Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

[11sjw]

I'm still waiting to hear someone explain why taxpayers should be shoring up completely unproductive businesses that are facilitating and dependent on what is, in all but name, tax evasion.

Probably one of the larger hypocrites here would have to be Joe "end entitlements" Hockey. Though of course we all know when a conservative says "entitlements" what they really mean is "assistance for the poor".

I'm just addressing the "Your friend is lying" carp you decided to sprout a little while ago and which you conveniently deflected away from.

I'll leave the merit of FBT reform to others except to say I knocked up 32,000km in my work vehicle last year and for half the year I lived less than 5km from my office. Our only holiday was a flying holiday so I believe I used the work vehicle for well in excess of 80% work. Whose to say a Log book couldn't be fudged anyway?

 

[Mak404matt]

Or even Berlusconi he seems like a fun sort of guy I think he'd get on well with Craig Thompson despite their political differences

A Berlusconi - Thompson BungaBunga party would definitely be worth a look in!

 

[HarryB]

Whose to say a Log book couldn't be fudged anyway?

Is FBT where the real tax loss for the government is anyway? Unless you have an FBT exempt vehicle then you offset each dollar of FBT with an after tax component of your lease arrangement so I suspect the biggest deal for the government is the GST they would be able to collect from those who would no longer take advantage of this tax break. All running costs (fuel, tyres, maintenance, insurance, rego etc) on a fully maintained novated lease are exempt from GST as the lease management company claim it back. I suspect this us the area the government would gain the most.

But, legitimate or even fudged log books are not a big effort and given advice I received from a broker when I got my first lease was to severely overestimate my expected KM's (therefore
significantly reducing FBT liability as no one is ever going to check the odometer of the car) I can imagine fudging log books will soon be encouraged by some unscrupulous operators.

 

[drsmithy]

I'm just addressing the "Your friend is lying" carp you decided to sprout a little while ago and which you conveniently deflected away from.

Actually I said the friend or the boss.

And I maintain, a sound business doesn't go from prosperous to broken overnight unless there's something else going on.

I'll leave the merit of FBT reform to others except to say I knocked up 32,000km in my work vehicle last year and for half the year I lived less than 5km from my office. Our only holiday was a flying holiday so I believe I used the work vehicle for well in excess of 80% work.

So why are you concerned ? Clearly your benefit will remain the same. No-one is suggesting people who legitimately use their vehicles for work purposes should not be allowed to claim.

Whose to say a Log book couldn't be fudged anyway?

Of course it can. But the same applies to any form of tax deduction - are you trying to argue we should allow any tax deduction people want to claim without even basic requirements for verification ?

 

[spudseamus]

Guys just keep it simple ! " you never vote in the opposition , you vote out the government "

 

[Skyring]

Guys just keep it simple ! " you never vote in the opposition , you vote out the government "

Precisely. Rudd and Gillard showed exactly how they thought government should work.

 

[drsmithy]

Is FBT where the real tax loss for the government is anyway?

Gawd, no. The real tax loss is in negative gearing.

But if you think the whining has been loud because of cracking down on claiming cars, getting rid of negative gearing would have people wandering the streets with "The end is nigh" signs.

But, legitimate or even fudged log books are not a big effort and given advice I received from a broker when I got my first lease was to severely overestimate my expected KM's (therefore
significantly reducing FBT liability as no one is ever going to check the odometer of the car) I can imagine fudging log books will soon be encouraged by some unscrupulous operators.

Probably, but there's arguably more "wrong" with fudging a log book to pretend you're using a car for work when you're not.

 

[Hvr]

Precisely. Rudd and Gillard showed exactly how they thought government should work.

And yet Abbott as the alternative Prime Minister hasn't shown he is up to the job.

 

[HarryB]

Precisely. Rudd and Gillard showed exactly how they thought government should work.

And unfortunately the alternative has been getting a free ride so we know little about what we are getting ourselves into other than 3 word slogans sprouted by the likes of Abbott, Pyne, Hockey, Bishop, Mirabella and so on.

Yep ... Real inspiring.

 

[HarryB]

But if you think the whining has been loud because of cracking down on claiming cars, getting rid of negative gearing would have people wandering the streets with "The end is nigh" signs.

Ha ... They can pull out the dusty ones that were shelved when the carbon tax didn't bring down the whole country!

 

[Pukka]

Gawd, no. The real tax loss is in negative gearing.

But if you think the whining has been loud because of cracking down on claiming cars, getting rid of negative gearing would have people wandering the streets with "The end is nigh" signs.


Probably, but there's arguably more "wrong" with fudging a log book to pretend you're using a car for work when you're not.

Actually I'd really like Rudd to announce that he was going to remove negative gearing as long as he does it well before the election so that everyone can decide if that's what they want or not.

I don't want a "there will be no removal of negative gearing under a Government I lead " sort of thing and then change his mind; we've been there before.

 

[cove]

11sjw fudging a log book??
Our lives have changed so much in our company that I would not think that was easy. Our mobile phones, toll roads, fuel purchasing and Navman vehicle tracker system make for greater accuracy or otherwise a tax auditor could laugh all the way to your bank.
If someone steals one of our cars they won't have it for long!

Time to get Government spending under control.

 

[HarryB]

11sjw fudging a log book??
Our lives have changed so much in our company that I would not think that was easy. Our mobile phones, toll roads, fuel purchasing and Navman vehicle tracker system make for greater accuracy or otherwise a tax auditor could laugh all the way to your bank.
If someone steals one of our cars they won't have it for long!

Time to get Government spending under control.

The way your company works, I would suggest, is not the norm unfortunately.

 

[drsmithy]

Time to get Government spending under control.

Here's a breakdown of the federal budget from 2012. Which boxes are you proposing we make smaller ?

 

[amaroo]

Here's a breakdown of the federal budget from 2012. Which boxes are you proposing we make smaller ?

Avoiding public debt interest would have been a great start.

 

[drsmithy]

Avoiding public debt interest would have been a great start.

Great idea! Which national assets do you think we should sell to take care of that ?

Or would you rather raise taxes ? Maybe we could put them back up to where they used to be when Howard was Prime Minister ?

 

[amaroo]

Great idea! Which national assets do you think we should sell to take care of that ?

Or would you rather raise taxes ? Maybe we could put them back up to where they used to be when Howard was Prime Minister ?

I'm thinking we could have used the cash that was shoved down the throats of the pokies, posted to the dead, deposited into the accounts of people living in other countries, etc - a little bit better.

 

[cove]

It may have to be 5% off each area so that no one can be upset.
Get out of the Middle East would help.
Put the pollies up for a 25% cut in retirement entitlements and put them on regular aircraft.
Or we could do a French idea of a "temporary 70% tax rate" for the rich.

 

[amaroo]

Or we could do a French idea of a "temporary 70% tax rate" for the rich.

Might start a mass migration to PNG

 

[Pukka]

Great idea! Which national assets do you think we should sell to take care of that ?

Or would you rather raise taxes ? Maybe we could put them back up to where they used to be when Howard was Prime Minister ?

How about putting up GST, cutting benefits and putting up the lower rate of tax because lots of people are on that so it should raise plenty.

That way we can all share the burden.