UK - in or out of the EU? Travel Issues?

[TonyHancock]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

Quite frankly the behaviour of many Remain voters is showing why Brexit won.

I don't disagree but suspect had the vote gone the other way we would see equally appalling behaviour from the Vote Leave side.

I'm watching the Scotland situation with much mirth. Those in the EU "courting" Scotland in an attempt to undermine the Brexit vote will be in for a bit of a shock if Scottish Independence goes through and they face another nation that will not be a net financial contributor to the EU.

It does not seem to have received a massive amount of coverage but The UK was second, behind Germany, in the net contributions table, so there will be a very large financial void to fill. Scotland will not be doing that any time soon. Nicola Sturgeon appears to be setting off on her very own Darien Scheme.

 

[JessicaTam]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

Medicare/bank discussion has been removed.

Now back to our regular programming...

 

[amaroo]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

[-]28[/-] 27 members - where only [-]10[/-] 9 are net contributors - what a Right royal pig's breakfast!

Net contributors to the budget? / EU Information Centre - Home

 

[marki]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

Similar behaviour was shown by those on the losing side in the Scottish Independence referendum.

Sour grapes happen no matter what. IMO the behaviour of a few does not reflect the thoughts or wishes of the vast majority of those on the losing side.

Of course it doesn't and of course the winning side is not entirely without faults.

As to the petition

’ Petition Uses ‘Script’ To ‘Fake’ Signatures: 25,000 From North Korea, 2,800 From Uninhabitable Antarctic

On B

 

[drron]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

Similar behaviour was shown by those on the losing side in the Scottish Independence referendum.

Sour grapes happen no matter what. IMO the behaviour of a few does not reflect the thoughts or wishes of the vast majority of those on the losing side.

But wasn't SNP the loosing side of both the Indepence and Brexit referenda.
And the unions and working class on the winning side both times?

But I do agree with your general sentiments.Unfortunately the more talk there is of respect the less there actually is.

 

[Princess Fiona]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

But wasn't SNP the loosing side of both the Indepence and Brexit referenda.
And the unions and working class on the winning side both times?

But I do agree with your general sentiments.Unfortunately the more talk there is of respect the less there actually is.

Yes they were but the many of those voting in favour of Scottish Independence and behaving badly afterwards have nothing whatsoever to do with the SNP either at the time or now.

Mob rules and lack of respect on either side I agree.

 

[whatmeworry]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

Meanwhile in the UK the 'Bregret' has just started.

The Mail on Sunday poll reported a new poll showing seven per cent of those who voted Leave, equal to more than one million people, already regret having done so.

They shared on social media the story of 'Adam from Manchester', who told the BBC he voted Leave but was now "shocked and worried" by the poll result.

And student Mandy Suthi told ITV she would "go back to the polling station and vote to stay" if she could, "simply because this morning the reality is kicking in".
Some had viewed the referendum as a protest vote against the government, and against politicians in general, while believing polls just before the vote that predicted a Remain win, it emerged.

Meanwhile, the BBC reported that HSBC was to move up to 1000 staff to Paris when the UK left the single market, adding to a growing list of firms rumoured to be eyeing a move to the continent.

Brexit aftermath spurs 'Bregret', political infighting

 

[JessicaTam]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

Meanwhile in the UK the 'Bregret' has just started.

Hopefully* it will teach people how important their vote is, so next time there is an election/referendum they will consider more carefully the repercussions.

And hopefully* it will encourage those who didn't vote to make the effort.

*I am not holding my breath.

 

[vetrade]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

Hopefully* it will teach people how important their vote is, so next time there is an election/referendum they will consider more carefully the repercussions.

But only if they voted "Leave", right Jessica? Because you can't get much more conclusive proof than quoting "Adam" and "Mandy" or a newspaper looking for something (anything!) to salvage some credibility after strongly advocating for the losing "Remain" side, can you?

Does "The standard you walk past is the standard you accept" apply equally to (il)logical thinking as well?​

 

[JessicaTam]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

Hopefully* it will teach people how important their vote is, so next time there is an election/referendum they will consider more carefully the repercussions.

But only if they voted "Leave", right Jessica? Because you can't get much more conclusive proof than quoting "Adam" and "Mandy" or a newspaper looking for something (anything!) to salvage some credibility after strongly advocating for the losing "Remain" side, can you?

Does "The standard you walk past is the standard you accept" apply equally to (il)logical thinking as well?​

I have absolutely no opinion on whether the UK should have voted to stay or leave, nor have I posted in this thread before today, so I am not sure why you conclude I am advocating a particular position.

My point was regarding people lamenting what they had voted for when they saw the result of that vote. Hence they should consider their choice more carefully next time they vote for whatever reason. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

[drron]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

Meanwhile in the UK the 'Bregret' has just started.







Brexit aftermath spurs 'Bregret', political infighting

Why did you leave this bit out-

Four per cent of Remain voters also regretted their decision.

So brexit would have still won.

 

[vetrade]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

My point was regarding people lamenting what they had voted for when they saw the result of that vote. Hence they should consider their choice more carefully next time they vote for whatever reason. Nothing more, nothing less.

You have misunderstood the point of my comments, Jessica. Whether you supported one side or the other is irrelevant to me.
I was alluding to the fact that you apparently accepted the veracity of assertions which were based on questionable information. That information was sourced from social media hearsay supposedly from just 2 people (out of 17.4M or so) and a self-serving "poll" by a biased newspaper trying to "wipe egg from its face". The paper's suggestion that a million "Leave" voters regretted their choice and would vote differently if given the chance again was implausible.

Using that implausible information you then proceeded to deliver a back-handed swipe at "Leave" voters by suggesting they should "consider more carefully the repercussions" of their choices in future, parroting the popular meme (assumption) that "Leave" voters were ill-informed or idiots.

It struck me that you were being disingenuous when you "walked past" the shortcomings of the post you commented on.

 

[RooFlyer]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

Hopefully* it will teach people how important their vote is, so next time there is an election/referendum they will consider more carefully the repercussions.

And hopefully* it will encourage those who didn't vote to make the effort.

*I am not holding my breath.

That's a good idea.

I saw a figure that the turn-out of under 25s was about 35%; not sure of the veracity, but I think its accepted that the turn out of 'young people', who demographically were pro 'Stay' was low. And who would you imagine are the biggest complainers after the "leave' decision?

 

[JessicaTam]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

You have misunderstood the point of my comments, Jessica. Whether you supported one side or the other is irrelevant to me.
I was alluding to the fact that you apparently accepted the veracity of assertions which were based on questionable information. That information was sourced from social media hearsay supposedly from just 2 people (out of 17.4M or so) and a self-serving "poll" by a biased newspaper trying to "wipe egg from its face". The paper's suggestion that a million "Leave" voters regretted their choice and would vote differently if given the chance again was implausible.

Using that implausible information you then proceeded to deliver a back-handed swipe at "Leave" voters by suggesting they should "consider more carefully the repercussions" of their choices in future, parroting the popular meme (assumption) that "Leave" voters were ill-informed or idiots.

It struck me that you were being disingenuous when you "walked past" the shortcomings of the post you commented on.

I quoted the sentence containing 'Bregret'. I did not quote newspaper poll results, or link to the article. I don't care how many people regret their choice, but some obviously do. And my comment is aimed at them.

So there was nothing to 'walk past'.

For the third time: Anyone who regrets what they have voted for, due to not considering the repercussions, hopefully will put more thought into their vote next time. It is as simple as that.

I am not sure how I can be any clearer.

 

[wandering_fred]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

...
For the third time: Anyone who regrets what they have voted for, due to not considering the repercussions, hopefully will put more thought into their vote next time. It is as simple as that.
...

If the UK is the same as the USA and Australia in the teaching of civics and government over the last 40 years, I can truly understand how the electorate has no clue as to the effect their vote on issues similar to Brexit might have.

On the other hand, the willingness of bureaucrats (especially un-elected ones) to make rules which a large part of the electorate see as un-productive (at best) or alienating has led to an emotional reaction. Two hundred years ago a civil war might have resulted. Perhaps that can be considered progress.

(while you can) happy wandering

Fred

 

[vetrade]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

The inference of the “Bregret” post was that it was only the Leave voters (and a substantial number of them) who regretted their choice. Clearly the “consider the repercussions in future” comment was directed at them. It is obfuscating to subsequently massage that into a generic comment about voters on both sides.

Don’t bother repeating yourself for a fourth time because it seems we will have to agree to disagree lest the conversation becomes boorish.

 

[dajop]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

On the other hand, the willingness of bureaucrats (especially un-elected ones) to make rules which a large part of the electorate see as un-productive (at best) or alienating

I sometimes don't think the unelected ones are always the problem. I work in an industry that has it's fair share of regulations, but the EU takes that a whole different level. Whilst in Australia, Canada, the US, Japan and the like, the "un-elected bureaucrats" largely get on and do their job, following laid out laws/regulations and generally apply scientific principles in their application of said regulations (in a way that provides certainty to businesses), in the EU the recommendations (and application of the law) by the bureaucrats are often ignored or over ridden by the European Commission due to political pressure.

I'd suggest, not unlike in Australia, it's not the bureaucrats that are the problem per se, but the whims of their political masters .....

 

[Warks]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

Is there any thinking that if the EU remained more the EEC the UK wouldn't have as much of an issue with it? That is, a trading bloc, rather than another level of government.

 

[TonyHancock]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

Is there any thinking that if the EU remained more the EEC the UK wouldn't have as much of an issue with it? That is, a trading bloc, rather than another level of government.

I think that is exactly what people in the UK have wanted for decades.

 

[PLANT]

Re: UK - in or out of the EU?

I'd this GOT coming to real life?