Virgin Australia Fleet Update Thread.

[Ansettaddict123]

I would hope any international expansion would be via the far superior Boeing 777, to fit with the rest of the international fleet.

Far superior?
For LAX/ AUH, yes. For Asian services? no

The 773ER is far too big for the Asian market and will be decimated by the frequency advantage and economic superiority of the A330 series over those ranges.
The smaller 777s I don't think anyone would touch with a barge pole on short (by comparison to the routes they were designed for) sectors, take SQ swapping 772ER for A333 equipment to secondary Australian cities (PER/ BNE/ADL)- purely because of economics.

 

[Justchecking]

So when will the interior refits be completed and painting of the outside begin?

 

[markis10]

Far superior?
For LAX/ AUH, yes. For Asian services? no

The 773ER is far too big for the Asian market and will be decimated by the frequency advantage and economic superiority of the A330 series over those ranges.
The smaller 777s I don't think anyone would touch with a barge pole on short (by comparison to the routes they were designed for) sectors, take SQ swapping 772ER for A333 equipment to secondary Australian cities (PER/ BNE/ADL)- purely because of economics.

Thats why Scoot is going to be running an all 772 fleet, purely because of economics, and yes SIN-Australia is very much a target market for them. And your right (not), the 773ER is too big for the Asian market, thats why SQ and CX just ordered more with CX intending to use theirs HKG-BNE!

 

[Justchecking]

Thats why Scoot is going to be running an all 772 fleet, purely because of economics, and yes SIN-Australia is very much a target market for them!

Actually, I thought the main reason for this airline to be 777 is because the majority of their planned routes will need the range and they are wanting the economics of a single aircraft type airline model. Makes sense from that point of view to sacrifice economics on one route to gain larger economics elsewhere. Unfortunately the same is not true for DJ, who already have 4 aircraft types and who will probably benefit from running the smallest aircraft type into their startup markets when they might not be able to sell all seats.

CX and the like have mature markets into and out of AUS fully supported by a well subscribed FF program. A 777 may indeed be the right aircraft type for them.

 

[777]

I thought the reason "Scoot" or whatever it will be called is getting 777's is that SQ is giving them their old ones.

 

[markis10]

I thought the reason "Scoot" or whatever it will be called is getting 777's is that SQ is giving them their old ones.

4 of the current ones are being used at startup I believe, note these are not the LR versions, India and China are the two initial targets as far as routes go. I could see a 777 replacing the VS A340 quite nicely into HKG!

 

[MarkD]

Excuse my Ignorance, but what is "SCOOT"

 

[Justchecking]

4 of the current ones are being used at startup I believe, note these are not the LR versions, India and China are the two initial targets as far as routes go. I could see a 777 replacing the VS A340 quite nicely into HKG!

"The new airline, a critical part of SIA's strategy to deal with intensifying competition from rival carriers, is expected to fit each of its B-777 with about 400 seats." Flight Global 3 days ago.

Given that it's using the 777-200s for the startup I bags not being on it when it's configured for 400 pax!
No legroom anyone?

 

[oz_mark]

"The new airline, a critical part of SIA's strategy to deal with intensifying competition from rival carriers, is expected to fit each of its B-777 with about 400 seats." Flight Global 3 days ago.

Given that it's using the 777-200s for the startup I bags not being on it when it's configured for 400 pax!
No legroom anyone?

A lot of it will be by using 10 abreast seating.

(And as for the A330 vs 777 - I have never really understood why PAX think the 777 is so great. It's just another plane for me.)

For regional flights, the A330 is more than adequate, and lots of airlines use them around Asia. Seems a reasonable choice for VA on Asian flights.

 

[777]

(And as for the A330 vs 777 - I have never really understood why PAX think the 777 is so great. It's just another plane for me.)

Obviously, i'm a bit partial to the 777

For regional flights, the A330 is more than adequate, and lots of airlines use them around Asia. Seems a reasonable choice for VA on Asian flights.

But yes, i think the a330 is good fit for VA's medium haul Aus-Asia flying.

 

[Justchecking]

A lot of it will be by using 10 abreast seating.

.

That's a lot of middle seats and not much elbow room. They say fares should be 20-30% lower than full service. I'm not sure saving $200 is enough to justify being crammed between to people who are likely to be wider than the toothpick width seats for 7hrs. Pass!

 

[Noob]

That's a lot of middle seats and not much elbow room. They say fares should be 20-30% lower than full service. I'm not sure saving $200 is enough to justify being crammed between to people who are likely to be wider than the toothpick width seats for 7hrs. Pass!

LCC don't target frequent flyers, they target the average Joe who wants ultra cheap fares with all the frills (and will complain when they are not included!)

 

[Ansettaddict123]

Thats why Scoot is going to be running an all 772 fleet, purely because of economics, and yes SIN-Australia is very much a target market for them. And your right (not), the 773ER is too big for the Asian market, thats why SQ and CX just ordered more with CX intending to use theirs HKG-BNE!

As has been mentioned, the airline will be run with hand me down 772s from SIA. If the economics are so great as you say they are, then why did SQ replace them with A333 (as the interim for the delayed A350) into secondary Australian cities when they're effectively the same sized aircraft?! (SYD/ MEL don't count as they actually need the larger 77W or A380)
The thing is, they can afford to target the market with the aircraft because they can cram in 10 abreast and thus so many seats. Good luck getting that many bums in seats with the size and payload restrictions of the A333!

I would love to see VA 77W flying all around Asia, but the truth of the matter is that for the relatively new carrier they are (albeit the fact they harness the Virgin brand power) they are relatively unknown. Who cares what SQ/ CX are up to, they're flying in mature markets (of which the capacity is needed because SIN/ HKG are mainly hub ports) with a very well established brand which Virgin will not have for many, many years. Further to that point, when Virgin do start flying into Asia, my guess is it will be primarily to/ from secondary ports- so for the short term at least I think it's A333/A332 all the way.

Disclaimer: I'm in no way disputing the utter awesome of the 777 series, It's just the efficiency isn't there over medium haul routes (ie: AUS- Asia). It was built as a long haul aircraft, which is why long haul, there's nothing in the same size category which can beat it *waits for A350*

 

[markis10]

As has been mentioned, the airline will be run with hand me down 772s from SIA. If the economics are so great as you say they are, then why did SQ replace them with A333 (as the interim for the delayed A350) into secondary Australian cities when they're effectively the same sized aircraft?! (SYD/ MEL don't count as they actually need the larger 77W or A380)
The thing is, they can afford to target the market with the aircraft because they can cram in 10 abreast and thus so many seats. Good luck getting that many bums in seats with the size and payload restrictions of the A333!

I would love to see VA 77W flying all around Asia, but the truth of the matter is that for the relatively new carrier they are (albeit the fact they harness the Virgin brand power) they are relatively unknown. Who cares what SQ/ CX are up to, they're flying in mature markets (of which the capacity is needed because SIN/ HKG are mainly hub ports) with a very well established brand which Virgin will not have for many, many years. Further to that point, when Virgin do start flying into Asia, my guess is it will be primarily to/ from secondary ports- so for the short term at least I think it's A333/A332 all the way.

Disclaimer: I'm in no way disputing the utter awesome of the 777 series, It's just the efficiency isn't there over medium haul routes (ie: AUS- Asia). It was built as a long haul aircraft, which is why long haul, there's nothing in the same size category which can beat it *waits for A350*

SQ replaced the 777s in the Australian market purely because they no longer suit their image (they still send them to NZ), nothing to do with economics, this was actually stated by their President who said that they no longer met their fleet age policy on premium routes. As I pointed out, on the AUS-Asia routes they work for many already including EK, BR, CX, CZ, OZ, BA, JL, MH, EY, QR, KE, TH and NZ with new orders coming from many of them as well this year.

 

[dandandan]

new interiors are great though

 

[Noob]

Found something interesting about Virgin Australia's A330-200 plans:

"This is always a question of when, not if, with the current announced count at 6 and plans for expansion to approximately 16 frames (A330s)"

Wings Down Under: IFEC Archives

 

[Justchecking]

I've seen and heard that before. But given the current backlog of A330 orders I don't think it's going to happen excitingly fast, we already know it will be 2013 before they get 6. I'm not too interested in what 'might' happen 3 years from now. Three years is a long time in aviation and plans change. DJ might have a change of leadership in that time, the aviation market could boom or bust, etc....

 

[Virgin Australia]

Our newest bird VH-VFH (Mindil Beach) arrived last weekend, and with her final checks happening now, will be in service early next week. We were sent some great pics of her emerging from the Boeing hanger!

 

[pshepvic]

Ok I might have missed something here, but I'm confused!

Just boarded VH-VOT SYD-MEL and it's refitted ... but only rows 1-3 (luckily I'm in 3A, first time in ages I haven't been in PE).

Are they only refitting the first 3 rows now to churn through the aircraft quicker to have the fleet done by the end of the year? I could have sworn the last refitted aircraft I was on had the whole plane done and not just 3 rows...

Are there plans to put these aircraft back into have the rest of the seats replaced? They would have still needed to change all the row numbers, even without replacing the seats. Looks a bit weird with nice new seats in row 3, but the old ones from row 4 onwards, not to mention the fact that the new seats are much more comfy.

On a good note I was in row 4 online but was moved to 3 at the airport.


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[pshepvic]

And in other fleet news, I spotted this baby in DPS on Monday night - didn't realise that they were flying them on Pacific Blue routes yet.




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