Virgin Blue achieves record 93.8% on time performance in Oct.

[Yada Yada]

And I don't get why DJ thinks they have great service when you have to pay for every little thing.

All the little things you get on Qantas are insignificant by themselves, but they all add up to give a better experience, especially on a long flight.

• Complimentary meals, though I agree that the quality on DJ is generally better.
• Movie, to help pass the time (if it's good) or to help fall asleep (if it's bad).
• Drinks - alcoholic or otherwise. Messing around with coinage and receipts for a drink of water is annoying.

• 
  I flew MEL-SYD yesterday evening on QF454. As I posted in another thread, the cabin on the aircraft (VH-ZXE) was a disgrace.
  • It looked like it was 30 years old
  • It was grubby and worn
  • The crew area/galley near where I was sitting was very poorly lit which added to the dim, dour ambience of the cabin.
  • The bulkhead of the galley wobbled around like it was going to fall over, and there are stray pieces of foam at the top which appear to have been shoved in to minimise the rattling.
  • The tiny IFE screens were useless for where I was sitting (27B).
  • This cityflyer flight departed MEL at 5:30pm and the food/drink service started around 6pm. Based on your comments I was expecting dinner, but all they served was 4 crackers with cheese and cold drinks. There wasn't even coffee or tea. When exactly do they serve a full meal?
  Seriously, I do not particularly want to fly QF domestically in Y again if this is what I can expect. The aircraft cabin was depressingly old. Virgin Blue beats this outright. I love QF's J and F class cabins and service on international routes - no issue there. Surely they cannot leave these tired old domestic planes in service for another 4-5 years while they wait for the 787's to arrive?

 

[oz_mark]

I flew MEL-SYD yesterday evening on QF454. As I posted in another thread, the cabin on the aircraft (VH-ZXE) was a disgrace.

• It looked like it was 30 years old
• It was grubby and worn
• The crew area/galley near where I was sitting was very poorly lit which added to the dim, dour ambience of the cabin.
• The bulkhead of the galley wobbled around like it was going to fall over, and there are stray pieces of foam at the top which appear to have been shoved in to minimise the rattling.
• The tiny IFE screens were useless for where I was sitting (27B).
• This cityflyer flight departed MEL at 5:30pm and the food/drink service started around 6pm. Based on your comments I was expecting dinner, but all they served was 4 crackers with cheese and cold drinks. There wasn't even coffee or tea. When exactly do they serve a full meal?

Agree with you that some of the 767's are tired worn out clunkers. As for the meal

* Served on flights departing from 6pm-8pm.

 

[serfty]

... Surely they cannot leave these tired old domestic planes in service for another 4-5 years while they wait for the 787's to arrive?

As I posted elsewhere, the extended A380 delays have forced this.

These ex BA aircraft were due to be returned to BA by now (around middle of last year IIRC).

Being an evening CityFlyer service the Beer/Wine would have at least been complimentary.

Peter, these aircraft have only one redeeming feature; their exit rows have the largest pitch of any QF 767/737. Being a tall guy, did you not ask for a seat in one.

 

[Yada Yada]

As I posted elsewhere, the extended A380 delays have forced this.

These ex BA aircraft were due to be returned to BA by now (around middle of last year IIRC).

Being an evening CityFlyer service the Beer/Wine would have at least been complimentary.

Peter, these aircraft have only one redeeming feature; their exit rows have the largest pitch of any QF 767/737. Being a tall guy, did you not ask for a seat in one.

Ross, I used OLCI the day before and moved myself forward, but did not ask for an exit row when I got to the QP - being only a Scum Gold, I always assume there will be a few hundred WP's in front of me (along with SG's whose names are higher in the alphabet!) and therefore I will never get a look in. My experience of getting any benefit from being SG is close to zero - there must be 10's of thousands of us. I might as well be NB. :-|

If QF are not going to return these old BA planes for a while yet, they need to upgrade the cabins. I cannot believe that the regular pax put up with such lousy planes.

 

[serfty]

Ross, I used OLCI the day before and moved myself forward, but did not ask for an exit row when I got to the QP - being only a Scum Gold, I always assume there will be a few hundred WP's in front of me (along with SG's whose names are higher in the alphabet!) and therefore I will never get a look in. My experience of getting any benefit from being SG is close to zero - there must be 10's of thousands of us. I might as well be NB. :-|

If QF are not going to return these old BA planes for a while yet, they need to upgrade the cabins. I cannot believe that the regular pax put up with such lousy planes.

I dislike those aircraft myself; IMO they are the worst in the QF fleet. Even if they refreshed the interiors I would still not be pleased to travel in one. This is mainly due to the lack of directional air vents and a bad BO experience in CNS. :evil:

With QF domestic flights, all exit row seats are generally up for grabs by any passenger who meets the exit row criteria at check-in. This is normally on a first come first served basis regardless of status.

This is unlike DJ & JQ where Exit row seating can be pre-selected by premium fare PAX.

Exit rows are always the last to be preallocated on QF domestic flights and it will only happen if there are more passengers needing to be allocated seating on a flight than there are non exit row seats.

 

[Yada Yada]

I dislike those aircraft myself; IMO they are the worst in the QF fleet. Even if they refreshed the interiors I would still not be pleased to travel in one. This is mainly due to the lack of directional air vents and a bad BO experience in CNS. :evil:

:shock: Yeck! I did not notice the lack of air vents yesterday.

It's a pity these planes weren't sent off to work for JQ International. I had dinner last night with a friend who works for Boeing (or "Boing" as he likes to call them) and was discussing aircraft types. I expressed my liking for the A330 and that I was sad they sent them off to JQ, but he said that QF didn't like them much and that they probably wouldn't come back to QF after the 78's begin to arrive. (BTW, my friend works primarily in the Defence side of the business, e.g. Wedgetail/AWAC, so only hears gossip about commercial jets).

With QF domestic flights, all exit row seats are generally up for grabs by any passenger who meets the exit row criteria at check-in. This is normally on a first come first served basis regardless of status.

This is unlike DJ & JQ where Exit row seating can be pre-selected by premium fare PAX.

Exit rows are always the last to be preallocated on QF domestic flights and it will only happen if there are more passengers needing to be allocated seating on a flight than there are non exit row seats.

Thanks for the info Ross. I might try it if I'm on QF next week.

Pity these planes weren't set off to JQ International.

 

[stryker]

DJ match it in virtually every other aspect (connecting flights, baggage interlining, international connections from domestic flights (and the opposite), alliance with other airlines (both domestic and international), frequent flyer program, business lounge etc etc).

It's for these such reasons that DJ is vastly different to Ryanair and the like. DJ is better compared to the majority of "legacy" American carriers who these days offer a very similar product to the once "Budget" Virgin Blue.

Hi Daniel,

I wasn't aware that DJ did baggage interlining (I would imagine this is very selective, if it actually happens).

You might bag Easyjet/Ryanair, et al, but at least they don't have silly carry-on limits and their prices well compensate for any lack of "frills" you may perceive. If you are satisfied with DJ and its high prices (compared with the rest of the world), then good for you. It's just another cosy 2 airline policy in my view, however.

As for the "legacy" US carriers, if you have high elite status (as I do, eg *G for life (mine I hope)), then you would probably have a different attitude.

There's no Australian/NZ airline that can come close to matching the network and benefits I get when travelling around the world (especially through the US), and in upgraded business class (where the French champage is still very nice, thank you), I don't think the Virgins of this world are in the same league.

So, there you are. Just my warped little view of things.

 

[pauly7]

Hi Pauly, I'd be interested to know if you have actually flown FR or U2.

I have, many times, and find them to be most professional outfits, with very new planes and extremely good fares. In my opinion, you get more than you pay for, unlike with DJ, which is really a no-frills airline charging QF prices.

You can bad-mouth FR and U2 all you like, but you won't get the same value here in Australia, because it's back to a Government condoned 2-airline policy.

Hi Stryker,

Yes I have flown both Ryanscare and Easycrash, numerous times when I was based in the UK so I think I can comment from my POV without being labelled as simply badmouthing

IMHO, they both make DJ and JQ feel like luxurious airliners in comparison. I can't be bothered getting into specific details about flights but both UK airlines cancelled, re-schedulled, delayed flights like nothing I have ever seen before, their staff were rigid, unpleasant (but I would be too if I had to work for them!) and did not instill confidence in me. Cabins were dirty although aircraft was new.

RE the DJ pricing, they have jacked up their prices as they move to position themselves up from Jet* and more level with QF, but I'll leave you to slog it out with the Virgin ppl on whether its too much!

On another note:

Just flew back from Bris on a DJ 73H - if crazydave or Yada Yada are still watching this thread, why is it that some DJ 73H's have those side - neck - wing things and others don't???, its a huge thing for me - cannot sleep without them, most (i think all?) QF aircraft have them, they are great. Its the little things..... Will DJ be upgrading their seats to the better ones when it puts in the Foxtel tvs??

And will the new seats be fabric or will they keep the leather?? Again, the leather is ageing really quickly, the 73H I flew was apparantly 1 year old according to the crew, but felt about 3-4 years old by the state of the cabin (generally grubby, marks on walls and bins) and the seats look really worn.

Thanks!

 

[straitman]

Hi Stryker,

On another note:

And will the new seats be fabric or will they keep the leather?? Again, the leather is ageing really quickly, the 73H I flew was apparantly 1 year old according to the crew, but felt about 3-4 years old by the state of the cabin (generally grubby, marks on walls and bins) and the seats look really worn.

Thanks!

Interesting as many a/c operators prefer leather as they actually last longer with a LITTLE maintenance. In Virgin's case it probably just means that they need a really good clean.

 

[pauly7]

Interesting as many a/c operators prefer leather as they actually last longer with a LITTLE maintenance. In Virgin's case it probably just means that they need a really good clean.

Yes I'd heard that around here too and that explains why budget carriers like Virgin and Jet* use them. I much prefer fabric for comfort anyway, you slip around on leather.

 

[Evan]

And then they use leather as a selling point... to me more seat width or pitch is a selling point, not that i am sitting on leather... I also prefer fabric.

As you would expect planes that do lot of short haul flights suffer the most and the Jet* and DJ do that all day every day.

How often would an airline re-cover or replace seats ?

E

 

[clifford]

Hi all,

It looks like the various posters will just have to agree to differ.

As most of you know, however, I am a bit of a proponent for Tiger (TR), and I have to say that the professionalism of their crews leaves DJ for dead.

No girliness, but just a straightforward professional approach from their flight crew. After all, TR is basically owned and run by the Singapore Govt (and SQ), so you wouldn't expect any silliness. Maybe a bit straight-laced, but I know who I would rather have around in an emergency. Also the pilots tend to be European, so they know what they are doing. Where did DJ's pilots come from (crop spraying or heli-mustering, I wonder?).

Also, I have never been on a TR flight that has been more than a few minutes late, unlike DJ, and their fares can be quite amazing.

So let me suggest that we be a little bit more realistic in some of our comments.

 

[acampbel]

... So let me suggest that we be a little bit more realistic in some of our comments ....

Great idea!

...Where did DJ's pilots come from (crop spraying or heli-mustering, I wonder?).....

Oh ..... didn't you want to start?


Cheers,


Andrew


.

 

[clifford]

Great idea!



Oh ..... didn't you want to start?


Cheers,


Andrew


.

But I thought I did start, Andrew.

We can all have a bit of fun from time to time, though.

 

[Yada Yada]

On another note:

Just flew back from Bris on a DJ 73H - if crazydave or Yada Yada are still watching this thread, why is it that some DJ 73H's have those side - neck - wing things and others don't???, its a huge thing for me - cannot sleep without them, most (i think all?) QF aircraft have them, they are great. Its the little things..... Will DJ be upgrading their seats to the better ones when it puts in the Foxtel tvs??

And will the new seats be fabric or will they keep the leather?? Again, the leather is ageing really quickly, the 73H I flew was apparantly 1 year old according to the crew, but felt about 3-4 years old by the state of the cabin (generally grubby, marks on walls and bins) and the seats look really worn.

Hi pauly7. Sorry, I can't answer this. I've noticed the different seat types within the fleet and wondered why, but am only a DJ frequent flyer and casual observer, so I don't have any inside info. Hopefully crazydave can enlighten us.

My guess is that the seats won't be replaced when they upgrade each plane with live2air TV screens - probably no need to. And I assume that all seats will remain leather and this seems to be their standard. I'm one who prefers leather over cloth, especially after seeing how bad it looks on QF's old 763's. Curiously, I have flown on one Virgin Blue 737-700 that has cloth seats. It might be their only one? I assume it is one of their leased planes.

I haven't noticed any wearing of the leather seats on DJ's fleet - they all look good to me. Although I have noticed some of the carpet joins looking a bit frayed.

Regarding the state of cleanliness of the Virgin Blue cabins, I've been tempted to write a note to Virgin Blue about this. I've noticed a bit of grunge occasionally that I think gets missed in the regular cleaning - e.g. on the seat backs, around the seat pockets and under the tray tables, and sometimes a bit of food or drink staining on the seats themselves. It's never been anything major but I do think they could pay a bit more attention to detail. I've seen this on early morning flights so it's not like it has come from a long day of flying.

 

[N860CR]

There was one in the fleet with cloth seating but I *think* its been returned. I haven't noticed any major wear on the leather seats so I'm assuming they must have some kind of procedure for maintaining them (my old car was 3 years/80,000km's old and its seats weren't looking too flash, so to keep plane seats in decent condition they must do something.)

Back in the early days I do recall a DJ 737 with green leather seats with orange piping. Hopefully that one has also departed the fleet!

 

[crazydave98]

Back in the early days I do recall a DJ 737 with green leather seats with orange piping. Hopefully that one has also departed the fleet!

Sorry - that's an ex CityBird aircraft (leased) and we still have the thing - I flew it last week BNE-SYD.

Just flew back from Bris on a DJ 73H - if crazydave or Yada Yada are still watching this thread, why is it that some DJ 73H's have those side - neck - wing things and others don't???, its a huge thing for me - cannot sleep without them, most (i think all?) QF aircraft have them, they are great. Its the little things..... Will DJ be upgrading their seats to the better ones when it puts in the Foxtel tvs??

The wings are standard on our new delivery aircraft, but not on aircraft delivered more than (I think) about 2 years ago. The live2air is a retrofit to existing seats - not a replacement.

And will the new seats be fabric or will they keep the leather??

Keeping the leather. As noted elsewhere, it is easier to keep clean than fabric and lasts longer despite higher initial cost.

I saw Peter's comments about some aircraft cleanliness not being up to scratch. I'd appreciate PM from anyone with specific details (flight & date) that I can use to follow up.

cheers

CrazyDave98

 

[crazydave98]

The thing I find with QF from PER, is that I just find the widebody aircraft to be much more comfortable. In fact, I work around making sure I avoid the 737's in the Qantas timetable. Coming in at second place is that the QF timetable (even after taking out the 737's), suits me better.

How would members rank preference for the Qantas fleet of domestic aircraft for trans-continental routes (including the A330-200s that are now off to JQ Int.), all things being equal? That is, the B747 obviously has a better seats, IFE etc. than the B737 but this is not the question: if there was a consistent up to date product across all aircraft, how would they rank just based on the aircraft?

Does anyone else care that they spend forever embarking, disembarking, waiting for others on ground while in economy on the 743? I would have to rank the B767 highest, being 2-3-2 in Y, comfortable if a bit noisy ride, doesn't feel like a sea of faces in the back, and least load/unload.

cheers

CrazyDave98

 

[oz_mark]

How would members rank preference for the Qantas fleet of domestic aircraft for trans-continental routes (including the A330-200s that are now off to JQ Int.), all things being equal? That is, the B747 obviously has a better seats, IFE etc. than the B737 but this is not the question: if there was a consistent up to date product across all aircraft, how would they rank just based on the aircraft?

Does anyone else care that they spend forever embarking, disembarking, waiting for others on ground while in economy on the 743? I would have to rank the B767 highest, being 2-3-2 in Y, comfortable if a bit noisy ride, doesn't feel like a sea of faces in the back, and least load/unload.

If there were a consistent product across the fleet, I would go with the 330's, the 767, then 747.

The 767 has more overhead locker space per passenger which tilts a bit in its favour! The 747's do lose out as PER really doesn't cope well.

If the PER terminal was better equipped to deal with 747's then I may swap the 767 and 747 around!

 

[crazydave98]

If there were a consistent product across the fleet, I would go with the 330's, the 767, then 747.

The 767 has more overhead locker space per passenger which tilts a bit in its favour! The 747's do lose out as PER really doesn't cope well.

If the PER terminal was better equipped to deal with 747's then I may swap the 767 and 747 around!

what is it about the 330 that appeals? I hate the middle block of 4 seats unless low loads.