Should there be some kind of censorship?

[Captain Halliday]

Or talk in riddles, like some of the fuel dump folk do!

Some days you just have to get the aircraft down to the maximum landing weight. Dumping is often the only option.

 

[Milboo]

So Samh004 as admin says there is no private section or dark threads yet Capt Halliday self declares to be a member of a dark thread??

It comes down to a basic premise - if you don’t want something broadcast widely or discussed openly then don’t stick it on the Net! Once the cat is out of the bag you can’t control the message - social media 101.

There are plenty of other options for discussions to occur like via email, PM or even a closed FB group (doesn’t one exist anyway??).

 

[Captain Halliday]

So Samh004 as admin says there is no private section or dark threads yet Capt Halliday self declares to be a member of a dark thread??

It comes down to a basic premise - if you don’t want something broadcast widely or discussed openly then don’t stick it on the Net! Once the cat is out of the bag you can’t control the message - social media 101.

There are plenty of other options for discussions to occur like via email, PM or even a closed FB group (doesn’t one exist anyway??).

Okay, I should clarify so as not to mislead.

My use of the phrase “dark thread” was tongue in cheek. Sorry if the sarcasm was not adequately conveyed.

What I mean is, I PM people, and they PM me when we want to keep something fairly quiet.

Edit for further clarity: I have no reason to doubt the information provided earlier by Samh004.

 

[serfty]

And dare we say anything about the sharing of paying the ATO using credit cards (and, ahem, the 'accidental' abuse of that)? It was only a matter of time before the CC companies and banks were going to put the kybosh on that.

I think you'll find it was the actuaries, who found their predicted breakage was significantly out of kilter with real KPI's that put the kybosh on most ATO earn.

There's a member here who basically had a MS business that was eventually shut down without any of the methods being publicised here.

 

[oz_mark]

I think you'll find it was the actuaries, who found their predicted breakage was significantly out of kilter with real KPI's that put the kybosh on most ATO earn.

Interchange on govt is pretty small. I think that did most of it in.

With direct earn credit cards (i.e those that send points to Qantas or Virgin directly), there is no breakage for the banks, the airlines get it

 

[Deleted member]

I’m also broadly in support of keeping things as open as possible. But I also self declare being a member of a dark thread. Edit: in other words, I use PM/conversation function when discretion is required.

One of the difficulties is that people don’t know what they don’t know. Some of the posters asking questions about the flight deposit method had low post count which I suspect is an indication they are new to the FF/status/points game. So I doubt they even realised what they were doing.

A couple of suggestions:

1. Members who know how things work could jump in quickly with a PM to gently point out a perceived indiscretion, yet still offer to help. I know in my early AFF days I was asked to delete a post or two by members who felt I was letting the cat out of the bag on certain things. To their credit they also taught me a thing or two.

2. As we love a good acronym on AFF, perhaps we should have one that would indicate deals that should be discussed in a discrete manner. Perhaps we mark them NFP and people can contact the poster via PM for details. The OP can then make a call case-by-case.

And as I type this I realise that dot point 2 completely contradicts my opening line. Oh it’s such a vexed issue.

That has happened before. However the obtuse and uninitiated, will continue to discuss in open forum, in spite of subtle hints to not do so.

 

[OATEK]

One of the difficulties is that people don’t know what they don’t know.

I think that this is a key point - while I know a great deal more about loyalty programs, status runs and just got to grips with JASA's before they were canned, I don't know what I am missing out on. And there are several references in this thread to events/people that go straight through to the keeper. And to cap it off, Sydney is not big on social events for AFFers when compared to Melbourne.

But on the positive side, like Drron I have continued on doing some contract work since retirement, and use that with what I have learnt here to travel almost exclusively in J on my overseas (1-2 major trips per year). I travel regularly in J on domestic flights using EF to look for U availability before booking in Y, again all learnt here. And I am gathering points in far greater quantities than before I joined AFF. Even the little things like T-80 can have significant benefit. So what I have learnt in an open forum has changed my travel completely.

As someone who didn't know any of the tricks when I was really a frequent flyer for work, I try not to think about what I missed out on.

So I am inclined to the view to keep the forum open, but for there to be a way hinting that a PM might be warranted for information that might be kept closer to member's chests.

 

[get me outta here]

There are members here whether paid or not who are on other fora. I am disappointed when I see people there [Ozbargain etc), refer those readers to AFF to get our insight. I think the issue is uncontrollable.

 

[Buzzard]

I'm torn between 2 masters.
I've learnt a lot on AFF and a lot more by going to social events.
As AFF has grown over the years what was once relatively private is now perhaps quite public. Yes it's a shame that so many lurks have been killed off, that's evolution i suppose.

 

[serfty]

It's not just AFF where such occurs. There's some facebook groups I know of that while closed, extensive discussion on DSC/Vouchers occurred.

One group with over 7.4K members has a several large threads on it.

No way hiding stuff AFF is going to keep that sort of information out of the public eye.

 

[Vic]

It's not just AFF where such occurs. There's some facebook groups I know of that while closed, extensive discussion on DSC/Vouchers occurred.

One group with over 7.4K members has a several large threads on it.

No way hiding stuff AFF is going to keep that sort of information out of the public eye.

Can Alan Joyce just casually read discussions in such a closed group?
Surely people should have enough sense to self censor their desire to openly and publicly discuss ways to deceive Qantas to gain access to promotion benefits.

 

[Princess Fiona]

Can Alan Joyce just casually read discussions in such a closed group?
Surely people should have enough sense to self censor their desire to openly and publicly discuss ways to deceive Qantas to gain access to promotion benefits.

Non-members cannot read stuff on closed groups.
Screenshots can be seen by anyone though.

My own view is that there are some things that lend themselves to open discussion here, Facebook or elsewhere and there are plenty of others that would be better off remaining face to face, via PM etc.
I think that everyone posting a new finding or so-called loophole should ask themselves which of the two is likely to keep it alive for longer.....

 

[Vic]

Non-members cannot read stuff on closed groups.
Screenshots can be seen by anyone though.

My own view is that there are some things that lend themselves to open discussion here, Facebook or elsewhere and there are plenty of others that would be better off remaining face to face, via PM etc.
I think that everyone posting a new finding or so-called loophole should ask themselves which of the two are likely to keep it alive for longer.....

Indeed.
Decision makers at Qantas can easily access this forum casually at will when they have 5 minutes to spare. They need a mole in a closed group to take screenshots for them and add them to the workload of briefings. Neither information is secret but the pathway length to Qantas are different.

I've noticed the voucher discussion around here, even fi they are useless to me. The majority of it is along the lines of Qantas have a promo if you buy between X date to Y date, there are no sale fares at this time. No problem but a voucher and book later when there is a sale fare. Detailed instructions on bypassing Qantas ablility to acheive a price premium for the extra benefits provided. I think there is a need for people to censor their replies.

 

[get me outta here]

@Vic, did you just outline the very thing people here are wondering should not be shared?

 

[Terry Russell]

If you find a "hack" (hate that word) or loophole, tell your friends! Don't boast in your blog or broadcast it.
IT systems are imperfect and patches can be applied when unintended goodies affect the airline's bottom line in a major way.
Censorship should only be applied in extreme cases, such as when members run businesses which intend to feed off the loophole.

 

[BettyB]

Indeed.
Decision makers at Qantas can easily access this forum casually at will when they have 5 minutes to spare. They need a mole in a closed group to take screenshots for them and add them to the workload of briefings. Neither information is secret but the pathway length to Qantas are different.

I've noticed the voucher discussion around here, even fi they are useless to me. The majority of it is along the lines of Qantas have a promo if you buy between X date to Y date, there are no sale fares at this time. No problem but a voucher and book later when there is a sale fare. Detailed instructions on bypassing Qantas ablility to acheive a price premium for the extra benefits provided. I think there is a need for people to censor their replies.

I've not seen anything like this discussed previously and I think it's a good example of why there should be no censorship here. Censorship breeds a culture of elitism and prejudice. Freely sharing information is the thing I value most highly on this site.

 

[Vic]

I do not know about running businesses. But that possibly strengthens my point about self censorship about sharing hacks.

I've not seen anything like this discussed previously and I think it's a good example of why there should be no censorship here. Censorship breeds a culture of elitism and prejudice. Freely sharing information is the thing I value most highly on this site.

read a random 3 pages in the double status credits promo thread and you'll see it discussed. there are been a few promo threads in my short time here where gift vouchers have been mentioned.

@Vic, did you just outline the very thing people here are wondering should not be shared?

The horse has bolted as best I can tell from discussion and this thread's existent.

 

[harvyk]

As others have said, AFF is hardly the only place which people go to share information. Just because a thread is censored on AFF doesn't mean that there is not 10 other places a person could go to get the information.

A lot of the good goss is shared at drinks and dinners and goes nowhere near the internet, or if it is published on the internet it's published to a small group.

Of course the other way to look at is it, as one loophole is closed, another is found. Yes, they closed off JASA's, but in it's place we've found (not telling )...

 

[get me outta here]

Ok, we'll drag that out of you at the next meet up.

Of course the other way to look at is it, as one loophole is closed, another is found. Yes, they closed off JASA's, but in it's place we've found (not telling )...

 

[JohnK]

AFF is a fantastic place but people need to remember that it is open and frequented by representatives of loyalty companies.

Here is one fact. There is less information available on AFF today as there are numerous cliques that have gone off line to keep the information to themselves and to a certain I agree with thst stance. Why bring out something in the open for people to abuse it and then no one benefits.

Remember marginal Any seat awards? That was done to death on the forums and the demise came not long after.

I've been using gift vouchers for a long time. The bonus points were nice but it also saved the credit card fees which were substantial previously but can still be quite high if you book enough flight. Now in the double SC thread there's at least 2 references to gift vouchers on every page. They do not need to be discussed in this detail. Read the first or second page of that thread and the answer is there. The answer was there in last years thread and the one before. Why do people need confirmation every single time?

In saying that though I don't think there should be any moderation. We have lost enough valuable information.