Qantas apologises to frequent flyers with status extensions, lounge passes, points & more reward seats

Joe Aston is often on the money, and doesn't pull the punches.

Over on the ABC, one of their best remaining journalists is Ian Verrender

This piece has nothing new, but its a nice summary for the average reader.

Although there are definite failures of QF management and poor decisions made, be careful not to ascribe everything negative as a result of management.

For instance this sentence from the article:

It's worth remembering that while the pandemic losses of the past three years have been huge – around $4.5 billion – they pale into insignificance with the own goal Joyce kicked in his debilitating fight with Virgin's Borghetti a decade ago.

For almost three years, as Qantas attempted to obliterate Virgin, it refused to concede market share to its domestic rival, constantly slashing fares. It was terrific for customers but running at a loss has its limits


This makes it sounds as the capacity war that culminated in 2014 was mostly Joyce’s fault, and he should’ve surrendered to VA. Didn’t mention that VA were also running at a loss in that period as their capacity losses were funded and egged on by Air NZ, SQ and EY to hurt QF. Easy to say Qantas should have keeled over and let 3 foreign carriers destroy their market share.

Also fails to mention that AJ turned QF to multi billion dollar profits from 2016-2019, whereas Borghetti could barely turn a profit and was mostly loss making from 2014 to 2020. But that article implies Borghetti mostly did a good job at VA which certainly wasn’t the case.

I think if you were writing an article about the man you’d have to begrudgingly mention that, there is a reason the board keeps him on. It’s why when Covid hit VA was in administration within weeks, whereas QF had some rough times but mostly survived.
 
Again that’s your opinion and experience many have not experienced that and/or have had similar issues with JQ, VA2 and Rexy.

Check out the BITRE data:

July 2022 QF group had 52.3% OTP and 6.2% cancellation rate. VA group had 50.9% OTP and 7.7% cancellation rate. Should QF had done better? Of course, but almost all the media attention has focused on “QF is now a shambles” whereas VA group had a slightly worse performance but has escaped the negative publicity. Where’s the calls for the resignation of the leaders of Virgin?
 
Check out the BITRE data:

July 2022 QF group had 52.3% OTP and 6.2% cancellation rate. VA group had 50.9% OTP and 7.7% cancellation rate. Should QF had done better? Of course, but almost all the media attention has focused on “QF is now a shambles” whereas VA group had a slightly worse performance but has escaped the negative publicity. Where’s the calls for the resignation of the leaders of Virgin?
And qantas receive billions of $ of bailout. Lufthans apaid their bailout back end 2020 cough On Kwantas
 
I don't think we need to go down the VA vs QF path, not thread title & fruitless arguement, we like/prefer who we do for various reasons as jake7 has stated.

CEO offering an apology says it all, QF struggling in many facets & to offer a $50 voucher & increase their minimum air fares at exactly same time really says a lot of what Alan is about, smoke n mirrors.
such a poor look IMO.

I'm still interested how the J lounge passes are going to be categorized under current QF naming classification, I know minature in scheme of things.
 
And qantas receive billions of $ of bailout.

So did VA, they received an equivalent amount of Jobkeeper and Aviation Support Package handouts, along with subsidised routes and tickets. And after all that they’re in a slightly worse OTP and cancellation situation than QF last month.

It’s not meant to be an excuse for QF, but acknowledgement that the conditions that’ve caused a decrease in QF performance have caused a slightly worse loss of performance at VA, but with none of the media backlash.

For instance QF did get rid of a lot of pilots and this is now causing some issues with catch up, but all of QF’s pilot redundancies were voluntary, not a single QF pilot was fired against their will. Whereas VA cut out several hundred pilots, about 30% of their workforce, in compulsory redundancies. They’re starting to bring some of them back but it will take several years and not all the who were fired will be re-employed.

But it’s only QF that cops heat for sacking employees, VA did the same and escapes criticism.
 
So did VA, they received an equivalent amount of Jobkeeper and Aviation Support Package handouts, along with subsidised routes and tickets. And after all that they’re in a slightly worse OTP and cancellation situation than QF last month.

It’s not meant to be an excuse for QF, but acknowledgement that the conditions that’ve caused a decrease in QF performance have caused a slightly worse loss of performance at VA, but with none of the media backlash.

For instance QF did get rid of a lot of pilots and this is now causing some issues with catch up, but all of QF’s pilot redundancies were voluntary, not a single QF pilot was fired against their will. Whereas VA cut out several hundred pilots, about 30% of their workforce, in compulsory redundancies. They’re starting to bring some of them back but it will take several years and not all the who were fired will be re-employed.

But it’s only QF that cops heat for sacking employees, VA did the same and escapes criticism.
Bye bye Kwantas
 
So did VA, they received an equivalent amount of Jobkeeper and Aviation Support Package handouts, along with subsidised routes and tickets. And after all that they’re in a slightly worse OTP and cancellation situation than QF last month.

It’s not meant to be an excuse for QF, but acknowledgement that the conditions that’ve caused a decrease in QF performance have caused a slightly worse loss of performance at VA, but with none of the media backlash.

For instance QF did get rid of a lot of pilots and this is now causing some issues with catch up, but all of QF’s pilot redundancies were voluntary, not a single QF pilot was fired against their will. Whereas VA cut out several hundred pilots, about 30% of their workforce, in compulsory redundancies. They’re starting to bring some of them back but it takes time.

But it’s only QF that cops heat for sacking employees, VA did the same and escapes criticism.
It is completely ridiculous, pointless & utter waste of time putting any thought into 1% or 2% difference between airlines in cancellation rate.
Airline A wins this month 0.5%, Airlines B wins next month by 1.2%....swings & roundabouts.

If it was closer to 10% then there'd be something to post about or apologies about, ha!
 
And qantas receive billions of $ of bailout. Lufthansa paid their bailout back end 2020 cough On Kwantas
AJ has to fund the proposed share buy backs from somewhere while crying "hard times". Of course the buy backs are likely to push up the share price as the number of issued shares drops and that will benefit many, including a certain CEO positioning for retirement.
 
Well, maybe. I reckon "spending more than you need to" is a qualification that applies to everyone. Whether you can afford it, or whether you care is where it applies to the individual I reckon.

And don't worry, Virgin and their partners are coming into my life more and more - and it's not about price 🤣.
It's "Wants and Needs" you know. More "Wants" is suspect.
 
So did VA, they received an equivalent amount of Jobkeeper and Aviation Support Package handouts, along with subsidised routes and tickets. And after all that they’re in a slightly worse OTP and cancellation situation than QF last month.

It’s not meant to be an excuse for QF, but acknowledgement that the conditions that’ve caused a decrease in QF performance have caused a slightly worse loss of performance at VA, but with none of the media backlash.

For instance QF did get rid of a lot of pilots and this is now causing some issues with catch up, but all of QF’s pilot redundancies were voluntary, not a single QF pilot was fired against their will. Whereas VA cut out several hundred pilots, about 30% of their workforce, in compulsory redundancies. They’re starting to bring some of them back but it will take several years and not all the who were fired will be re-employed.

But it’s only QF that cops heat for sacking employees, VA did the same and escapes criticism.

VA are keeping a very low profile corporately at the moment, they have several very messy court cases leveled at them including personal ones against their CEO for bullying and the organisation at a whole for bullying and harrassment - so by keeping out of sight they are less of a target, for everything good and bad, including equally poor performance, for many of the same reasons as QF.

QF are just a bigger target. Easier mark and draws more clicks on a headline.

Anyway as Moootime said - both airlines are performing equally now pretty much anyway.
 
It is completely ridiculous, pointless & utter waste of time putting any thought into 1% or 2% difference between airlines in cancellation rate.
Airline A wins this month 0.5%, Airlines B wins next month by 1.2%....swings & roundabouts.

If it was closer to 10% then there'd be something to post about or apologies about, ha!
Exactly. X Airline 'winning' the worst reliability stakes by 1-3% over Y Airline for any given reporting period is not news.
 
It is completely ridiculous, pointless & utter waste of time putting any thought into 1% or 2% difference between airlines in cancellation rate.
Airline A wins this month 0.5%, Airlines B wins next month by 1.2%....swings & roundabouts.

If it was closer to 10% then there'd be something to post about or apologies about, ha!

I agree that 1% and 2% differences mean basically nothing in the long run, both VA and QF went from roughly 85% OTP to 50% and both have cancelled a similar number of flights.

But the issue is the media have shifted the public consciousness to a full scale attack on Qantas for supposed incompetence beyond the level of any of its competitors, but the evidence is that it is performing at the same standard was VA.

Case in point - these forums have a thread (this one) basically lamenting the word of QF, whereas the VA forum is quite absent of such threads.
 
Again that’s your opinion and experience many have not experienced that and/or have had similar issues with JQ, VA2 and Rexy.
Yes, but the poor experience on those others is so much cheaper 🤣.

And there's that other Qantas slogan again. "Qantas. We're just as bad as all the others."

And yes, that's my opinion too 🤣
 
Last edited:
I agree that 1% and 2% differences mean basically nothing in the long run, both VA and QF went from roughly 85% OTP to 50% and both have cancelled a similar number of flights.

But the issue is the media have shifted the public consciousness to a full scale attack on Qantas for supposed incompetence beyond the level of any of its competitors, but the evidence is that it is performing at the same standard was VA.

Case in point - these forums have a thread (this one) basically lamenting the word of QF, whereas the VA forum is quite absent of such threads.
Yes I hear you, fair call.
As much fun & interest it is discussing QF vs VA & how media play on them we must stick to thread title.

It's more of a pub mates discussion imo.
 
AJ has to fund the proposed share buy backs from somewhere while crying "hard times". Of course the buy backs are likely to push up the share price as the number of issued shares drops and that will benefit many, including a certain CEO positioning for retirement.
AJ simply brought out the well-worn playbook of his heros and mentors and followed it tirelessly ... "Use the Group, young Alan!" - build opacity in the books, balance sheet transfers, play off your employees against each other, parasite the expensive parts of the business, grow the losses, strip and shift assets. Bad mouth the organisation and its people, re-write the books to slash asset values and drop the share price while in fights with the employees, then secure the big options deals priced at bargain basement ... which you'll cash in when the inevitable bounce comes once the books are washed, full of under-priced assets and with the employment agreements done and dusted at the lowpoint. Ka-ching.
Rinse.
Repeat.
 
Australia's highest-earning Velocity Frequent Flyer credit card: Offer expires: 21 Jan 2025
- Earn 60,000 bonus Velocity Points
- Get unlimited Virgin Australia Lounge access
- Enjoy a complimentary return Virgin Australia domestic flight each year

AFF Supporters can remove this and all advertisements

Not sure if it’s been mentioned earlier by my SG J lounge vouchers arrived today. The explanations section doesn’t appear to have been updated to reflect the new acronym.

31C76221-410A-43A6-AD92-127F05A30188.png
 
But the issue is the media have shifted the public consciousness to a full scale attack on Qantas for supposed incompetence beyond the level of any of its competitors, but the evidence is that it is performing at the same standard was VA.

Case in point - these forums have a thread (this one) basically lamenting the word of QF, whereas the VA forum is quite absent of such threads.

That's probably because Qantas also has a customer service problem at the moment. Dealing with Qantas, as a customer, has become much more difficult than dealing with Virgin when things go wrong.
 
Agree, the discussion about QF's higher fares targeting a 'different type of customer' seems to have missed a key reason many are willing to pay the higher fares on Qantas over the cheaper competitors - the perception that these are premium prices because you get a premium service, and for many the idea of paying a bit more to get the peace of mind that you'll be looked after if anything goes wrong, while a lower cost carrier may leave you stranded or at least be more difficult to deal with.
 

Become an AFF member!

Join Australian Frequent Flyer (AFF) for free and unlock insider tips, exclusive deals, and global meetups with 65,000+ frequent flyers.

AFF members can also access our Frequent Flyer Training courses, and upgrade to Fast-track your way to expert traveller status and unlock even more exclusive discounts!

AFF forum abbreviations

Wondering about Y, J or any of the other abbreviations used on our forum?

Check out our guide to common AFF acronyms & abbreviations.
Back
Top