Platinum "anytime" lounge Access ceases from 1 February 2011

[ajw373]

And as someone said earlier in the thread - how would QF know if WP's using the lounge were not flying Qantas? There is zero method to track this domestically.

Domestically being the key word there. As I said in the post above maybe the core issue are international lounges, especially because Qantas doesn't own the international terminals so may not be able to expand the size as 'easily' as they can do in terminals they own.

Having said that though domestically I have noticed, in Canberra in particular that the people behind the desk often use a check sheet when people arrive. Maybe this is what they use to keep track of these things.

 

[ozbeachbabe]

Now, the question I have ... Was that exchange of information from "her knowledge based on experience and chatting with other staffers involved at entry points to lounges", or was it based on information from Qantas Corporate in their latest "bulletin to Lounges" (or whatever their corporate guff is called).
Front line staffers can give candid views at times, but I also see them only give out the "corporate line". If she had been fed that line recently, then she may have used it.

And, a further thought for the Qantas lurkers (and Red Roo). Why are WP's - supposedly one of your most valuable customers flying other carriers????

IMHO lounges at times will be overcrowded simply by the sheer volume of pax with legitimate access & their guests that are travelling on QF (yes QF) flights that day & it's nothing to do with anytime access users at all. It's just a convenient excuse in management's eyes to not 'give a free kick to DJ'. :idea:

Going by WP comments on this thread I'm surprised how few actually used anytime access & the percentage of WP's on this thread covers a vast cross section of members & therefore flies in the face of QF management's theory. :!:

The WP anytime access users have been the fall guy for now but who will be the next bunch on the hit list? The new members of the QP who took advantage of the generous 90th birthday offer or the current holiday special? :evil:

The lady's argument seems flawed on a number of levels:

1. Many have noted that lounge staff never appear to have taken a record of WPs using anytime access, let alone using it when flying another airline. So where's this evidence coming from that WPs not flying QF are glogging up the lounges?
2. Even as a 'legitimate' WP flying with QF, I've only ever shown my card to the lounge agents (with the possible exception of some J lounges in recent times who sometimes request the boarding pass but, as others have noted, these lounges are supposedly exempt from the anytime rule). Not once have I been asked "are you flying Qantas today or are we giving our competitors three terminals down the road a kick? Oh and don't forget to leave the lounge two hours before your flight is due to depart as you'll need to re-clear security."
3. And as so many have pointed out, if the lounges are so damn overcroweded, while the heck have their been two bonuses in three months to join the Club?

As Mal suggests, this sounds like 'speaking points' from the lounge circular.

Sounds like the decision makers at Charlie Q in SYD are feeding lounge dragons this line & they're swallowing it hook, line & sinker probably thinking "great we won't cop so much abuse now because lounges won't be full" but the penny probably won't drop until they realise that the lounges won't be any less crowded after 1st Feb, in fact maybe more so due to current enticements to join the QP. They will still cop abuse from pax tried to get admittance when lounges are full. :shock:

Seems a bit sus when you keep on getting the same party line from different dragons in different lounges. If they don't record who the anytime users are, saying that's it's these folk who are the root cause of lounge overcrowding is pure folly. It's all very well to have a tracking sheet but that's only for who's WP, SG, QP etc not who's WP travelling on QF & who's WP using anytime access.

Spoke to a QF CSM the other day who's had 20 plus years at QF & she was saying her colleagues can't wait for Virgin to unveil their J product as it will force QF to be competitive as they've had a dream run for the last 9 years, you could even say a 'free kick' as no premium competition. They have nothing but admiration for JB & think 'good on him'!

 

[Danger]

Domestically being the key word there. As I said in the post above maybe the core issue are international lounges, especially because Qantas doesn't own the international terminals so may not be able to expand the size as 'easily' as they can do in terminals they own.

A valid point and one I didn't duly recognise (although the lady anat0l, spoke to may well have been speaking about lounges in general, rather than just international). That said, the points I raised (and the same ones raised by countless others) still stand given that anytime access has been removed from all Qantas lounges. Surely, if the international lounges are the issue (where, possibly, they are keeping a tally of who's not flying QF), the logical response would have been to remove anytime access to international lounges. I'm not suggesting that such an 'enhancement' would have been any more palatable, simply that if that's where the problem lies (and there's evidence to support it), then start there.

 

[medhead]

A valid point and one I didn't duly recognise (although the lady anat0l, spoke to may well have been speaking about lounges in general, rather than just international). That said, the points I raised (and the same ones raised by countless others) still stand given that anytime access has been removed from all Qantas lounges. Surely, if the international lounges are the issue (where, possibly, they are keeping a tally of who's not flying QF), the logical response would have been to remove anytime access to international lounges. I'm not suggesting that such an 'enhancement' would have been any more palatable, simply that if that's where the problem lies (and there's evidence to support it), then start there.

I'm not so sure that international lounges are really the issue. I can't really remember the BNE I QP, having been there once in 1998, but I find it difficult to see there would be much of an overcrowding issue. I feeling is that the crowding issue is about domestic lounges. The response from Qantas to my feedback on the removal of anytime access only attempted to justify the change in relation to domestic lounges, although the response made some pretty lame comparison to the first lounge.

 

[Danger]

I'm not so sure that international lounges are really the issue.

I agree wholeheartedly but it seems anat0l's lounge agent is suggesting otherwise. How many of us have been to a wholly QF international lounge and been subject to overcrowding or, worse still, denied entry? I suspect the answer is very few.

 

[medhead]

I agree wholeheartedly but it seems anat0l's lounge agent is suggesting otherwise.

I'm certainly not questioning anat0l's report of the conversation. If the agent wasn't reading from the corporate discussion sheet, the most concerning thing is that CSAs are getting abused. That would just be disgusting

 

[moa999]

I feeling is that the crowding issue is about domestic lounges. .

but
SYD - separate terminals and the T2 QC is nothing to write home about and in a different pier in T2.
BNE - whilst you can walk between QC and DJ/TT it is one big walk
MEL - maybe given it can be a 20min walk from the QC to a QF flight, although the MEL lounge is very big.

 

[ozbeachbabe]

I'm certainly not questioning anat0l's report of the conversation. If the agent wasn't reading from the corporate discussion sheet, the most concerning thing is that CSAs are getting abused. That would just be disgusting

If it's the lounge dragons that are giving someone the bad news ie dening them access or telling at CL member that he can't take 5 guests into the lounge they're the ones who cop it.

I guess it's no different to working at the security screening point when telling someone they can't take a plastic gun in their carry on & listening to the DYKWIA response. Was heading through the screening point this morning & saw first hand security give this guy an alternative ie go back & check the bloody thing in but he wasn't interested in a solution, only arguing the point.

 

[JohnPhelan]

Problem with this reason is

(a) I have never seen overcrowding in biz lounges, and apparently no has anyone here has either, despite flying at all hours.

...

The BNE International Business Lounge is quite small; I have regularly seen it overcrowded to the point that people simply have to stand - all the seats are taken. This is expecially the case in the middle of the day, when QF flights to both SIN (connecting to LHR) and LAX are preparing to depart. At those times, the lounge can't even really cope with just the numbers of J class pax on the QF services, let alone those travelling on airlines which have agreements with QF to let their J pax use the lounge (CX is the one that most notably springs to mind; until recently, it was possible that you would have QF services to SIN, LAX and HKG, and a CX service to HKG, all going within the space of a couple of hours - it was bedlam in the lounge!). So any WP flying on another airline trying to access the Lounge would just make it more unbearable. And I do know of WPs in BNE who use the QF lounge when flying SQ, TG, EK and NZ. (Do bear in mind not as many airlines have their own lounges at BNE international as they do in SYD).

On the domestic front, the BNE Business lounge also gets very crowded at peak times - there have been instances where I have not been able to get a seat. I've certainly never been refused entry, even when the lounge is packed.

I'm currently QF Gold, but have been Platinum in the past. I have to say - though I know this will be unpopular here - that I don't agree with "anytime access" for WPs. If you want to access the QF lounge, then fly with QF. Simple. The one concern I did have with the new policy - the original plan of no "arrival access" - has now been rectified for WPs (though I believe this arrival access should be widened a little further anyway, given that most domestic pax really wouldn't use it, and terminating international pax can't use it).

If I really want to be controversial, I could add that I think the domestic Business lounge should be accessible only to pax who are actually travelling in Business - this would certainly ease the overcrowding in the BNE domestic lounge ....... perhaps part of the existing QP could then be turned into a separate area for WPs who are flying in Y .........:shock:

 

[DC3]

.... If I really want to be controversial, I could add that I think the domestic Business lounge should be accessible only to pax who are actually travelling in Business - this would certainly ease the overcrowding in the BNE domestic lounge ....... :shock:

Red Roo will love you for that. Yet another enhancement, maybe.

 

[straitman]

JohnPhelan,

Does the BNE domestic business lounge still get severely overcrowded since they extended it?

 

[bossreggie]

If I really want to be controversial, I could add that I think the domestic Business lounge should be accessible only to pax who are actually travelling in Business - this would certainly ease the overcrowding in the BNE domestic lounge ....... perhaps part of the existing QP could then be turned into a separate area for WPs who are flying in Y .........:shock:

That would be fine with me as I do not fly economy.

HOWEVER..... It would be a totally stupid move by QANTAS to FURTHER erode benefits of their most loyal customers. DOM J Lounge access has been something EARNED by WP's (Like anytime access actually) and the removal of that benefit would send even more customers to DJ!!

 

[samh004]

JohnPhelan,

Does the BNE domestic business lounge still get severely overcrowded since they extended it?

I was in there recently very early in the morning and the place was chockers, so certainly at times it can be very full, but I think all lounges must have times when they’re packed.

 

[Reggie]

HOWEVER..... It would be a totally stupid move by QANTAS to FURTHER erode benefits of their most loyal customers. DOM J Lounge access has been something EARNED by WP's (Like anytime access actually) and the removal of that benefit would send even more customers to DJ!!

Here's an idea for Qantas, rebadge Dom J as F (like AA), then those flying it get F points and SC's, keeps those PAX happy and makes it harder for others (DJ) to compete. Then rebadge the Dom J lounge to Dom F lounge, and restrict it to those flying F.

As there is no longer a Dom J lounge, it is not an "enhancement" for QFWP's, simply the benefit of the Dom J lounge access is no longer useful as there is no longer a Dom J lounge.

 

[m_ratt]

the QPs had become quite crowded with WPs who were flying other airlines at times. The lounges would get so full that at times people had to be turned away, some of them were "legitimate" WPs flying QF flights.

I call BS. WPs utilising Anytime Access can only access the Qantas Clubs (as per rules). WPs flying with Qantas can access Business Lounge (where available). There should be no conflict - (though I acknowledge that J lounges aren't available at all locations, they are available at the busiest locations IMO.)

I'd suggest that if lounges are looking like they will be getting overcrowded, a temporary restriction on allowing guests should be invoked, (much like the restriction at Perth during QP renovations) rather than Qantas denying entry to their WP passengers.

If J lounges are becoming over crowded because of WPs using Anytime Access then enforcement of the existing rules is required, not changes to the rules.

 

[ajw373]

I'd suggest that if lounges are looking like they will be getting overcrowded, a temporary restriction on allowing guests should be invoked, (much like the restriction at Perth during QP renovations) rather and Qantas denying entry to their WP passengers.

If those passengers are flying another airline then they are not Qantas passengers.

 

[m_ratt]

If those passengers are flying another airline then they are not Qantas passengers.

You've misread. The passengers I'm referring to are the "legitimate" WPs flying QF flights referred to by anat0l. anat0l was talking about 'legitimate' WP QF passengers being turned away from J lounges because they were too full of non QF-travelling WPs.

Note, this post is not about my thoughts for or against the change, rather the BS explanation being given. Anytime access in accordance with the existing rules could not be causing overcrowding in J lounges.

 

[Danger]

I call BS. WPs utilising Anytime Access can only access the Qantas Clubs (as per rules). WPs flying with Qantas can access Business Lounge (where available).

You've misread. The passengers I'm referring to are the "legitimate" WPs flying QF flights referred to by anat0l. anat0l was talking about 'legitimate' WP QF passengers being turned away from J lounges because they were too full of non QF-travelling WPs.

Note, this post is not about my thoughts for or against the change, rather the BS explanation being given. Anytime access in accordance with the existing rules could not be causing overcrowding in J lounges.

Remember, though, although it isn't clear from anat0l's post, it would seem that as he was visiting an international Qantas lounge (which are called Business Lounges), the assumption is that the lady was referring to international lounge overcrowding. Anytime access to international J lounges is entirely within the current rules. Of course, as others have posted, if the lady was referring to all lounges (including domestic lounges), than her argument is flawed on a number of levels.

 

[m_ratt]

Remember, though, although it isn't clear from anat0l's post, it would seem that as he was visiting an international Qantas lounge (which are called Business Lounges), the assumption is that the lady was referring to international lounge overcrowding. Anytime access to international J lounges is entirely within the current rules. Of course, as others have posted, if the lady was referring to all lounges (including domestic lounges), than her argument is flawed on a number of levels.

My apologies - clearly I am mistaken. I keep forgetting about the international anytime access consideration.

Is crowding that much of an issue in international J lounges? I've not experienced it, though I haven't done much international travel.

 

[Alanslegal]

Here's an idea for Qantas, rebadge Dom J as F (like AA), then those flying it get F points and SC's, keeps those PAX happy and makes it harder for others (DJ) to compete. Then rebadge the Dom J lounge to Dom F lounge, and restrict it to those flying F.

But holding a domestic F boarding pass doesn't even allow access into an Admirals Club, hence QF would have to deny everyone flying the east coast routes :mrgreen: and *bingo* no more lounge overcrowding issues, and everyone in the lounge will be a QP member :shock: