Virgin Australia Financially Secure? [Now in Voluntary Administration]

[kpc]

Whilst a boom of domestic tourism is something to hope for, I suspect a few attitudes might have to change. I've obviously travelled a lot, and fairly large parts of Australia, that are otherwise quite tourism dependent, seem to have a basic attitude of "leave your wallet, but otherwise piss off".

I find the cost of domestic tourism in Australia, including NZ, very high....from accommodation to activities to restaurants etc. In Dec last year, we spent NZ$1880 for the 4 of us sharing a quad room overnight on a boat cruising Doubtful Sound. I get much better value going to SE Asia where the service standards esp in hotels are very high.

 

[TheInsider]

VA in another trading halt:

https://www.asx.com.au/asxpdf/20200414/pdf/44gxk8qjtq4344.pdf

Can anyone decipher this at all?!

 

[bigbadbyrnes]

Can anyone decipher this at all?!

the key line is "consider the issues... with respect to financial assistance and restructuring alternatives which are ongoing".

The wording encapsulates all possibilities - including help from the business owners, from any commercial source of finance and the government.

It appears the reporting on VA looking at a full debt restructure have been accurate - IE, they're in negotiations with a credit provider to provide cash and assurances to help them comply with their debt obligations and help them ensure they have a going concern (a viable business going forward), and do not become insolvent (be in a position where they can't pay their debts).

For this to be attractive to the credit provider, this will need to have significant benefits to be worth the risk they would be taking on. It will need to be 'commercial', that is, worth the credit providers time, effort, resources and provide a return on investment.

 

[glasszon]

I think it's a brilliant move by VA, similar to what QF did when they grounded all planes way back when QF was dealing with labor issues.

The biggest physical assets VA has are planes, right now is literally the worst time to sell planes as everyone is grounded.

So VA is effectively daring the govt and creditors to force VA into bankruptcy, as there will be immense damage to the tourism industry if VA goes broke and only QF emerges from covid-19, and good luck on creditors for getting the money back as I don't think you can get any reasonable price in selling VA planes in this environment.

 

[milehighclub]

Can anyone decipher this at all?!

This was on news.com.au an hour ago. Could be related to this.

"Qantas and Virgin are closing in on a multi-million dollar deal with the federal government to support flights between capital cities."

Coronavirus Australia live updates

Ten people have been infected with COVID-19 at an aged care home in Sydney, after one of its nurses tested positive.

www.news.com.au

 

[hydrabyss]

I think it's a brilliant move by VA, similar to what QF did when they grounded all planes way back when QF was dealing with labor issues.

The biggest physical assets VA has are planes, right now is literally the worst time to sell planes as everyone is grounded.

So VA is effectively daring the govt and creditors to force VA into bankruptcy, as there will be immense damage to the tourism industry if VA goes broke and only QF emerges from covid-19, and good luck on creditors for getting the money back as I don't think you can get any reasonable price in selling VA planes in this environment.

I feel Qantas is making things easier for Virgin with all the bad publicity going around regarding staff issues as well.

 

[Inlander]

VA just went into a trading halt: Virgin Australia goes into trading halt

 

[mickfrombris]

Virgin Australia announces trading halt. For those who missed the boat to transfer points to Krisflyer…..should you spend remaining points now in the online store or wait for a bailout miracle ?

 

[jakeseven7]

I think it's a brilliant move by VA, similar to what QF did when they grounded all planes way back when QF was dealing with labor issues.

The biggest physical assets VA has are planes, right now is literally the worst time to sell planes as everyone is grounded.

So VA is effectively daring the govt and creditors to force VA into bankruptcy, as there will be immense damage to the tourism industry if VA goes broke and only QF emerges from covid-19, and good luck on creditors for getting the money back as I don't think you can get any reasonable price in selling VA planes in this environment.

In the other thread on VA, there was a good point by another member @dajop

If travel is soft for a while, there may not be 'immense damage' because of VA ceasing to exist, the damage will be simply the lack of demand for travel.

In this scenario it may not make financial sense to prop VA up and when the market is ready for it, force QF to divest JQ.

Or - as another few posters have mentioned, compel QF to operate a skeleton VA for a while then sell it off when the market picks up again.

 

[clarkkent]

Also an email from Velocity this morning:

In these uncertain times, we understand you may have concerns about frequent flyer programs. That’s why we thought it was important to share with you that Velocity is set up in a way that safeguards member value by having a trustee that looks after the interests of members.

Not sure what that means in practice.

 

[glasszon]

Virgin Australia announces trading halt. For those who missed the boat to transfer points to Krisflyer….. spend remaining points now in online store or wait for a bailout miracle ?

I don't think there's any choice now, my friend has redeemed points for gift cards over a week ago and still haven't received any gift cards yet. Given the situation you might as well hang on and hope for the best.

 

[Bct]

Not sure what that means in practice

Yep, and why wasn't this shared a month or so ago.

 

[kyle]

I don't think there's any choice now, my friend has redeemed points for gift cards over a week ago and still haven't received any gift cards yet. Given the situation you might as well hang on and hope for the best.

Just wait. There's a delay at the store end and a delay at the Australia Post end. Total of about 2 weeks between ordering and receipt of gift cards.

 

[jase05]

Just wait. There's a delay at the store end and a delay at the Australia Post end. Total of about 2 weeks between ordering and receipt of gift cards.

Allow a little bit longer AP have a massive backlog of freight currently

 

[Must...Fly!]

Also an email from Velocity this morning:

Not sure what that means in practice.

I think they're just trying to underline the fact that Velocity while now owned by VA is a separate division which holds value irrespective of the airline situation

 

[Plutonus]

Also an email from Velocity this morning:

Not sure what that means in practice.

Would need to read the trust deed to understand the structure. Presumably VAH has a beneficial interest in the trust, as the profits from Velocity operations go to VAH. What this means in event of liquidation really depends on that deed.

Normally a liquidator couldn't just access the assets of a trust on the basis that the company was a beneficiary of that trust.

However, if the beneficial interest conveyed powers on VAH to, for example, enable them to force the trust to sell assets, then a liquidator would be able to exercise that power.

 

[coyote25]

No idea what this means or what Virgin Australia are doing to restructure debt but obviously significant enough to halt share trading. Hopefully good news to protect their business.

ABC News Virgin Goes Into A Trading Halt

 

[woodborer]

My understanding is that points in Velocity are held in a trust fund.

Yep, and why wasn't this shared a month or so ago.

It was mentioned. On this very thread.

 

[wxxnxs]

I don't think there's any choice now, my friend has redeemed points for gift cards over a week ago and still haven't received any gift cards yet. Given the situation you might as well hang on and hope for the best.

Same here, I burnt $50K+points redeemed a pair of airpod, but haven't received any sign of getting it. The email says the item is sent by Harvey Norman, but I doubt velocity is going to pay any money to HN in this circumstance. But I have to say, using points to redeem a physical good does provide a very poor value, still better than nothing.

 

[jakeseven7]

Also an email from Velocity this morning:

Not sure what that means in practice.

It was such a waste of an email, told people precisely nothing and was disingenuous to those who are trapped in the Velocity program because they shut down the option to transfer to KrisFlyer and have removed a lot of items from the store and have placed limits on some items.

Its clearly an email attempt to stop people redeeming points - but I think the reverse will probably happen now, people will be even more worried.