The COVID-19 vaccine rollout in Australia has begun

[mviy]

2 million Pfizer doses a week at the end of the year would be a significant scale up.

 

[jase05]

There needs to be a benefit for taking the risk, that you cant get for not taking the risk.

It’s called putting restrictions on people who don’t voluntarily take up the vaccine.
If you want to wait until the end of the year for another vaccine rather than AZ then that’s your choice but hopefully as a country we have means to leave those folk behind and get on with the rest of our lives. Start with fully vaccinated restaurants and hospitality venues followed by domestic travel and I’m sure folk will start falling into line

 

[drron]

Roll toll also has zero relevance to vaccine risk. The only relevant comparison is AZ vs Pfizer since these are the only two covid vaccines available in Australia right now.

Its not about zero risk, its about weighing up risk and choosing the lowest risk. Pfizer is the safer option over AZ.

AZ it is not recommended for under 50s here, yet you AZ fans think you know better and that those of us eligible for an mrna shouod ignore the medical advice and take AZ just because the feds over invested in it.

Number of covid deaths in Australia in women under 50 = 0, number of AZ deaths = 1. How many Australians have been hospitalised following AZ vs Pfizer?

Risk appetite varies between individuals.

If you are under 50 and weigh risk and decide to get AZ anyway by signing the waiver (and fact that you need to sign a waiver should raise questions) then that is your choice. But making that choice doesnt make you smarter or better, it makes you more of a risk taker wrt your health. Me, I'll take the better odds of Pfizer.

Not everyone just blindly takes medications.

There needs to be a benefit for taking the risk, that you cant get for not taking the risk.

You do realise that the one AZ death was one of the first 3 cases in Australia and the treatment regime wasn't fully developed then.Plus the woman had several serious co morbidities.
No healthy person in Australia has died from receiving the AZ vaccine.

 

[Lynda2475]

You were the one applauding that OVER 50s can wait and get an mRNA vaccine at the end - maybe next year? How slowing down our vaccination rate even further is helpful in moving the country forward I have no idea

The key word being CAN. The ones with concerns over AZ can now wait and get a vaccine, vs not getting one at all. These people have already made their mind they wont take AZ, so yes its great with an mrna vaccine option they will now get vaccinated albeit later. Later vaccination is better than none.

I never suggested we slow down the whole roll out nor that people who want to risk taking AZ shouldn't be allowed to. Just they shouldnt be try to guilt or force others to do the same.

one also could ask how many deaths in Australia have resulted from Covid 19 through being transmitted through women under 50 who was not vaccinated? Answer would be a lot more than one

Evidence? None of the community spread events have named someone in this demographic as being patient zero. Outside Vic (who were not properly tracing at start of wave 2 so no reliable data), there have only been a handful of deaths from community cases at all.

 

[Lynda2475]

It’s called putting restrictions on people who don’t voluntarily take up the vaccine

Hasnt happened and wont until international border opens because there isnt covid circulating in community.

If you want to wait until the end of the year for another vaccine rather than AZ then that’s your choice

Im eligible for Pfizer, i wont be waiting a second longer than i have to. Ive registered on the Pfizer stand by list and if i get the call will happily forgo a day of paid work to trek out to Olympic Park to get it (but hopefully with RPA and St Vincents opening to public i can go there instead). The only reason i'll have to wait til end of the year is if supply doent come through.

But i support friends over 50 who dont want to take AZ, im happy they now have a choice.

You do realise that the one AZ death was one of the first 3 cases in Australia and the treatment regime wasn't fully developed then.Plus the woman had several serious co morbidities.
No healthy person in Australia has died from receiving the AZ vaccine.

Id rather not risk getting a clot that has to be treated at all. Given im unlikely to die or need hospitalisation from covid in the extremely rare event i actually caught covid whilst i wait for an mrna vaccine.

If you want to see the vaccination program move faster, the govt needs to get more mrna vaccines to mass vac clinics near places where people work and open from 8am til 8pm, there wont be a shortage of under 50s lining up.

 

[jase05]

Hasnt happened and wont until international border opens because there isnt covid circulating in community.

Has absolutely been spoken about in Parliament in SA in regards to “Bubble restaurants and hospitality venues” and hopefully domestic travel joins the fray. I’d like to see the airlines be pro-active on the matter

 

[Batterytraveller]

Clearly I should have spoken to the receptionist at Jeff’s shed or just gone to Carlton. I’ll try again on Friday.

People under 50 asking for and getting AstraZeneca vaccine as older Australians hang back

Health department comfortable with younger people being vaccinated earlier than eligible if vaccines would otherwise be wasted

www.theguardian.com

 

[lovetravellingoz]

"One also could ask how many deaths in Australia have resulted from Covid 19 through being transmitted through women under 50 who was not vaccinated? Answer would be a lot more than one"

Evidence?

Note that we should not be confining deaths from Covid19 to just carriers who were under 50 and female. Point is that the more people of all ages and sexes who are vaccinated the safe everyone in the community is. The quicker this is achieved, the the quicker safety for all is improved.

A to whether women under 50 have been involved in the transmission chain that led to deaths from Covid 19 in Australia the answer is quite clearly yes for while our Health Authorities are in the main quite rightly protective of the privacy of cases, it is known that at least some were definitely via female workers.

Limiting it to females as is just skewing the data to try to improve an argument as the only vaccinated death in Australia was female. It really should be both male and female.

One might as well say that all men can get vaccinated with AZ as no men have died from an AZ vaccination in Australia.


The known cases in Australia have come through travellers and aircrew. The majority of whom would be under fifty. Probably none were vaccinated. Many of whom were female.

Secondly with a transmission chain people may be of various ages and sexes from whomever was patient zero and the unfortunate person who died.

And it is not just death it is all the people that become ill. Looking at death only is not a real measure of the health advantages to be gained from vaccination.

We also know from at least the aged care cases that in some of the facilities that the person who introduced the virus into the facility was female. A common known transmission path was via the staff, and a high proportion of staff in aged care are female. Though again looking at females only is pretty silly. More silly as you need to look at all the people in the transmission chain.

So while there is no official scorecard on the age and sex of people involved in each transmission chain that led to a death there clearly were women involved (and again it should be both sexes) in transmitting the virus.

ie

'Give them a chance': Families at centre of the second deadliest COVID-19 cluster demand answers

A nursing home in Western Sydney became the second-deadliest COVID-19 cluster in Australia. It accounts for almost fifth of all deaths from coronavirus nationally. Did authorities fail to protect our most vulnerable?

www.abc.net.au

How a Western Sydney nursing home became one of the country's biggest coronavirus clusters

It started with a "scratchy throat", but now almost every day at Newmarch House brings another death — here's what we know about the nursing home at the centre of a massive coronavirus outbreak.

www.abc.net.au

 

[Lynda2475]

Of course Im going to assess the risk of me catching covid (extremely unlikely given none circulating in my community, my job and ability to wfh if needed, my excellent adherance to physical distancing, use of QRs, mask wearing on PT and hand hygiene) and the subsequent even more miniscule chance of hospitalisation or death if i did get covid based on my cohort (and not older people, or those of a different gender).

Same for vaccine risk to personal health, it is assessed on my medical history and cohort - not irrelevant situations or demographics.

I fully supported vaccination of HQ, Airline and medical workers exposed directly to Covid arrivals being vaccinated first. I am against the politician, admin and sports people queue jumping.

I have never argued that there isnt a community benefit to everyone being vaccinated. My issues are with the over reliance on AZ (and undue pressure to take it when safer and better vaccines exist), roll out method using inefficient gp model whilst being very slow to move to sucessful mass vac centres, lack of transparency on timelines for jabs and conditions for opening borders.

The risk beneft swings in favour of AZ for an 86 yo man, it swings in favour of waiting for Pfizer for a 45 yo woman.

 

[trevella]

My issues are with the over reliance on AZ (and undue pressure to take it when safer and better vaccines exist)

The underlying assumption when making such comparisons is of course that you already know all the potential longer-term impacts of an entirely new technology. Which of course you don’t.

 

[Flying mermaid]

Moving on from the AZ scuffle, there appears to be hope for vaccination by Christmas. It will be interesting to see strategies to motivate people

 

[drron]

There certainly were cases of young women passing covid to people who eventually died.You forget the North west hospital cluster.Most of the staff infected were nurses and most of the nurses were women under 50.

Hospital cluster probe finds staff worked while sick, Ruby Princess source of outbreak

An investigation into a coronavirus cluster in north-west Tasmania finds some staff worked in local hospitals for several days while experiencing symptoms, but the Premier stresses no-one is to blame.

www.abc.net.au

 

[mviy]

Hmmmm. I may need to head into the city and see if they will vaccinate me after all: Matt isn't technically eligible for the vaccine, but he still got an AstraZeneca shot

 

[burmans]

2 million Pfizer doses a week at the end of the year would be a significant scale up.

Seems like a fantasy to me if we are struggling to consistently get 500k now

 

[mviy]

Seems like a fantasy to me if we are struggling to consistently get 500k now

As Pfizer ramps up production and as the US rollout finishes more supply should become available. Say we can't get it to 2 million a week then the Moderna supply ordered should be a big help getting enough doses to vaccinate anyone who wants to be.

 

[Flying mermaid]

Seems like a fantasy to me if we are struggling to consistently get 500k now

It’s actually been steadily increasing. Wasn’t that long ago it was 320,000 then we hit 400,000 and now 500,000. Next month is critical as the second AZ vaccinations start happening. If that gets Aus to 1 million per week and then the Pfizer supply increases significantly 2 million is a possibility but it’s going to need a major campaign/drive to achieve. Can’t see it happening without some carrot/stick strategy.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

Hmmmm. I may need to head into the city and see if they will vaccinate me after all: Matt isn't technically eligible for the vaccine, but he still got an AstraZeneca shot

Always good to read of people who understand that it is not just about them:

Mr Desailly said wanting to protect others in the community if the virus resurfaced played a huge part in his decision.​

 

[Lynda2475]

Which of course you don’t

But we do know the immediate ones.

AZ wont be part of the long term plan, the mrna vaccines will be.

 

[drron]

But we do know the immediate ones.

AZ wont be part of the long term plan, the mrna vaccines will be.

But no mRNA vaccines have ever been used long term in humans.Serious side effects don't necessarily turn up in the short term.It took 4-6 years for the Dengue vaccine to be stopped as it caused more deaths.

 

[louie-m]

Chatting to a mid-50s mate today. His doctor recommended he wait until Pfizer was available. Not because of any risk associated with AZ or any particular medical history, simply because Pfizer is "better". I'm glad to say that he's made an appointment at one of the mass vaccination centres for next week.

ETA: obviously for AZ