NBN Discussion

[whatmeworry]

A guy near Humpty Doo, was meant to get FTTP, now with MTM he will get fixed wireless. However he can’t get a signal because of trees blocking line of sight.

Q: Broadband. Can you get it? Or want it?
A: We currently have ADSL. The national broadband network here was originally supposed to be fibre to the premises, but was changed after the last election to fixed wireless.
This has now been implemented, but when I applied for it I was told there was no line of sight due to trees between my house and the mast. Not sure how much thought went into this since zoning rules for this area dictate two hectare blocks and planning rules state that we can't clear more than 1 hectare without obtaining planning permission.
The upshot of this is that most properties near me are surrounded by tall trees, making wireless a really stupid choice.

Snakes in the aircon, killer crocs in the river, virtualisation for apps • The Register

 

[coriander]

And, if people don't pay for the faster speeds then the business goes broke.
No real price change to retain the same type of network speed as ADSL.
However, if one wishes to avail oneself of the faster achievable NBN speeds; say Tier 4 (up to 50MBs), then there is an additional cost that IS acting as a deterrent.

How so? Does that only apply to NBN?

We've got TPG FTTB coming to our buildings next year.

TPG's subsidiary, Wondercom, is offering unlimited up/download/local and national phones, line rental all for $70 - unfortunately only one speed available though, 100 down/40 up. :shock:

One of the objectors to the plan said that "$70 is oh so much more than the $30 I'm paying for ADSL at the moment". I asked her how much her phone rental was.... answer $30..... and how many phone calls do you make a month ..... oh about $20 worth .....

So I said Why is $30+$30+$20 "oh so much more" than $70? Pause. Then.... "could your son help me set up this Netflix thing?" <insert fist-pump.... Yes!> One down, 119 to go !

 

[coles525]

Can anyone explain (I'm usually smart with computer things) the differences between the original and current nbn?

Ie:

- Difference in Speeds?

- Maby costs, I'm on $70ish per month 80gig (if i recall) plan. (if original plan went ahead with new installation)?

- Could/would it be faster then current cable modem/wifi (I'm optus)? (Nbn is using 100+ year phone wires now...)

 

[serfty]

... One down, 119 to go !

1+119=120 ...

That is a specific circumstance where Wondercom will get up to $100,000 P.A. just by selling a single connection to the building - no wonder they can provide such.

This is basically not the case for those in standalone dwellings where speeds greater than what ADSL can provide generally cost more.

 

[TheRealTMA]

How so? Does that only apply to NBN?

We've got TPG FTTB coming to our buildings next year.

TPG's subsidiary, Wondercom, is offering unlimited up/download/local and national phones, line rental all for $70 - unfortunately only one speed available though, 100 down/40 up. :shock:

One of the objectors to the plan said that "$70 is oh so much more than the $30 I'm paying for ADSL at the moment". I asked her how much her phone rental was.... answer $30..... and how many phone calls do you make a month ..... oh about $20 worth .....

So I said Why is $30+$30+$20 "oh so much more" than $70? Pause. Then.... "could your son help me set up this Netflix thing?" <insert fist-pump.... Yes!> One down, 119 to go !

I know multimillionaires who lament the demise of $10 dial up Internet. Good luck.

 

[drron]

Just over 20 years ago I met one of Australia's richest men.He did not have a phone and walked up the street to the public phone to call his broker.
He was on the top 20 list but no one would ever recognise him as being rich such was the simplicity of his life style.

 

[TheRealTMA]

Just over 20 years ago I met one of Australia's richest men.He did not have a phone and walked up the street to the public phone to call his broker.
He was on the top 20 list but no one would ever recognise him as being rich such was the simplicity of his life style.

Yes sad isn't it. He's probably into dynasty as well.

 

[whatmeworry]

Just over 20 years ago I met one of Australia's richest men.He did not have a phone and walked up the street to the public phone to call his broker.
He was on the top 20 list but no one would ever recognise him as being rich such was the simplicity of his life style.

Dad's former boss sent his car from Toorak to his factory in Braybrook for a 5 cent screw. One of my ex bosses insisted on reusing used paper despite it always jamming the printer and even took out the water heater to save on electricity, so only cold water to wash your dirty hands.

 

[Foreigner]

Does NBN have compatibility issue with PABX system used by businesses?

Would switch (involuntary) to NBN require new PABX system?

 

[amaroo]

I do some work for a three comma man ... he loves spending and enjoys sharing even more

 

[moa999]

Does NBN have compatibility issue with PABX system used by businesses?

Would switch (involuntary) to NBN require new PABX system?

Yes and no - some systems will directly support IP lines (eg SIP)

Others may need convertors
If merely analogue, then ATA boxes would work, if ISDN then other convertors.

Some info in this WP thread
https://forums.whirlpool.net.au/archive/2062134

 

[shifty]

ISDN voice lines will continue to operate for the foreseeable future. ...at least that's what our provider says, and our office has had ISDN for voice for the past year or so whilst we have had nbn for net access.

 

[Foreigner]

Yes and no - some systems will directly support IP lines (eg SIP)

Others may need convertors
If merely analogue, then ATA boxes would work, if ISDN then other convertors.

Some info in this WP thread
https://forums.whirlpool.net.au/archive/2062134

Thanks moa999. Too much tech lingo there for me but I get there are ways to marry the old with the new (NBN).

Edit:

ATA box looks like the trick.

On further research I found info in this link also useful:

http://www.telaustralia.com.au/the-...-happen-to-our-phone-lines-when-the-nbn-comes

 

[drsmithy]

Well the planning for the Snowy Mountains scheme was much more detailed with the original act passed by the Commonwealth and NSW Governments allowing the Commonwealth to control the waters of the Snowy river was in 1909 and several studies in planning and possible financial benefits were done before the final act was passed in 1949-
https://digitalcollections.anu.edu.au/bitstream/1885/41879/1/dp_60.html

In hindsight probably not a good comparison given the consequences around things like water flows. Though that link is about an environmental impact assessment, not "how can we turn a profit" - itself illustrative of the completely different mindset of the time.

Similiarly lots of discussion with the Harbour Bridge.Tenders were called in 1923 before building started in 1924.A lot more process than the NBN-
History of the Sydney Harbour Bridge

Again, less about the "how can we turn a profit" and more about the "nation building and infrastructure to benefit all".

And by the way the idea that someone has no bias because they do not believe in the 2 major parties is ludicrous.We are all biased.Some of us realise it.

Calling someone biased doesn't mean they are.

 

[drsmithy]

What is it then a charity?

Er, a Government ? You know, runs the country ? Facilitates the co-ordination of the natural, human and intellectual resources of the nation ? Is responsible for creating the best outcome for everyone ?


An entity that in no way, shape, or form operates like a business ? Or a household ?

In fact you are VERY wrong about 'business cases'. Govt spending traditionally HAS had a business case (or cost/benefit analysis) that is why the "whiteboard" fiasco got so much coverage.

I seem to recall the NBN did have a bunsiness case. I wasn't living in Australia at the time so I'm a bit hazy.


A quick google shows up this, amongst others: National Broadband Network (NBN) Business Case Released by Federal Government | AustralianPolitics.com

Profligate wasting of scarce taxpayer funds has never been a Govt prerogative but they still do it.

And, obviously, building what is unquestionably one of the most important pieces of infrastructure to support the society and economy of the future is "profligate wasting".


If we were talking about throwing money at building or supporting coal mines, you might have a point, but telecoms is as important to building the next iteration of civilisation as roads, railways, electricity, sewerage and running water have been to earlier ones.


It would be hilarious - if it weren't so serious - how after all the political fearmongering and hysteria about the costs of the FTTP NBN, the "cheaper" FTTN NBN is going to end up costing basically the same, with the disadvantage of almost certainly needing to be completely ripped-and-replaced in a few decades when it runs out of puff.

 

[drsmithy]

For 99.9% of population being able to download the equivalent of a 90 minute HD movie every 5-15 seconds will never be required let alone something they'd pay for.

A mere twenty years ago people like you were saying something similar about mobile phones and cellular comms; "99.9% of the population having a phone in their pocket will never be required, let alone something they'd pay for. I mean, they all have phones at home and there's public phones everywhere !"

Now those technologies are critical to huge sections of the economy.

 

[drron]

Calling someone biased doesn't mean they are.

Equally saying you are not biased doesn't mean you aren't.
But as I said everyone is biased.It depends on your life experiences what you make of various situations.
To me you do have a definite bias.
I have revealed mine.

 

[whatmeworry]

Another analysis showing Malcolm Turnbull's NBN is a shambles.

In 2013, then opposition communications spokesman Malcolm Turnbull pledged to ditch Labor's fibre-to-the-premises national broadband network and replace it with a mix of technologies including upgraded copper wires and pay TV cables.
Now, despite a blowout in the cost of his version of the NBN from $29.5 billion to $56 billion, he insists it is better than what Labor would have delivered.
'A mixed technology model is cheaper and faster and more efficient. That is beyond question,' Turnbull, now prime minister, told parliament last week.
But, according to communications consultant Paul Budde, it's not. He says many in the telecommunications industry are losing confidence in the NBN.
'If you look at the shambles which we have now, obviously he doesn't know what he is doing,' Budde says.

Turnbull's faster, cheaper NBN - Background Briefing - ABC Radio National (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

 

[moa999]

And a post from Whirlpool showing why the FTTP roll was so slow and over budget

Four contractors spent 2 days digging a 50m long 40cm deep trench from street pit to my house. Trench not a straight line with 3 large 90 degree bends underground. They laid the 2.3cm internal diameter pvc conduit with blue pvc glue to connect the pipes and then attached the PCD on the brickwall and pulled the fibre cable from the pit to the PCD. A few days later, a NBN technician came and tested the cabling.

Over 8 man days for a single trench from gutter to house - admittedly biggish block with 50m setback

 

[Limewood]

Some of the installers work in our small complex of 16 units, mostly renters and even some owners who don't give a stuff what it looks like. Check out cable stuck to wall in a M$ apartment owned by ASIAN couple who thought that was normal!, just lovely, I call these installers "clowns".