US Dividend Miles Buy/Gift Miles 100% bonus - Cheap way for F/J *A Awards

[smit0847]

I've found a availability on awardtravelr for MEL-BKK(TG)-FRA(TG A380)-OSL(LH)-KEF(SK) in July next year.

KEF is an EXTREMELY difficult destination to get to on *A because there are so few flights into KEF. We need to make a 10am flight from OSL which means very, very tight connection times in FRA (75 mins, coming off an A380) and OSL (45 mins).

I have no doubt the USDM call centre agent will not be able to find this itinerary on their own because it is so complicated and I will have to walk them through, flight by flight. However will this breach any min connection times?

Can I check my baggage all the way through from MEL to KEF or will I have to collect and re-check anywhere? I doubt I will make the connections in FRA and OSL if I have to re-check my baggage there.

There's only 1 SK flight per day from OSL to KEF so if we miss it, we're screwed lol (did I mention KEF is a really hard place to get to?!). We are happy to spend a night in OSL if we miss it but if we hold boarding passes for that flight (say, issued in FRA) and we miss it because the LH flight is late, will we be moved onto the next days flight or will we have to call USDM and go through that nightmare?

Our other option is to simply book MEL-BKK-FRA and buy a rev ticket FRA-KEF (there are some direct flights) but this is looking like a pretty expensive options when we can essentially get there for no more cost is tacking the FRA-OSL-KEF legs onto our booking.

 

[casanovawa]

I would have thought there were multiple options of flights to get from FRA to OSL (LH, SK, etc), could you just give yourself a longer transit in FRA before catching your flight up to OSL and then stay over night and make sure the flight the next morning to KEF is within the 24 hour transit window from when you arrived into OSL from FRA??

 

[aikman]

I've researched this route in the past and found that that morning FRA-OSL flight has a poor on time record. LH has flights to KEF from TXL, HAM, DUS as well as seasonal flights on SK from ARN and OS from VIE.

 

[Shanye2233]

I think its about time to let the cat out of the bag .Anyone who wants to help great anyone that wants to clap and smile go ahead.
I went ahead with a flight for a friend syd-jnb I used my points I paid with my credit card. He transferred the money into my PayPal account. One month later my wife wakes me up says she just received a Emial from [email protected] saying her account is closed. Along with my account , 2 daughters accounts , mother sisters and brother account. After I just finished doing the rounds with the sharing promo. A little over 800k gone and friends flight cancelled . The email is

Please note the following:

Mr, Mrs., Ms, Ms , Mr ........

Award tickets may not be brokered, bartered, sold or altered in any
way. Any person selling, purchasing or bartering Dividend Miles award
tickets or mileage credit may be liable for payment of full fare,
damages, litigation and transaction costs. All such items are void
and will be confiscated. If travel is in progress any continued
travel will be at the passengers expense on a full fare basis.

US Airways reserves the right to request information on any award
ticket that in the sole judgment of US Airways may be in violation of
any rules governing the Dividend Miles program.

All Dividend Miles accounts listed above have been closed and all miles confiscated.

It is the responsibility of each member to understand all Dividend
Miles terms and conditions. As a member of our Dividend Miles program,
you agreed to the terms set forth.

If you have questions about Dividend Miles program rules or the
actions taken with regard to your account, please email us at
[email protected].


Best regards,

US Airways Dividend Miles Audit

 

[Shanye2233]

So I rang and it was a weekend and was told however this wasn't a hoax and all accounts have been cancelled. And all flights I paid for cancelled. I lost 820,000 miles and I had to re-pay a friend . So I sent a email and waited for a response. Here is there reply.
We have reviewed your request and appreciate this opportunity to address them.

We are confident with our findings during our investigation and are steadfast with our decision in closing all accounts involved.

It is the responsibility of each member to understand all Dividend Miles terms and conditions. As a member of our Dividend Miles program, you agreed to the terms set forth.

Dividend Miles and award tickets have no cash value. Award tickets may not be sold, purchased, bartered, exchanged or brokered. Violation of this provision can and will result in program disqualification and could result in civil or criminal litigation.

We apologize that your request was not resolved to your satisfaction, however, the matter was given every consideration and we are unable to provide the resolution requested.

 

[ferni]

Were they correct in closing your account?
Was your 'friend' really a friend?
How much did he paypal you?
Why didn't you just get him to open his own account?
What other transactions on your US accounts have happened that made it look suspicious?

 

[travelislife]

That's disappointing Shanye. It does make me worried though especially because the agent who just did my bookings accidentally took the miles out of the wrong accounts so the names don't line up with the passengers when they should as they were booked with their accounts!

I haven't done anything like rack up 800,000 miles
though all on the one card.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

shanyee - sorry to hear what has happened.

First of all - (let's get this out of the way) - you KNEW this had a very good chance of happening. Everyone has been warned and others (myself included) have spoken about it on various forums and have mentioned the possibility that your accounts could get audited. Buying tickets for other passengers (different surnames to those on the account) is risky. You know from reading the rules that miles can't be traded, and the presumption is that no one simply gives away a valuable ticket for no money in return. In your case, you clearly breached the rules by selling your ticket for someone else.

Now - what to do?

From what i understand it is almost impossible to actually speak to someone in the fraud department at most airlines. They don't really want to talk to passengers. But my first avenue would be to call and try and speak to someone. If that doesn't work, then you will have ONE chance to write a very carefully scripted letter explaining your actions, and asking for reinstatement.

That letter will probably need to go to one of their heads of customer service or something. But it will need to be a good letter - apologising for your error, and explaining it will never happen again, and asking for leniency.

The letter should also explain that the other accounts in the household had nothing to do with your actions and should be excused from the closure.

If that doesn't work, then I'm afraid you may need to seek legal advice - but that will have to be in the USA. And the hard part will be finding a lawyer willing to take on your case. And it will cost you.

There is an argument that the total closure of all your accounts, without you having the opportunity to fully explain your actions may be a breach of contract and an unfair penalty - especially to those other accounts who were not involved. (Basically - you would need to argue that one breach (if it was in fact only one breach) should not lead to such a harsh outcome).

If you want to keep your costs to a minimum (no lawyers) you need to take a complete apologetic approach to this. Hopefully you will get lucky.

 

[hummel]

820,000 miles is a lot to loose! How many of those were bought and how many were shared?

Perhaps your account has been 'on watch' by USDM since when you took your first trip and you paid substantially less miles than you should have? 45k miles or something like that...?

 

[MEL_Traveller]

That's disappointing Shanye. It does make me worried though especially because the agent who just did my bookings accidentally took the miles out of the wrong accounts so the names don't line up with the passengers when they should as they were booked with their accounts!

I haven't done anything like rack up 800,000 miles
though all on the one card.

I wouldn't worry about the miles coming from the wrong account. An 'audit' would show that up and you'll be fine

 

[markis10]

So I rang and it was a weekend and was told however this wasn't a hoax and all accounts have been cancelled. And all flights I paid for cancelled. I lost 820,000 miles and I had to re-pay a friend . So I sent a email and waited for a response. Here is there reply.
We have reviewed your request and appreciate this opportunity to address them.

We are confident with our findings during our investigation and are steadfast with our decision in closing all accounts involved.

It is the responsibility of each member to understand all Dividend Miles terms and conditions. As a member of our Dividend Miles program, you agreed to the terms set forth.

Dividend Miles and award tickets have no cash value. Award tickets may not be sold, purchased, bartered, exchanged or brokered. Violation of this provision can and will result in program disqualification and could result in civil or criminal litigation.

We apologize that your request was not resolved to your satisfaction, however, the matter was given every consideration and we are unable to provide the resolution requested.

Thats not good to hear Shanye2233, I suppose you are not aware that Ebay and Paypal are the same company and are actively sharing data with award program operators on sales that are not permitted, there is a similar story over at FT on the IC forum about someone who just put a reward night up for sale and had his account closed. Given your recent issues with the IC Sydney, BRG etc etc, along with previous redemption issues with DM you are having a tough time as you seem to cross the boundaries set by terms and conditions.

 

[travelislife]

I wouldn't worry about the miles coming from the wrong account. An 'audit' would show that up and you'll be fine

Thanks for the word of confidence! I guess the thing about all this is tht they don't make contact first and ask you to explain rather just cancel everything, luckily your friend wasn't already in JNB needing to buy a new ticket home.

I think the advise MEL_traveller has given up thread is as good as it can get. I noticed you havent posted this on flyertalk as of yet. Would be interesting to see the reaction there.

The problem is Shanye you have stated that, YES, you did break their terms and conditions. But I aagree with MEL_traveller that cancelling all the accounts is unjust punishment.

 

[bcworld]

you seem to cross the boundaries set by terms and conditions.

I think this is an important point. Deals like those that Dividend Miles and LifeMiles offer us are already in the 'too good to be true' basket when used in the spirit which the airline intends them. I've been following USDM for 3 years now...and there, and since LifeMiles came along, the 'trick it' mentality seems to be taking over! Much of what goes on is probably strictly within the T&Cs of ill thought out promos, whether it be buying and sharing miles repeatedly between legit and/or dubious accounts, buying dozens of products you don't want with promo miles offers, throwaway cities etc etc etc (the latter probably does breach T&Cs). But even if they are within the T&Cs I would always suspect that such accounts are on watch...and dmaudit are waiting for the activity that allows them to pull the trigger...in this case a clear cut breach of the T&Cs (although I'm still doubtful that USDM would be passed evidence from a 3rd party that monies had changed hands). I'm sure there are many people that have booked flights for pax who cannot clearly be identified as family members - I know I have - and haven't fallen foul of dmaudit, who we know suspend accounts first then ask questions later. Don't attract attention to your account and you will probably have no issues continuing to benefit from this great offer - in short, a lot of people need to stop pushing the boundaries.

 

[smit0847]

I think this is an important point. Deals like those that Dividend Miles and LifeMiles offer us are already in the 'too good to be true' basket when used in the spirit which the airline intends them. I've been following USDM for 3 years now...and there, and since LifeMiles came along, the 'trick it' mentality seems to be taking over! Much of what goes on is probably strictly within the T&Cs of ill thought out promos, whether it be buying and sharing miles repeatedly between legit and/or dubious accounts, buying dozens of products you don't want with promo miles offers, throwaway cities etc etc etc (the latter probably does breach T&Cs). But even if they are within the T&Cs I would always suspect that such accounts are on watch...and dmaudit are waiting for the activity that allows them to pull the trigger...in this case a clear cut breach of the T&Cs (although I'm still doubtful that USDM would be passed evidence from a 3rd party that monies had changed hands). I'm sure there are many people that have booked flights for pax who cannot clearly be identified as family members - I know I have - and haven't fallen foul of dmaudit, who we know suspend accounts first then ask questions later. Don't attract attention to your account and you will probably have no issues continuing to benefit from this great offer - in short, a lot of people need to stop pushing the boundaries.

Yo BC - your inbox is full.

 

[Alanslegal]

The problem is Shanye you have stated that, YES, you did break their terms and conditions. But I aagree with MEL_traveller that cancelling all the accounts is unjust punishment.

Until we know the full transactions/relationships between those closed accounts, it may not be unjust at all. There will be a points trail that goes from A to B and so on, there were miles shared/gifted/bought from an account to another to another, and then there is the 'smoking gun' where a ticket is redeemed for a friend for money consideration. Given all these elements it may be fair and well that all accounts involved in activity/ies which breached the rules be terminated and points forfeited. US Airways would not have taken this action lightly but for their investigation which revealed damning transactions. Mel_Traveller does provide sensible steps which Shayne may consider to pursue but my opinion, 2cents worth, thinks its unlikely to bear fruit. I think the original decision wasn't taken lightly and I doubt US would overturn their own 'steadfast' decision.

 

[Aussie_flyer]

oh dear, what a pity. And on the same week your 500 lifemiles 10 cent shop purchases were canceled too, this is a bad week eh

 

[bcworld]

oh dear, what a pity. And on the same week your 500 lifemiles 10 cent shop purchases were canceled too, this is a bad week eh

Sigh, I should've known when I said 'dozens' of purchases I wasn't going far enough.

125,000 LifeMiles for $50? Hello, fair use policy anyone!! A clear example of when the games & tricks go too far...lmaudit might be watching closely now too!

 

[anat0l]

Until we know the full transactions/relationships between those closed accounts, it may not be unjust at all. There will be a points trail that goes from A to B and so on, there were miles shared/gifted/bought from an account to another to another, and then there is the 'smoking gun' where a ticket is redeemed for a friend for money consideration. Given all these elements it may be fair and well that all accounts involved in activity/ies which breached the rules be terminated and points forfeited. US Airways would not have taken this action lightly but for their investigation which revealed damning transactions. Mel_Traveller does provide sensible steps which Shayne may consider to pursue but my opinion, 2cents worth, thinks its unlikely to bear fruit. I think the original decision wasn't taken lightly and I doubt US would overturn their own 'steadfast' decision.

If it is a real breach of the rules then you can't argue against that. As for the penalty being disproportionate, well this is no legal thing (unless we drive down the path that points earned by someone represent some sort of contract) and since it is within the scheme that is US DM they are probably in full entitlement to do whatever they like. Keep in mind perhaps it "speaks" louder than most cases because of the amount of points being forfeited in this case (and bookings for that matter, though I find it hard to believe how bookings can be cancelled so easily as they are already written tickets with ticket numbers; by this time that's a stronger contract than points alone....).

One of the ups and downs of flirting on the edge of the system.

 

[serfty]

Were they correct in closing your account?
...
How much did he paypal you? ...

This is the crux - if it really was a friend and the Paypal amount covered the Taxes/levies/surcharges ONLY¹ then really no foul was committed.

¹ Although I doubt it ... they would not necessarily be that much

 

[MEL_Traveller]

If it is a real breach of the rules then you can't argue against that. As for the penalty being disproportionate, well this is no legal thing (unless we drive down the path that points earned by someone represent some sort of contract) and since it is within the scheme that is US DM they are probably in full entitlement to do whatever they like. Keep in mind perhaps it "speaks" louder than most cases because of the amount of points being forfeited in this case (and bookings for that matter, though I find it hard to believe how bookings can be cancelled so easily as they are already written tickets with ticket numbers; by this time that's a stronger contract than points alone....).

One of the ups and downs of flirting on the edge of the system.

there are all sort of protections in contract and consumer law that might step in to protect someone in the event they have breached a contract. If (and this is the nig question) none of the other accounts were involved then they shouldn't be penalised. You must also be given due 'legal' process (that is, the right to be able to explain your actions). Of course if USDM doesn't do this, then you might have to resort to taking the matter to court (which would be very hard based here in AU).

But for their part, I guess USDM audit saw multiple accounts, same address, and probably the same credit card number being used for multiple transactions, and decided to investigate. having tickets which weren't paid for at the correct number of miles probably didn't help.

As for the point about the ticket and the contract. Even if a ticket is issued, if there is suspected fraud, or the ticket hasn't been paid for correctly, the ticket can be invalidated. No questions, no notification. The contract basically never existed in that case (and it would be for the ticket holder to argue that they had a valid ticket, not obtained in breach of any conditions).

While a ticket is 'evidence' of a contract, it is not in itself the sole decider. you also need to have, for example, a valid PNR, and must meet a host of other obligations under the conditions of carriage. (As for the much broader issue of whether or not a ticket is actually a contract - that's a whole separate can of worms. But you could look to the most recent High Court decision in relation to GST... what does the passenger have? They have 'an undertaking, on best endeavours, to supply air travel at a future date, subject to operational issues that may arise' (or words to that effect). bidning contract? You could drive a truck through it!)

(Anyway - I know it's not much consolation - but you did get 400K Thai ROP points as compensation for your earlier USDM trip - so that's about half of what you lost)