New VA Fare Structure

[Lemon_Party]

Hi, please don't take this the wrong way, but I know people including my boss who sinks "5 figures" into a single trip or even flight. I would suggest your 5 figures aren't going to concern Virgin overall and in the end there will only be one way to get some satisfaction.

Matt

That may well be the case, but I'd expect a decent amount of SG & WPs would be in the 5 figure sum. I imagine I'm a fairly middle of the road frequent flyer, not excessive or high rolling, but would assume there are 1000's like me who may average 15-30 round trips of domestic & international flying for business and some leisure a year, mainly in Y. $20k - $50k of annual spend may be insignificant compared to high execs and the companies with paid J as standard, but there are plenty of SME's with people in this position. It doesn't do well to alienate or upset a large portion of a frequent flyer band. 1500 people spending $25k per year is $37.5M of revenue that could easily slide to an alternate supplier.

 

[UP4014]

That may well be the case, but I'd expect a decent amount of SG & WPs would be in the 5 figure sum. I imagine I'm a fairly middle of the road frequent flyer, not excessive or high rolling, but would assume there are 1000's like me who may average 15-30 round trips of domestic & international flying for business and some leisure a year, mainly in Y. $20k - $50k of annual spend may be insignificant compared to high execs and the companies with paid J as standard, but there are plenty of SME's with people in this position. It doesn't do well to alienate or upset a large portion of a frequent flyer band. 1500 people spending $25k per year is $37.5M of revenue that could easily slide to an alternate supplier.

Of course I agree, but only a small % of those will likely move because of these changes, many maybe cannot move because of company policies on travel which give rebates back so while the traveller as an individual loses out the customer (person paying the bills) doesn't see anything different. Maybe more maybe won't move because they are already on the way to status with Virgin and don't want to start again with QF.

In the last 4 months my spend has been over $10K, some mine and some work. (all with QF)

While you point out 37.5M revenue could slide, Virgins revenue is 4.7B, not trying to be a smarty but you see my point. (2015)

 

[Muppet501st]

Currently when my travel is booked by corporate traveler, I sometimes have a mix of VA and QF flights. When this happens, I'm not able to select seats on VA, and I have to call them up to have them select my seats, so looks like I'll be charged a call centre fee along with a seat selection fee ( dependant on what ticket I've been booked on ) Pretty coughpy scenario

 

[Mr Pumblechook]

Hi, please don't take this the wrong way, but I know people including my boss who sinks "5 figures" into a single trip or even flight. I would suggest your 5 figures aren't going to concern Virgin overall and in the end there will only be one way to get some satisfaction.

Matt

No I understand where you're coming from - my last work trip was equivalent to six months of personal spending on VA!

As I've said earlier in the thread, these changes show just how little value VA sees in those of us SGs and WPs who are self-funded and fly on the cheapest fares.

The good news for us is we're not locked into any corporate travel policies and we can choose other airlines that might become better value propositions after these changes.

 

[trippin_the_rift]

No I understand where you're coming from - my last work trip was equivalent to six months of personal spending on VA!

As I've said earlier in the thread, these changes show just how little value VA sees in those of us SGs and WPs who are self-funded and fly on the cheapest fares.

The good news for us is we're not locked into any corporate travel policies and we can choose other airlines that might become better value propositions after these changes.

Given how profitable VA dom/intl is compared to Velocity ($80M+) - I would question if airlines care at all if you fly.
For the past few years it's all about how many credit cards you're signing up for.

Of course - next years results for Velocity will drop off a cliff thanks to RBA.

On the other side of the table Qantas have hired half of Australia's management consultants to innovate their way into new revenue, and then VA makes this terrible negative change - which essentially destroys a beautiful high revenue opportunity where they could be selling a new product which holds high subjective value. Time to fire the **** out of the 1960 thinking revenue managers JB....and never stop innovating.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

never stop innovating.

I think that comment may fall on deaf ears. The only innovation I can remember that is linked to VA is idiotic sing songs in the aisle, FA's giggling through safety demonstrations and family pooling and the first two were innovations I trust we'll never visit again! IIRC, everything else VA has accomplished has been copied from other airlines (predominently QF and JQ).

 

[JohnK]

Unless things have changed, you won't get VA lounge access on TT.

Unless things have changed, I will get lounge access if I am flying TT and my friend is flying VA.

 

[ComeFlyWithMe]

They should do away with family pooling making the attainment and retention of status the same as with the other guys. While they're enhancing that is.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

They should do away with family pooling making the attainment and retention of status the same as with the other guys. While they're enhancing that is.

Shhhhh!

As I don't rely on Family pooling, I should agree with you..........but it is their only claim to fame as an innovator! If they remove that, they not only disadvantage the FFer that needs it for status, but they withdraw their one and only trump card over QF/JQ!

 

[amaroo]

Shhhhh!

As I don't rely on Family pooling, I should agree with you..........but it is their only claim to fame as an innovator! If they remove that, they not only disadvantage the FFer that needs it for status, but they withdraw their one and only trump card over QF/JQ!

If VA were a signed up member of *A, and still offered family pooling - I'd hop right over.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

If VA were a signed up member of *A, and still offered family pooling - I'd hop right over.

Trouble is..........

 

[Bolthead]

They should do away with family pooling making the attainment and retention of status the same as with the other guys. While they're enhancing that is.

Wash your mouth out with soap and go to the corner...

 

[clifford]

If VA were a signed up member of *A, and still offered family pooling - I'd hop right over.

I'd fly VA if they were a member of *A too. Don't care at all about family pooling. But as it is, I don't fly paid VA.

 

[anat0l]

Shhhhh!

As I don't rely on Family pooling, I should agree with you..........but it is their only claim to fame as an innovator! If they remove that, they not only disadvantage the FFer that needs it for status, but they withdraw their one and only trump card over QF/JQ!

VFF, in a sense, innovated many things, and it won them a huge amount of kudos at the time (probably still now). For example:

• Family pooling.
• The ability to pass on your points to your estate when you die. (Qantas kills all points on death)
• Family transfers of more than once per 12 months. (Qantas made two changes since then)
• Hotel and car hire status for Gold and Platinum.
• Upgrade instruments for Platinum (admittedly only on flexible fares)
• Parental pause. (Qantas have their own version now)
• Rolling 12 month status credit counting. (Can't think of another carrier in the world with this system)
• Annual family holiday. I'm not sure how well this works (i.e. does it basically override the lack of award availability), but it is there.

Some stuff wasn't an innovation as such but just a bit of "one upmanship" on the competition. For example, cheaper award prices in points, Platinums allowed 3 guests into lounges rather than 2 from QF, Golds and Platinums can use VA lounges on arrival after a VA flight. Some of that stuff was truly innovative, i.e. no other carrier in the world had such a feature, let alone a carrier with a programme that could be exploited by Australian based flyers with significant domestic flying expense.

We may not use all of those benefits, and some are certainly better than others, but I still remember from years ago when they announced the new programme that many members of AFF were laying into QF as if VA was the sci-fi future hover skateboard and QF was the Neanderthal square wheel.

VA already announced some brakes on Family Pooling. I'm not sure how much further they could go without killing it off, which probably won't go down well at all. They could put annual limits on pooling (e.g. no more than 50% of SCs for (re)qualification can come from pooling), or impose "costs" (e.g. 10 SC is lost when transferred through pooling).

I'd fly VA if they were a member of *A too. Don't care at all about family pooling. But as it is, I don't fly paid VA.

Most likely because it would mean a pretty easy *G; I wouldn't hold a breath that even if you could do *A redemptions that you would be able to get access to the space that most other partners can't book (e.g. LH F, LX F, SQ F/R).

 

[amaroo]

The perfect song for this thread!

[video=youtube;Tj96QFzOL5Y]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tj96QFzOL5Y[/video]

 

[trippin_the_rift]

VFF, in a sense, innovated many things, and it won them a huge amount of kudos at the time (probably still now). For example:

• Family pooling.
• The ability to pass on your points to your estate when you die. (Qantas kills all points on death)
• Family transfers of more than once per 12 months. (Qantas made two changes since then)
• Hotel and car hire status for Gold and Platinum.
• Upgrade instruments for Platinum (admittedly only on flexible fares)
• Parental pause. (Qantas have their own version now)
• Rolling 12 month status credit counting. (Can't think of another carrier in the world with this system)
• Annual family holiday. I'm not sure how well this works (i.e. does it basically override the lack of award availability), but it is there.

The brilliant strategist who spearheaded these initiatives no longer heads up the program.
Since his departure - the Velocity program doesn't appear to have evolved a great deal for it's members.

 

[UP4014]

They should do away with family pooling making the attainment and retention of status the same as with the other guys. While they're enhancing that is.

I'm sure it's on the drawing board.

 

[MH_fan]

Don't flame me but I still think that the amount of SCs to attain status is too generous when you consider that they have family pooling. They've made it too easy and now they have to deal with the problems it's caused. I've always felt that there should be some conditions to the family pooling. For example, primary account holder should earn at least 50% of the SCs needed to attain status. The number of SCs needed should be higher than what it currently is but you should be rewarded with only needing the current level of SCs if you don't pool.
Just my thoughts...

 

[grubbidok]

Hi, please don't take this the wrong way, but I know people including my boss who sinks "5 figures" into a single trip or even flight. I would suggest your 5 figures aren't going to concern Virgin overall and in the end there will only be one way to get some satisfaction.
Matt

The problem is I'd wager there are a hell of a lot more people sinking 5 figures over the year compared to people sinking 5 figures into one flight. I think dismissing BIS Y elites is a pretty poor business decision, as they really are bread and butter income that airlines would sorely miss once it's gone.

 

[grubbidok]

If VA were a signed up member of *A, and still offered family pooling - I'd hop right over.

For me this is the kicker and what is making me seriously consider going to QF. At least QF has OW. VA has a half-coughd, poorly thought through flexible 'custom alliance' which leaves you stranded in airports all over the world without lounge access (even when the 'alliance partners' have their own arrangements. At least QF has benefits on international travel VA can only dream of matching without joining *A. Even if QF is 'just as guilty' as VA on watering down domestic bennies, it still has value overseas. If WP domestically no longer gets much beyond what anyone with a purchased lounge membership has, what's the benefit?