the DXB summers and winters departing DXB on the long sectors

 

[SYD]

It can be very good to fly into London and then using an open jaw ticket, fly out of a European port to avoid the huge Air Passenger Duty levied in the UK.

I try and do this all the time. ITA Matrix is very handy to check which combos work best fare wise.

Plus there are cheap oneway flights from the UK to continental Europe (as well as trains).

 

[Lynda2475]

Let's list a few: AA, AI, BA, BI, BR, CI, CX, JL, KE, MH, NH, OZ, SQ, TG, TR, UA...not exhaustive.

My comment related specifically to QF, i do have a high points balance and status, and have been underwhelmed by BA planes that fly out of Australia (zero interest in sitting backwards)

Whilst I often come home via USA i prefer to go to UK via Asia on OneWorld preferably via Singapore, HK (although less attractive these days) or perhaps Tokyo. I am keen to try the direct flights from SYD when available. Coming home via PER works (i have done it), but timing doesnt work for me for departures (and the refurbed A380 has more in seat storage than dreamliner).

I have airlines i wont pay to fly i.e Air NZ as I havent forgiven them for wrecking Ansett and not honouring my RTW award - if employer pays then I will fly them, but i personally wont spend with them.

Others i wont fly at all due to poor safety or the need to transit ME, Malaysia or Indonesia or mainland China.

There are plenty of ME carriers for those that want to go there or transit there, no need for QF to resume flying there. Most people were very happy when QF1/2 returned to SIN (easiest airport to transit). If QF were to add new services imo better they be new or under serviced routes with decent OneWorld connections.

Each to their own, peoples travel needs and willingness to spend tourism dollars in places with disparate ideology and poor treatment of women differs.

 

[RichardMEL]

@Lynda2475 - the new BA club suite is now on the BA LHR-SIN-SYD flights iirc - replacing the reverse herringbone setup. I've not flown it but gets good reviews.

Anyway the mention of fuel stops in BAH reminds me of my first trip to the UK as a teen in the late 80's. flew BA MEL-SIN-BAH-:LHR. Return stopped in AUH (no idea why not BAH again?!). Let's just say eye opening to a 18 year old to say the least - and as you can imagine over 30 years ago the airports and terminals were not quite up to the current setups (and I was just a nobody kid in Y anyway!) but I very much remember those stops (not the least due to one trigger happy security dude pulling a machine gun on me at a check point as I reached too fast into my pocket to pull out my passport. Fun times but I digress.

Taking politics and personal views of the ME3 out of it I kind of enjoyed going through there just in terms of the timings. I think mostly because I quite enjoyed the longer sector being to better to sleep - specially on the return sector (and well flying on EK in F, having that shower prior to landing.... delicious! ). I find the shorter sector from say SIN-SYD/MEL is somehow just a bit short - specially after a long sector from LHR (which departs in the evening) and it didn't really work for me personally as a through pax.


of course breaking up trips with stops in the transit hubs change the dynamic.

 

[SYD]

@Lynda2475 - the new BA club suite is now on the BA LHR-SIN-SYD flights iirc - replacing the reverse herringbone setup. I've not flown it but gets good reviews.

Inwas going to say that but wasn’t sure if it’s consistently on every day now but does look good. Mind you, 3 of my last 4 BA J flights I got bumped to F!

Anyway the mention of fuel stops in BAH reminds me of my first trip to the UK as a teen in the late 80's. flew BA MEL-SIN-BAH-:LHR. Return stopped in AUH (no idea why not BAH again?!). Let's just say eye opening to a 18 year old to say the least - and as you can imagine over 30 years ago the airports and terminals were not quite up to the current setups (and I was just a nobody kid in Y anyway!) but I very much remember those stops (not the least due to one trigger happy security dude pulling a machine gun on me at a check point as I reached too fast into my pocket to pull out my passport. Fun times but I digress.

A school friend and later work colleague had a similar experience. Apparently a lot of guns on display back then.

I find the shorter sector from say SIN-SYD/MEL is somehow just a bit short - specially after a long sector from LHR (which departs in the evening) and it didn't really work for me personally as a through pax..

Yes, the red eyes home are too short for J but still too long for whY… Bring back a day flight from SIN to SYD!

 

[AIRwin]

Bring back a day flight from SIN to SYD!

If QF2 is delayed/diverted...

 

[Lynda2475]

Yes, the red eyes home are too short for J but still too long for whY

This is why last 2 trips to UK went via SIN but home from USA. Day flight LHR to JFK, a few days in US and then a direct flight DFW/SFO/LAX-SYD allows plenty of time for a good sleep.

 

[RSD]

What's this about QF adding a "ridiculous" amount to fly on a QF code? I checked a few dates for SYD-DXB and see max price delta of +$20aud for the cheapest Y, J, and F fares. QF and EK pretty much aligned, what am I missing?

On June 8, for example, QF is about $80 cheaper in Y!

When I was looking for my flights in May and August 2022 the price difference for Y was about $1500. If things have changed then I will be very happy!

 

[jase05]

When I was looking for my flights in May and August 2022 the price difference for Y was about $1500. If things have changed then I will be very happy!

Yeah, we are looking at J to FRA in Nov and the QF price is about $1k more. Just under $10k return with QF.

 

[SYD]

Yeah, we are looking at J to FRA in Nov and the QF price is about $1k more. Just under $10k return with QF.

If you’re flexible, there can be some significant day to day variation on prices. Even months out.

 

[RichardMEL]

If you’re flexible, there can be some significant day to day variation on prices. Even months out.

In some ways this can be the nature of the codeshare arrangement. When QF (or any airline) buys a block of seats for sale from the operating airline (in this case, EK) they have a far more limited inventory to sell - so it's often instructive to find out what fares are being compared with what - as in EK may have lower priced inventory still for sale which QF has exhausted.

Or it could just be that QF has filed particular pricing on various routes for their own reasons This is part of the point o codeshares in a way - since QF has bought the inventory from EK (so EK has their revenue and essentially don't care I would think - those seats are "sold" as far as they are concerned) then QF, in theory, can charge whatever for those seats.

I've recently seen this work both ways with a different codeshare agreement as it was brought up elsewhere: QF codesharing on LA on SYD-AKL. On one particular date J fares were showing at something like $721 from LA, and $1150ish for QF for "the same seat" - but looking into it further I found that LA was selling on that particular flight in JCDIZ inventory (Z being a extra discounted J fare class) and QF, one presumes, had sold out of D and I inventory and were only selling JC inventory - hence the price difference - so it was comparing a restricted J fare with a far more flex QF fare). OTOH, I picked a random date a month later and what do you know.. QF was selling a fare that was around $20 cheaper than LA - both in the I inventory bucket - iirc it was around $950). Point being that sometimes the combination of inventory availability and pricing can go both ways and it can just depend.. it can also be instructive to investigate when there is a seeming price discrepancy on the same sector that it may be more about different fare availability and comparing apples with oranges rather than a gouge by the marketing carrier over the operating one.

 

[Quickstatus]

When QF (or any airline) buys a block of seats for sale

On consignment and any unsold are just returned?

 

[dajop]

How does the QF/EK partnership/JV even work? I know there are different codeshare models. Some you do see the marketing carrier buy seats - right down to specific sections of the cabin in some instances, whilst others seems to draw seats from the same pool and revenue share. And anything in between.

 

[HS-TQE]

Quite the contrary, I'd say the whole EK alliance is at risk long term. Not a chance in hell QF will return to DXB.

QF doesn't have many options taking into consideration the Pointshack article about the future of the QF/EK alliance.

They've pissed off QR enough that it'll take a miracle for any QF/QR co-operation outside of the Oneworld default benefits.

QF could try EY, but EY are the weaker of the 3, and despite the declining EY/VA relationship, there's a better chance of EY going neutral with the Australian carriers by actively offering interlines on both carriers rather than putting eggs into the one basket like they did with VA 1.0

 

[HS-TQE]

At least QF was going to/from LHR and needed to stop somewhere - were they getting cheap fuel? Could they have, should they have added back FRA etc via DXB using 787s?

I reckon QF will return to DXB before VA goes to AUH or DOH…

Little chance of QF going back to DXB imo.

Even if QR picks up a stake in VA when Bain flips half their investment later this year, I can't see DOH on the horizon, if at all.

I'd tip EY to eventually scale back their relationship with VA to just being a VFF redemption partner/interline (minimal to no codeshares) and eventually just actively promote interlines on both Australian carriers, maybe even pick up the REX interline.

 

[justinbrett]

QF doesn't have many options taking into consideration the Pointshack article about the future of the QF/EK alliance.

They've pissed off QR enough that it'll take a miracle for any QF/QR co-operation outside of the Oneworld default benefits.

QF could try EY, but EY are the weaker of the 3, and despite the declining EY/VA relationship, there's a better chance of EY going neutral with the Australian carriers by actively offering interlines on both carriers rather than putting eggs into the one basket like they did with VA 1.0

This is assuming QF needs a gulf partner. Which it doesn‘t. Thats the whole point, the game has changed.