New VA Fare Structure

[Deleted member 29185]

JohnK loathed JQ but now he seems so keen. I can't keep up

Business models of companies change and as such so do peoples choices and decisions. I didn't read JohnK suggest he's "so keen", in fact I think he said something like....

JQ was my stubbornness but now need to save money where possible for a worthy cause so bite my tongue and put up with all the cough from JQ. That's not to say I will book any flights with JQ but that I will consider them ahead of VA.

Why put words in someones mouth that are not there?

 

[MH_fan]

There's a lot of speculation about the new VA fare structure and we don't really know what the exact details are but it would be reasonably safe to assume that the changes will benefit VA and not the passenger no matter how they want to spin it. The bottom line for me is that all airlines are a business and the main objective is to make money, not lose it. We don't have to like how they do it. I, for one, can express my displeasure with the changes but, ultimately, I will make the changes to my travel habits that will best suit me within the ever-changing parameters of the travel industry.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

I just noticed that they claim premium economy will be available on TT flights. Given a lot of TT flights are 738's, does this suggest:
a) a refit (doubtful)
b) only 777's on TT (doubtful)
c) space + (or more specifically, row 3) being hammed up as premium economy?

 

[bam71]

have u got a link for that at all??

 

[woodborer]

I just noticed that they claim premium economy will be available on TT flights.

It's on some Air New Zealand operated flights (e.g. to Perth) that VA codeshare on.

 

[Jack_OC]

If your seat selection is important and you have been booked in the cheapest fare class, you will be able to pay the fee and you can select a seat of your choice. You will only risk a middle seat if you choose to take that risk.

Anything above the cheapest fare class is business as usual....

But this is a big problem for many travelling on business. AFAIK, the only advantages of the new middle fare class over the cheapest one are: advanced seat selection, flexibility and more FF points. My employer will not pay more for any of those things - in fact there is a policy against paying more for flexibility unless there is a specific justification for doing so, and understandably they don't consider my seat preference or FF points earning rate to be their problem.

At least when the difference between fare classes was bag or no bag, people could make a case (pun intended) for purchasing the higher fare. Now it will mean I either pay out of my own pocket for the difference between fares, or suffer the consequences - i.e. no seat selection, no bonus points, no fly ahead. In other words, no point in having Platinum status anymore.

 

[TomVexille]

It's on some Air New Zealand operated flights (e.g. to Perth) that VA codeshare on.

And the 777s/787s operating to the East Coast

 

[Pleb Status]

Come on. Have you read any of the previous posts? Quite apart from the probable loss of complementary row 3, loss of luggage allowance and potential loss of complementary fly ahead, I'm wondering how you are able to predict "business as usual" when VA are yet to release all the details on fares and fees. Velocity are also yet to release details on SC earn on these new fare bundles and also whether Velocity will use this change as a golden opportunity to reduce status benefits further (4 x plat comp upgrades as an example).

Calling "business as usual" is your prerogative, but I can't understand how anyone can believe it at this juncture.

I guess I am not as pessimistic about numerous unannounced 'changes' which at this stage are at best rumours (loss of row 3) and some are just conspiracy theories (reducing the comp upgrades).

I do agree that any hysteria should be restrained until we know the full extent of the damage and at that stage I reserve the right to change my current opinion.

 

[Pleb Status]

But this is a big problem for many travelling on business. AFAIK, the only advantages of the new middle fare class over the cheapest one are: advanced seat selection, flexibility and more FF points. My employer will not pay more for any of those things - in fact there is a policy against paying more for flexibility unless there is a specific justification for doing so, and understandably they don't consider my seat preference or FF points earning rate to be their problem.

At least when the difference between fare classes was bag or no bag, people could make a case (pun intended) for purchasing the higher fare. Now it will mean I either pay out of my own pocket for the difference between fares, or suffer the consequences - i.e. no seat selection, no bonus points, no fly ahead. In other words, no point in having Platinum status anymore.

My reading is you will only have to pay extra for seat selection if you want to select a seat and you are in the cheapest fare class. You do not have to change fare class to select a seat. So depending on the actual cost, it may be more of an annoyance than anything else.

I am not trying to defend these changes in anyway, but there appears to be a misconception that those in the cheapest fare class will not be able to select a seat at all and will be forced into middle seats etc.

 

[grubbidok]

But this is a big problem for many travelling on business. AFAIK, the only advantages of the new middle fare class over the cheapest one are: advanced seat selection, flexibility and more FF points. My employer will not pay more for any of those things - in fact there is a policy against paying more for flexibility unless there is a specific justification for doing so, and understandably they don't consider my seat preference or FF points earning rate to be their problem.

At least when the difference between fare classes was bag or no bag, people could make a case (pun intended) for purchasing the higher fare. Now it will mean I either pay out of my own pocket for the difference between fares, or suffer the consequences - i.e. no seat selection, no bonus points, no fly ahead. In other words, no point in having Platinum status anymore.

Ditto ditto ditto. Basically Virgin have made themselves unpalatable to everyone in the entire university travel market with these changes (we have choice of provider, but must choose cheapest ticket on that provider and extras not covered).

 

[Deleted member 29185]

have u got a link for that at all??

Yes. From ealier on in this thread.......here and here.
I don't see where they state it will only be on select or code share flights. The statement is that Premium Saver and Premium is available on TT and LH. I guess they can have it on just one flight a year and say it's available, but that's an outright con.

I do agree that any hysteria should be restrained until we know the full extent of the damage and at that stage I reserve the right to change my current opinion.

So "business as usual" untill VA bother to release the details? I like your optimism and hope your optimism is rewarded!

 

[nlagalle]

My reading is you will only have to pay extra for seat selection if you want to select a seat and you are in the cheapest fare class. You do not have to change fare class to select a seat. So depending on the actual cost, it may be more of an annoyance than anything else.

I am not trying to defend these changes in anyway, but there appears to be a misconception that those in the cheapest fare class will not be able to select a seat at all and will be forced into middle seats etc.

No it's more that with many companies booking CFOD (cheapest) if you want to advance seat select you'll have to cough up, otherwise it'll be pot luck as to where you end up. what happens when someone booking on a higher fare goes in and selects all the windows and aisle seats in the meantime?

 

[basso]

Yes. From ealier on in this thread.......here and here. I don't see where they state it will only be on select or code share flights. The statement is that Premium Saver and Premium is available on TT and LH. I guess they can have it on just one flight a year and say it's available, but that's an outright con.

The document on the second link states it in a sentence at the bottom of the page. The thing is, to be able to sell services on those flights, they need to have fares and fare rules for them. This document is just saying they have these fares - not that they are available on every flight.

 

[Happy Dude]

snip... there appears to be a misconception that those in the cheapest fare class will not be able to select a seat at all and will be forced into middle seats etc.

Regardless of the fare class, SG and WP will be allocated a forward seat but will now have to pay to select a specific seat to avoid the middle seat lottery or pay to get a Space+ seat. It will be free, for all except those on a getaway fare, to select a no Space+ seat at T-48.

Because those things were free, there's now a very clear disincentive to get status if seat selection is important. Enhancement of the other perks would seem to make investigating other options worthwhile. My guess is that folks will still get status because when things go pear-shaped it'd be better to have it than not.

 

[Jack_OC]

My reading is you will only have to pay extra for seat selection if you want to select a seat and you are in the cheapest fare class.

That's my reading too. But I absolutely do want to select a seat, and most of the time I fly I have no choice but to be in the cheapest fare class.

You do not have to change fare class to select a seat. So depending on the actual cost, it may be more of an annoyance than anything else. I am not trying to defend these changes in anyway, but there appears to be a misconception that those in the cheapest fare class will not be able to select a seat at all and will be forced into middle seats etc.

There's no misconception from me - as I said previously the issue is that my employer (like many employers) will not pay for seat selection fees, so I would have to pay the fees out of my own pocket, even when travelling for work. Additionally, with the base fare plus seat selection fee I still won't earn any status bonus points (currently 100%) or have the possibility of fly ahead.

So just to reiterate, when/if I travel for work with VA after these changes take effect, I will have to choose between:
(a) a seat lottery, which may well result in me getting a middle seat, and which is unlikely to result in me getting a prized row 3 seat (by far the biggest benefit of Platinum status for me, until now); in addition to a 50% drop in FF points earn and no possibility of fly ahead
or
(b) forking out cash from my own pocket to reinstate some or all of the existing Platinum benefits.

 

[eastwest101]

So just to reiterate, when/if I travel for work with VA after these changes take effect, I will have to choose between:
(a) a seat lottery, which may well result in me getting a middle seat, and which is unlikely to result in me getting a prized row 3 seat (by far the biggest benefit of Platinum status for me, until now); in addition to a 50% drop in FF points earn and no possibility of fly ahead
or
(b) forking out cash from my own pocket to reinstate some or all of the existing Platinum benefits.

Sorry to make your day worse than it already is, and you have summed it up very well there, but for your Option b to a viable option for you, that will also rely on the VA web site design team being able to design a way to access your booking and then take your money for your seat selection (and honouring a refund if you get gazumped/moved seats due to IIROPS or equipment change).

 

[JohnK]

It seems you are never going to stop blaming VA for your own mistake. With that, many of the disparaging comments you have made in this thread and elsewhere specifically regarding VA I really put little credence to.

I'm pretty sure the transpacific fare you paid was much cheaper than any such would be on Jetstar, even just with HNL.

It's not just one just one incident but a serious of incidents over the years. You can continue blaming me for each incident but the simple fact of the matter is VA do not do customer service very well and their service recovery is poor.

And my credibility is irrelevant to the argument. VA are making changes that are below the belt. That I have no doubt. You can choose to interpret those changes any way you want.

P.S. Reading this thread I would say the majority of posts support my interpretation of the proposed changes.

 

[kevrosmith]

Regardless of the fare class, SG and WP will be allocated a forward seat but will now have to pay to select a specific seat to avoid the middle seat lottery or pay to get a Space+ seat. It will be free, for all except those on a getaway fare, to select a no Space+ seat at T-48.

This is ridiculous. Even airberlin allow free seat selection, including for the XL seats, for their Gold and Platinum members.

So even on Elevate and Freedom, I have to pay just to select a specific seat prior to T-48, and have to pay more for Row 3, even after T-48, even if I'm on the most expensive Y fare. VA have lost the plot.

 

[straitman]

It's not just one just one incident but a serious of incidents over the years. You can continue blaming me for each incident but the simple fact of the matter is VA do not do customer service very well and their service recovery is poor.

I'm not sure anyone is specifically blaming you John. All airlines get it wrong on occasions but in my experience your new best friend JetStar do it a lot worse than Virgin and their service recovery is not just poor but near non existent and that is certainly much worse than that of Virgin.

 

[Jack_OC]

Sorry to make your day worse than it already is, and you have summed it up very well there, but for your Option b to a viable option for you, that will also rely on the VA web site design team being able to design a way to access your booking and then take your money for your seat selection (and honouring a refund if you get gazumped/moved seats due to IIROPS or equipment change).

While nothing would surprise me anymore, I think the VA website already facilitates paying for extra leg room seats via "Manage Booking", although I've never actually done that, since I've generally been able to select great seats for free!