QFF Ideas & Suggestions

[markis10]

What is the difference between the front of economy and the back? It's still economy, isn't it? Note I said that "in addition to", not "instead of" higher rated flyers.

A lot when:

1. You want your choice of meal
2. You want to be offered a newspaper that was not needed in J
3. You want more legroom than Dom J (read row 4 737)
4. You want to get off quickly in order to make the connection or transport that leaves soon.

 

[ejb]

What is the difference between the front of economy and the back? It's still economy, isn't it? Note I said that "in addition to", not "instead of" higher rated flyers.

It's pure business - if you already have clearly loyal customers, shouldn't your aim be to gain more? Considering those loyal ones are still loyal, no matter if they get upgrades or not?

All these 'loyal', 'higher status' flyers already have the opportunity to gain more FF points which would enable them to access upgrades using points. Your average Joe does not have this option.

I think any paying passenger should have the chance at an upgrade.

All paying pax do have the chance of upgrades, and QF process them all according to the rules of the program.

Most pax would prefer the front part of Y as it allows for faster exiting and comes with more chance of exit/bulkhead to provide more room.

Also as food service is front to back you have a greater chance of two choices.

If a company does not reward loyalty it will need to spend big on gaining new business all the time so money spent on loyalty programs is saving advertising.


ejb

 

[medhead]

What is the difference between the front of economy and the back?

10 to 15 minutes, which is a massive difference when I want to catch that train from Sydney airport. It is the the amount of time it takes me to walk to the car park in Adelaide.

It's pure business - if you already have clearly loyal customers, shouldn't your aim be to gain more? Considering those loyal ones are still loyal, no matter if they get upgrades or not?

All these 'loyal', 'higher status' flyers already have the opportunity to gain more FF points which would enable them to access upgrades using points. Your average Joe does not have this option.

Isn't another important aim to keep those loyal customers? This loyal customer isn't loyal no matter what. I have had one half upgrade (domestic J seat, Y service) in about 1993. The removal of anytime access has been enough for me to switch flights to Virgin Blue. I've given you an example below from my last flight of the type of havoc a "potential" loyal customer can cause for the existing loyal customer. Too many reoccurences of that sort of rubbish and I'll be looking to find somewhere were that doesn't happen. Qantas stands to lose more flights from me in a month than that bronze flyer is doing a year.

As for earning points, a frequent flyer has paid for their points by buying flights that give revenue to Qantas. Your average Joe does have the option to earn points with the credit card and shopping partners. In fact it is much easier to gets points from a credit card, even with all my flying I get more points from partners than from flying.

[Rant]
I get really annoyed in situations like last night where there was 4 or 5 empty business seat and I've got a novice flyer, using a virgin boarding pass for a book mark, sitting in the middle seat next to me when there are at least 5 empty seats in rows further back; well I say next to me but half the time the guy was all over me, either with legs spread into the area in front of my seat, elbows hanging over the armrest or best of all leaning across to look between the seats to watch the iPad of the the person in the seat in front of me.

 

[straitman]

What is the difference between the front of economy and the back? It's still economy, isn't it?

The other morning when we arrived in HNL the difference probably was about on hour in the Immigration queue. :shock:

 

[AnonymousCoward]

4. I have hotel membership with Accor, Rydges, Priority etc, but because I am conscious of cost and running a business, I don't pick the highest priced roomrate, therefore, no points are awarded towards the QFF program. Not a good way to keep one's loyalty to Qantas (or any carrier) because of this. All partnerships should attract points. I paid for Accor accommodation night 40 or more times last year and no points were valid as they were under the allowable to attract such for QFF.(Add that amount up over the year). Its all about money.

FF points are not free - they cost the hotel chain money. So they could give you points, but they'd have to charge you more. But you don't want to pay more. So who's going to pay?

Having rooms without points is a good thing - it means choice for the consumer. Some people would just prefer a cheaper rate without having to pay for the hidden cost of points. Alternatively, if you do want points, just pay the required premium.

 

[serfty]

All paying pax do have the chance of upgrades, and QF process them all according to the rules of the program. ...

Not true; those in deep discount (N, O, Q, E) revenue class are generally not eligible for point upgrades.

Also, those using Any-Seat awards are eligible, even in X, U or Z.

 

[Lawlass]

It's pure business - if you already have clearly loyal customers, shouldn't your aim be to gain more? Considering those loyal ones are still loyal, no matter if they get upgrades or not?

Um, Business 101 is you should do more to keep your current customers than to try and gain new ones.

Seeing instances of NBs getting upgraded when I was stuck in Y added to the getting status matched = I am now trying out Virgin, and if I'm happy with their product I will stick with them as I don't think Qantas is that interested in my business.

 

[cphilpott]

PHILLY Re: QFF Ideas & Suggestions

A further issue that could be considered by Qantas in this debate is for long serving life members of the Qantas club to receive some upgrading considerations

 

[JohnM]

My particular disappointment with the recent 'enhancements' to the FF program is to do with the greatly increased SC requirement to achieve Partner Gold.

I know a lot of members say they don't see the point of PG as they travel with their partner and can guest him/her - or their partner holds SG or WP in their own right.

In my case, my partner has no need for business travel of her own as she works in local real estate. But principally, she is unable to always travel with me for the full duration of my trips. Often we meet in domestic ports or, more commonly, overseas or travel outbound together and she returns earlier than me.

In these situations PG is of immense benefit to us and I have maintained that for the last few years.

I support the recent change to allow family-member G as I can see it would be useful for those with high-status partners in their own right to be able to anoint a parent, child, rich aunt or whoever.

The upcoming increase to 2400 SCs to achieve PG (or family-member G) is pretty tough on the likes of me who has the particular need for PG outlined above.

Consider this:

First year achieving WP + PG: 2100 SC (1400 + 700) = a full new WP + full new SG.

Renewing WP + PG: 2100 SC (1200 + 700 (= full SG) + effectively a 200 SC premium to maintain the PG).

New system: Renew WP + PG: 2400 SC (1200 + 700 + effectively a 500 SC premium to maintain the PG).

So effectively it will soon equates to two WP renewals. Why can't it be Partner Platinum with the extra benefits that entails instead of merely PG? The 'price' has been paid, has it not?

I know Partner JohnM would appreciate that when travelling to/from Australia solo - after all it's what she's accustomed to when I guest her in the F lounge, for example. It would certainly give me the incentive to crank up the earn to 2400 SC but as it stands it's now borderline:evil:. 2400 SCs is a big ask for a SFSC.

I guess there must be some reason for QF making these 'enhancements' but it seems a solid penalty for somebody who genuinely appreciates PG and works to maintain it. I guess I'm in such a minority on this that nobody has considered such implications or greatly cares.

It's going to be tough for me to maintain PG but Partner JohnM now has certain and now well-entrenched expectations!

 

[rtyuiop]

Obviously I can't really say whether or not the numbers work for this, but paying a bit more attention to BNE would certainly make me happier. The fact that the QF lounge in *Wellington* is way nicer than the int lounge in BNE verges on being insulting!

Danny

 

[TonyHancock]

It's going to be tough for me to maintain PG but Partner JohnM now has certain and now well-entrenched expectations!

I share your pain on this one. It is compounded for me by the change occurring in May. My QFF year ends in July. I had my travel planned so that I would reach 2100 by the end of July, it is a tough but achievable schedule. 2400 is just about unreachable without an SC run using JASA's.

All of my flights are Why and Why+ so there are a few of them to get to 2100. The prospect of an SC run is not appealing and I don't really want to burn valuable upgrade points.

When I saw the "enhancement" my first reaction was to say enough is enough I'm going to do enough to qualify for WP and then take my travel spend elsewhere. :evil:

Mrs H had a different view though...one which I have been gently persuaded to share!!

Man or Mouse?.....Squeak

 

[markis10]

PG at 2100 made sense given 1400 qual for WP + 700 qual for SG = 2100, to move to 2400 could well be a forward indicator of further changes in the pipeline?

 

[TonyHancock]

PG at 2100 made sense given 1400 qual for WP + 700 qual for SG = 2100, to move to 2400 could well be a forward indicator of further changes in the pipeline?

That is my fear.

If they move the goalposts for LTG I will be very disappointed....err....devastated!!

 

[justin23]

A a PS i actually feel, Silvers get a bad rep and always lumped in with Bronzes.... I have Silver on 50% leisure (usually 1 international and a few domestic) and 50% work (all domestic, and most in Y). Now if the new check in works i won't complain about taking away the domestic priority queue for silvers.

My ideas are going to upset a few of the people who think they should be treated like royalty on here. But I'm trying to find innovative ways to use FF points and not just complain about being treated better cause I'm a whatever....

One feature I like is the ability to pay points for the exit row. Even if I was SG or WP it wouldn't bother me. I'd like to extend that idea though to middle seats. If the plane is not full, then people willing to part with a few FF points should be guaranteed a vacant seat next to them.

Also what about being given the opportunity to pay for SC's. OK so to make sure its not just people using their woolies and CC points, limit the SC purchase to be offered by Qantas at anniversary time for those who fall within say 25% of the next status level. So its not for free gets rid of FF points and means people who have a bad year flying or have erratic flying patterns maintain status.

I'd also like lifetime silver lowered to 5,000, It really doesn't give you much, but its a safety net, to avoid going back to Bronze ever again. Silver effectively is a slightly heavier bag and free luggage tags now plus slightly better earn on flights over 1,000 miles.

My biggest issue is because i have erratic flying patterns, sometimes I get close to gold, sometimes i lose silver. I've flown once in Australia in my life on a non Qantas affiliated airline because Qantas don't fly to Exmouth. I don't expect anything for free, but happy to use points for things like exit rows, spare middle seats etc.

Also on the topic of flying on Qantas, rather than bonus FF points as a status bonus, how about bonus SC's based on legs flown. Say 10 SC for every ten legs.

 

[samh004]

Also on the topic of flying on Qantas, rather than bonus FF points as a status bonus, how about bonus SC's based on legs flown. Say 10 SC for every ten legs.

But would 10SC actually be more valuable to you after 10 flights? I think 10 would be a raw deal on that

 

[ejb]

...
Also what about being given the opportunity to pay for SC's. OK so to make sure its not just people using their woolies and CC points, limit the SC purchase to be offered by Qantas at anniversary time for those who fall within say 25% of the next status level. So its not for free gets rid of FF points and means people who have a bad year flying or have erratic flying patterns maintain status.

...

You already can do this, you just need to take a ASA and SC's are free.

From as little as 8000 points you can "buy" 10 SC's on a SYD-MEL flight.

ejb

 

[drewbles]

A a PS i actually feel, Silvers get a bad rep and always lumped in with Bronzes.... I have Silver on 50% leisure (usually 1 international and a few domestic) and 50% work (all domestic, and most in Y). Now if the new check in works i won't complain about taking away the domestic priority queue for silvers.

My ideas are going to upset a few of the people who think they should be treated like royalty on here. But I'm trying to find innovative ways to use FF points and not just complain about being treated better cause I'm a whatever....

One feature I like is the ability to pay points for the exit row. Even if I was SG or WP it wouldn't bother me. I'd like to extend that idea though to middle seats. If the plane is not full, then people willing to part with a few FF points should be guaranteed a vacant seat next to them.

You already can pay for an exit row with points I believe. See Book - Manage Your Booking - Flight Booking - Exit Row Seat Bookings .

If you want an empty seat, you should buy one, regardless of your FF status. The empty seat should be a benefit not a purchasable item IMHO. This would also be particularly difficult to deal with due to aircraft changes, and last minute flights or other pax being transferred for various reasons. I don't think there would be an easy way to implement this.

Also what about being given the opportunity to pay for SC's. OK so to make sure its not just people using their woolies and CC points, limit the SC purchase to be offered by Qantas at anniversary time for those who fall within say 25% of the next status level. So its not for free gets rid of FF points and means people who have a bad year flying or have erratic flying patterns maintain status.

They're called JASA's

I'd also like lifetime silver lowered to 5,000, It really doesn't give you much, but its a safety net, to avoid going back to Bronze ever again. Silver effectively is a slightly heavier bag and free luggage tags now plus slightly better earn on flights over 1,000 miles.

I would agree that LTS should be dropped in line with the new changes. The old was 20x350, so i'd say the new one should be 20x300 (not 20x250). Make it 6000 instead of 7000. That would be in line with LTG then.

My biggest issue is because i have erratic flying patterns, sometimes I get close to gold, sometimes i lose silver. I've flown once in Australia in my life on a non Qantas affiliated airline because Qantas don't fly to Exmouth. I don't expect anything for free, but happy to use points for things like exit rows, spare middle seats etc.

Many people on here do have erratic patterns, but unfortunately, that's how things work. I spent a good 5-6 years around 150-90SC's short of SG, and just had to suck it up. I never could quite make it up to SG, and had to keep paying for my QP as a result.

Also on the topic of flying on Qantas, rather than bonus FF points as a status bonus, how about bonus SC's based on legs flown. Say 10 SC for every ten legs.

Interesting idea, but that also could be a little skewed. If you have someone who's doing regular runs on MEL-SYD or SYD-BNE where each sector (in discount whY) is getting them 10SC's, then they are netting 100SC's for every 10 segments. That's a 10% bonus.

Change this to someone doing SYD-PER or MEL-PER in J frequently. They're getting 800SC's for each 10 segments they take. That's a 1.25% bonus. If you were going to implement a system like this, perhaps a percentage based on your previous 10 flights would work better (say 10-15% bonus on the average of the past 10 segments)? I personally still think the old style upgrade credits would be better, that way, if you do have erratic travel patterns, you are not being disadvantaged (as the old upgrade credits expired every 18-24 months iirc).

 

[JohnK]

What is the difference between the front of economy and the back? It's still economy, isn't it? Note I said that "in addition to", not "instead of" higher rated flyers.

The difference is huge.

It takes at least 5-10 extra minutes to get off the aircraft, food choices run out, little time to finish meal on short sectors, hardly any time left for second drink, etc.

It's pure business - if you already have clearly loyal customers, shouldn't your aim be to gain more? Considering those loyal ones are still loyal, no matter if they get upgrades or not?

And if a loyal customer sees Qantas throwing around benefits to casual flyers in the hope of getting them they will quickly switch loyalty.

Do you realise what it costs to acquire a new customer let alone get an old disgruntled customer to come back?

All these 'loyal', 'higher status' flyers already have the opportunity to gain more FF points which would enable them to access upgrades using points. Your average Joe does not have this option.

And the higher status flyer deserves to have those points as for some like me they have been earned the hard way. Why should QF reward Average Joe? QF is not a charity.

I think any paying passenger should have the chance at an upgrade.

All paying passengers have a chance of an upgrade it is just that the ones that fly more have a better chance. That is a reward for loyalty.

....well I say next to me but half the time the guy was all over me, either with legs spread into the area in front of my seat, elbows hanging over the armrest or best of all leaning across to look between the seats to watch the iPad of the the person in the seat in front of me.

You can do what I do and that is reclaim your space. They soon move their elbows, shoulders and legs when I am leaning hard against them.

PG at 2100 made sense given 1400 qual for WP + 700 qual for SG = 2100, to move to 2400 could well be a forward indicator of further changes in the pipeline?

Platinum at 1,600 SC's and Gold at 800 SC's.

 

[jebbo]

FF points are not free - they cost the hotel chain money. So they could give you points, but they'd have to charge you more. But you don't want to pay more. So who's going to pay?

Having rooms without points is a good thing - it means choice for the consumer. Some people would just prefer a cheaper rate without having to pay for the hidden cost of points. Alternatively, if you do want points, just pay the required premium.

The membership of the hotel programme is not free.

 

[samh004]

Platinum at 1,600 SC's and Gold at 800 SC's.

I doubt I’d manage to qualify for Gold at that level, and re-qualification would be a task.