Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

[Hvr]

Just some very funny posts on this thread.

Agreed and good to see that it is generally taken with good humour by those involved.

 

[Moody]

Skyring, do you ever tire of being proven wrong, or are you going for some kind of world record:

Rupert still riding high

Yeah - pretty accurate summation, and a perfect example of how reasoned debate is on a permanent holiday in Oz. I mean, why try to use the parliament of this country to make Australia and better and fairer place to live when you can instead let interest groups and bigots set the agenda?

What fun, eh?

 

[Skyring]

An opinion column published by The Age and the SMH - part of the Fairfax group, a media company that is not owned by Murdoch, and then discussed on AFF thus partly supporting Skyrings argument!

My argument is that people have minds of their own.

Trying to blame the media for Labor's various woes doesn't wash with me. If Swan says he's a wonderful treasurer for five years, he's going to prove it by bringing in a surplus, and then he fails to do so, it's the fault of the papers?

Kevin Rudd sabotages the 2010 election, acts like a whiney child and undercuts his leader whenever he can, and it's the media to blame?

Craig Thomson, Eddie Obeid, Peter Slipper, border protection, the "no carbon tax" promise. It just goes on and on and on. The news media report the disasters. They don't make them.

 

[TheEmu]

Trying to blame the media for Labor's various woes doesn't wash with me. If Swan says he's a wonderful treasurer for five years, he's going to prove it by bringing in a surplus, and then he fails to do so, it's the fault of the papers?
Kevin Rudd sabotages the 2010 election, acts like a whiney child and undercuts his leader whenever he can, and it's the media to blame?
Craig Thomson, Eddie Obeid, Peter Slipper, border protection, the "no carbon tax" promise. It just goes on and on and on. The news media report the disasters. They don't make them.

So whose turn on the front bench this week? I think nearly everybody's had a go by now…?
6 ministries in 3 years - I really don't know how to blame someone else for such a farcical situation but I'm sure they'll find a way.

 

[QF WP]

I read a really good story in the SMH (Saturday) of how it apparently went down. Then I read this article this morning and I shake my head at the level of (in)competence in our (Labor) politicians. They deserve each other and the ignominy of their slide from power. Sounds like a piece from Fawlty Towers...

 

[amaroo]

I read a really good story in the SMH (Saturday) of how it apparently went down. Then I read this article this morning and I shake my head at the level of (in)competence in our (Labor) politicians. They deserve each other and the ignominy of their slide from power. Sounds like a piece from Fawlty Towers...

Nice photo of the marginal seat victims being dragged along by Gillard's wake ........and Swanny - deep in thought.......no doubt looking forward to delivering another deficit speech.

Looks like Crean was a Trojan Horse......doesn't make for a happy caucus in the coming months. IMO there's another leadership coup in the ALP barrel.....only a matter of time before someone pulls the trigger!

 

[Pushka]

If the new Cabinet is so strong, then why have I never heard of any of the newbies.

 

[Skyring]

Nice photo of the marginal seat victims being dragged along by Gillard's wake ........and Swanny - deep in thought.......no doubt looking forward to delivering another deficit speech. Looks like Crean was a Trojan Horse......doesn't make for a happy caucus in the coming months. IMO there's another leadership coup in the ALP barrel.....only a matter of time before someone pulls the trigger!

The situation is untenable. Gillard has been unable to lift the ALP to a winning position in three years. The question is not whether she can win - she can't - but how big the loss will be. For each percentage point, there are five MPs with their careers vanished. At the moment, there are about thirty very worried ALP members.

 

[casanovawa]

Actually just expecting the Liberals to achieve what they believe the Labor party should have. Maybe the current government's problem was that they didn't sell their message well enough? Or that they tried to do too much to compensate for Howard's failure to do any nation building in his last few years. Of course extricating the country from Howard's illegal and immoral war in Iraq hasn't helped.

And despite the Liberal doomsayers the country actually survived the GFC in great condition.

The least of the current govts problem is that they didn't 'sell' their message... The reason they are lower than whale doo doo isn't a perception problem, its that the people are all to well aware of what they said they would do, what they actually did do, and how far apart the two are, plus the continual internal factional brawling... And we aren't still whinging about the Iraq War are we, sheesh...

Given there is now a six week break until parliament sits again I doubt we'll see much of Tony until budget time. The election is now his to lose. Tony's fairly incompetent and he has been coasting on Labor mistakes but now is the time for him to start facing the public and fulfilling his role as the alternative prime minister.

He needs to offer his vision for Australia (if he has one) so the people can see what will happen from September 15.

Just coz Julia decided to announce the election 9 months out it doesn't mean TA has to do anything, she doesn't run any other parties electoral strategy other than Labor's?? Its a furfy to say that he now has all sorts or responsibilities to do anything, he IS the opposition leader and its certainly not his place to start acting like the alternative PM nearly a year out from the poll when she announced it, how ridiculous... Seeing elections are a contest, the Libs and the Greens and everyone else will announce their programs, promises and vision for the future at the appropriate time that suits them... The people will then be left to judge if it was sufficient...

And i think there are plenty more Labor mistakes to come, this mob just can't help themselves, lets see what the budget looks like...

 

[simongr]

Just coz Julia decided to announce the election 9 months out it doesn't mean TA has to do anything, she doesn't run any other parties electoral strategy other than Labor's?? Its a fufry to say that he now has all sorts or responsibilities to do anything, he IS the opposition leader and its certainly not his place to start acting like the alternative PM nearly a year out from the poll when she announced it, how ridiculous... Seeing elections are a contest, the Libs and the Greens and everyone else will announce their programs, promises and vision for the future at the appropriate time that suits them... The people will then be left to judge if it was sufficient...

And i think there are plenty more Labor mistakes to come, this mob just can't help themselves, lets see what the budget looks like...

Exactly this - didn't Julia say that they would continue to govern and have six weeks electioneering - and TA is criticized for following that lead?

 

[casanovawa]

And wasn't one line of reasoning that she announced it because of something to do with Craig Thompson, and that if he was charged and lost his seat or something or a by-election was required, it would effect how the election was held or how much of the house and senate would be involved?? I can't rmember the exact reasoning and can't be bothered frankly to look it up, but not completely sure that the unusual strategy they adopted of giving up the Govt's tactical advantage to call a snap poll was for honorable or somewhat less honourable reasons....

As TA it still wouldn't change the timing of when i estimated was the most advantageous moment to release the Libs election campaign by one jot... Apart from the fact of why on earth would you compete for media attention when this lot are committing hari kari on a weekly basis... If they could just give it a break for a bit there might even be a bit of clear air to get your message out?!?!?

 

[QF WP]

If the new Cabinet is so strong, then why have I never heard of any of the newbies.

An honest question, who has she nominated to replace those Senior Ministers (who are now warming the back benches) - I haven't heard/seen any news today?

 

[Skyring]

And wasn't one line of reasoning that she announced it because of something to do with Craig Thompson, and that if he was charged and lost his seat or something or a by-election was required, it would effect how the election was held or how much of the house and senate would be involved??

If a general election date is announced, then the Speaker may decide not to hold an immediate by-election to fill the casual vacancy, but hold it over until the election.

An election before 3 August would be poor tactics - by any party. The reason is that the terms of the senior class of senators - they are elected six (out of twelve) per state for six year terms every three years - expire in June 2014 and an election may not be held more than a year before the terms expire. If a general election is called now then it would mean that a half-senate election would have to be held in the year up to June 2014.

This is poor tactics because there is generally a "by-election factor" for a half-Senate election, and the Government takes a hit.

Incidentally, this is where Gough Whitlam went completely off the rails on 11 November 1975. The double dissolution election of 1974 meant that the junior class of Senators didn't expire until June 1977, so even if he had held a half-Senate election, there would have been no change in the composition of the Senate for a year and a half.

 

[Skyring]

Geez. Another asylum-seeker boat disaster. Two dead but it could have been a lot worse.

Now, if these were rickety planes flying to Australia and crashing on the way, we'd all be up in arms. Are these lives any less human because they come in boats rather than 727s?

 

[amaroo]

And wasn't one line of reasoning that she announced it because of something to do with Craig Thompson, and that if he was charged and lost his seat or something or a by-election was required,

I'd say nothing to do with Thompson.....but everything to do with the likely resignation of Robert McClelland By-election threat to test PM's leadership | thetelegraph.com.au

Another Rudd supporter that was dumped from Cabinet & has decided to leave the caboose for others to man.

 

[seanpodge]

Given the way the media like to murder so many trees in servicing election date speculation, I suggest that Gillard announcing the date in advance was a great public service. The only losers are the media, who now have to possibly do some journalism rather than just fill in the gaps in election date speculation template stories that they've used for decades.

Just coz Julia decided to announce the election 9 months out it doesn't mean TA has to do anything, she doesn't run any other parties electoral strategy other than Labor's?? Its a furfy to say that he now has all sorts or responsibilities to do anything, he IS the opposition leader and its certainly not his place to start acting like the alternative PM nearly a year out from the poll when she announced it, how ridiculous... Seeing elections are a contest, the Libs and the Greens and everyone else will announce their programs, promises and vision for the future at the appropriate time that suits them... The people will then be left to judge if it was sufficient..

Abbott's policy free zone would be a little more justifiable if he hadn't been sooking for a new election from since about 5 minutes after the independents confirmed that he'd lost the last one. He now wants to have a vote of no confidence, but will he actually let anyone know what the alternative could be if the vote passes? Where's the money coming from to pay for his slogans? How can he explain how he'll bring the budget into surplus without suggesting that the GFC, like climate change, is bovine faeces? What plan does he have beyond developing a time machine and transporting Australia to 2006? I wonder if the Liberals have ever criticised the government for rushing through policy and a lack of consultation with relevant stakeholders when trying to implement new policy........

P.S. Tony, just because you didn't like the result of the election doesn't mean that you get to demand new elections until you find a result you like.

 

[whatmeworry]

Being a resident of MEL, I find it strange that quite a few of the mp's that wanted to knife Gillard are from MEL but Gillard survived. Most MEL mp's are relatively safe yet a few of them wanted her gone, yet we hardly hear a peep from QLD and NSW mp's who have the most to fear from the next election!

If Labour knifed him once, why not bring him back and lead them to an improbable victory and if he is a coughpy leader again dump him again.

 

[amaroo]

Great numbers here Cookies must be enabled. | The Australian

ALP - RIP.

 

[Pukka]

Great numbers here Cookies must be enabled. | The Australian

ALP - RIP.

30% that's about 10% more than they deserve but still looking like an absolute flogging

 

[Sprucegoose]

So what needs to be done? Lets be really explicit here because I reckon Abbott and co will spend the first term telling us about how bad Labor was. Sack thousands of public servants, rescind the mining tax (thanks for those donations chaps!) and tell us how good they are. But nothing for the good of the nation.

Surely the right wing must have a vision of their own for the country?

It will be 12000 public servants