MH 777 missing - MH370 media statement

[jgm]

Heard this afternoon from ABC reporter at Pearce that they were being told that the black box locater couldn't be deployed without debris from MH370 being found.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

Heard this afternoon from ABC reporter at Pearce that they were being told that the black box locater couldn't be deployed without debris from MH370 being found.

That is due to its limited detection range. http://www.news.com.au/travel/trave...size-of-victoria/story-fnizu68q-1226869076424

The pinger locator, which has a reach of about 2km, is towed underwater at a “very slow” two to three knots (5kmp/h) and covers less than 150 square kilometres a day.
“The critical focus at this juncture is to find debris and as much of it as we can. If it is confirmed to be from the aircraft that will enable a much greater refinement of the impact point,” Commodore Leavy said

If they find crash debris, they will then make an allowance for drift and then deploy the black box locater. Given that the drift will be an approximate calculation, it will still be a needle in haybale search...as opposed to the current needle in a haystack.


Some reports have claimed that one of the Chinese ships also has a similar locater.

 

[legroom]

Heard this afternoon from ABC reporter at Pearce that they were being told that the black box locater couldn't be deployed without debris from MH370 being found.

This makes sense really.

5km/hr is the speed the pinger locator could be deployed.

At that rate, by the time the current search area is done, there is no oil left in Saudi Arabia to do a black box retrieval !

Also, that would require the BB to emit the signal, does it not ?

And everyone says it has only a few days' battery charge left.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

Also, that would require the BB to emit the signal, does it not ?

And everyone says it has only a few days' battery charge left.

Yes it needs charge to emit the sonar signal. In the article linked above it suggests upto 45 days rather than 30 days.

After that period the search would rely on other techniques to try and find the plane, and there was some discussion earlier in this thread on the difficulties of that.

 

[JohnK]

The aircraft has disappeared into a vortex opened from another dimension.

 

[anat0l]

The aircraft has disappeared into a vortex opened from another dimension.

I think you're referring to the Bermuda triangle there.


Then again, I guess we shouldn't discount this possibility, eh?


Never thought searching for this aircraft would be such a Herculean effort. Yes, needle in a haystack doesn't start to qualify the difficulty of this endeavour, but with all the educated guessing and searching done by now, it still seems like the world is no closer to finding this aircraft (except to rule places where the aircraft is not located).

I wonder what the world will learn or conclude from all of this after (if!) they find the aircraft.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

I wonder what the world will learn or conclude from all of this after (if!) they find the aircraft.

It would not surprise if we never, never know what exactly happened, or why. Even if found the voice recorder only does the last 2 hours, which could reveal much, or can just be completely blank.

However one outcome that I would be surprised if it did not occur now, would be to move towards continual (or at least in regular bursts) data feeds from passenger aircraft. A 24/7 Virtual Black Box.

 

[medhead]

I think you're referring to the Bermuda triangle there.

Not only....

The Final Countdown (film) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[mannej]

I wonder what the world will learn or conclude from all of this after (if!) they find the aircraft.

You would hope the tracking practises would be improved. As rare as it is, you wouldn't want for this to occur again.

 

[anat0l]

You would hope the tracking practises would be improved. As rare as it is, you wouldn't want for this to occur again.

I think someone at IATA this week alluded to this intention. Some airlines may cringe at the mandatory increase in costs required for ongoing tracking communications. Either that or there will be a golden opportunity for an enterprising person to create a new tracking system to sell to airlines and aircraft manufacturers.

 

[prozac]

I think someone at IATA this week alluded to this intention. Some airlines may cringe at the mandatory increase in costs required for ongoing tracking communications. Either that or there will be a golden opportunity for an enterprising person to create a new tracking system to sell to airlines and aircraft manufacturers.

The other week the bloke from Inmarsat said they could provide constant tracking (I think at set intervals) for airlines at about $1 per aircraft per hour. So cost for MH KUL-LHR or CDG would be around $13.

 

[mannej]

I think someone at IATA this week alluded to this intention. Some airlines may cringe at the mandatory increase in costs required for ongoing tracking communications. Either that or there will be a golden opportunity for an enterprising person to create a new tracking system to sell to airlines and aircraft manufacturers.

I was thinking whether it be possible to have GPS technology attached to the Black Box and DVR

 

[dk4]

The other week the bloke from Inmarsat said they could provide constant tracking (I think at set intervals) for airlines at about $1 per aircraft per hour. So cost for MH KUL-LHR or CDG would be around $13.

When airlines take an olive out of a First Class meal, just to save some money, it is possible to see just how comparatively expensive this service is, on a per flight basis.

 

[mannej]

The other week the bloke from Inmarsat said they could provide constant tracking (I think at set intervals) for airlines at about $1 per aircraft per hour. So cost for MH KUL-LHR or CDG would be around $13.

What would the start up costs be?

 

[prozac]

IndigoSat, based in Brookvale, Australia - https://www.indigosat.com/partners.aspx
Their technology utilises the Inmarsat service.

 

[QF WP]

Latest press release from JACC

Media Release

4 April 2014—am
Up to 10 military planes, four civil jets and nine ships will assist in today's search for missing Malaysia Airlines flight MH370.
The Australian Maritime Safety Authority has determined a search area of about 217,000 square kilometres, 1700 kilometres north west of Perth.
Today's search area will focus on three areas within the same vicinity.
The first aircraft will depart for the search area at 6am Western Standard Time (WST).
A total of 26 State Emergency Service (SES) volunteers from Western Australia, New South Wales and Victoria will work as air observers on three of the civil aircraft. The other civil aircraft will operate as a communications relay.
The weather forecast for today's search is fair, with visibility approximately 10 kilometres and a cloud base between 1000 and 2000 feet.
The Australian Transport Safety Bureau continues to refine the area where the aircraft entered the water based on continuing ground-breaking and multi-disciplinary technical analysis of satellite communication and aircraft performance, passed from the international air crash investigative team comprising analysts from Malaysia, the United States, the UK, China and Australia.

 

[markis10]

The other week the bloke from Inmarsat said they could provide constant tracking (I think at set intervals) for airlines at about $1 per aircraft per hour. So cost for MH KUL-LHR or CDG would be around $13.

While its possible, its not really realistic to have it for all aircraft. The satellites in orbit would not have the bandwidth to handle the data of all the aircraft flying for airlines, let alone their normal traffic such as broadband and phone calls.

I was thinking whether it be possible to have GPS technology attached to the Black Box and DVR

If your talking about tracking, that might be handy on land but if its buried or under water there will be no GPS signal. GPSs work on a carrier frequency of 1.2 and 1.5GHz approximately, those frequencies are absorbed by water very quickly. VLF would work, which of course is what most subs use, but that would require a somewhat impractical long antenna in the order of many meters long.

 

[prozac]

While its possible, its not really realistic to have it for all aircraft. The satellites in orbit would not have the bandwidth to handle the data of all the aircraft flying for airlines, let alone their normal traffic such as broadband and phone calls...

Strange then for Inmarsat to state in a video interview that they could along with cost approximation?

 

[markis10]

Strange then for Inmarsat to state in a video interview that they could along with cost approximation?

They already offer it as an option, but even when the Inmarsat 5 birds using Ku band are flying, I doubt live black box streaming would be possible on a compulsory basis. More likely a handshake with position data every x mins will possibly become the norm, iridium do this already. Another factor would be coverage, for instance Inmarsat does not cover the poles, which are popular for flights up north.

 

[prozac]

They already offer it as an option, but even when the Inmarsat 5 birds using Ku band are flying, I doubt live black box streaming would be possible on a compulsory basis. More likely a handshake with position data every x mins will possibly become the norm, iridium do this already. Another factor would be coverage, for instance Inmarsat does not cover the poles, which are popular for flights up north.

This was my understanding, offering position data for minimal cost. I did not state it had anything to do with the black box.