What does an ASA really cost.

[basso]

Yet some people continue to argue that any seat awards were profitable for Qantas.

Quite. This whole thread is predicated on a self serving, delusional argument that by purchasing a JASA they were spending the full quid at Qantas. Despite the fact they were getting full SC and only actually paying a quarter of the price in $$ terms.

 

[opusman]

The cost to QF of a WP1 versus an ordinary WP is also marginal, at best. The champagne doesn't get any better once you get the 1 on the end.

 

[Princess Fiona]

The cost to QF of a WP1 versus an ordinary WP is also marginal, at best. The champagne doesn't get any better once you get the 1 on the end.

Except at HKG !!

 

[trixydoza]

Except at HKG !!

Also, Penfolds Bin 8 was the P1 red at the QF lounge a couple of weeks ago.

 

[medhead]

No such claims have been made.
Can you take the off topic nonsense elsewhere. Along with the continuing insults.

Yet some people continue to argue that any seat awards were profitable for Qantas.

Quite. This whole thread is predicated on a [redacted] that by purchasing a JASA they were spending the full quid at Qantas. Despite the fact they were getting full SC and only actually paying a quarter of the price in $$ terms.

 

[straitman]

Quite. This whole thread is predicated on a self serving, delusional argument that by purchasing a JASA they were spending the full quid at Qantas. Despite the fact they were getting full SC and only actually paying a quarter of the price in $$ terms.

Since when is it delusional to utilise a pricing system that a (any) company puts in place? Did anyone, and if so where, say they were spending the full quid by purchasing these tickets? They were like the ultra cheap sale tickets that get offered around. They do exist but there are only a handful of them.

Calling people names for using fares that Qantas set up is a bit extreme IMHO. The same goes for not expecting people to get upset at the removal of said fare, especially when they were told quite specifically that such fares would not be removed.

Airline fares are a dogs breakfast at many levels and very few people understand how they and/or the yield management system works. My reading of your posts on the subject is that you probably fit into that category. There are numerous occasions within the normal structure where someone may have paid four times what the person next to them has paid. Do we need to all pay the same fare and if so how would you implement that?

One last point is that this part of the discussion really is OT.

 

[amaroo]

I dunno where this fits in to the above discussion - but let's not forget jetstar is buying SCs off QF loyalty and selling them to passengers for around $1.33 per SC.

Calculation based on a bundle over the business starter fare MEL-SIN which comes in at $200, less $40 of that for Qantas lounge access, leaving 120SCs for $160 cash paid.

One assumes JQ is taking a cut in the buy/sell process, so QF loyalty is probably selling the SCs for something less than $1.33 each.

You can't just buy a Plus Bundle for $200 - you have to buy the starter fare first - which if I recall correctly costs about $1k. So you're getting 90 SCs for $1200, not $200, in that example.

Curiosity got the better of me...

Couple of interesting things about J* SYD-SIN-SYD

1. The business max bundle pays 280SC :shock: QF pays 240SC for Business and 270SC for Business Flex

2. The bundle isn't cheap at $480 - $490 per sector

3. MASA I did a couple of months ago BNE-SYD-SIN-BNE works out (using $0.0097/QFP) at $8.51SC ... J* example below works out to be $9.23SC * this includes the additional 20Sc one earns with J* over the 260SC that my MASA delivered due to the BNE-SYD sector (40SC)

It cost >$5k to fly QF business flex to earn less SC than flying J* at half the cost!

 

[trixydoza]

1. The business max bundle pays 280SC :shock:

The option you've chosen says "1 stop" (presumably in Melbourne). So it's perhaps (120SC + 20SC) * 2.

 

[amaroo]

The option you've chosen says "1 stop". So it's perhaps (120SC + 20SC) * 2.

Ahh, I see. That explains why some examples delivered 155SC each way.

Not a bad way to maximise SC for low cash outlay. Almost as good as the old MASA, if you can accept flying J* to Asia and back.

 

[medhead]

Curiosity got the better of me...

Couple of interesting things about J* SYD-SIN-SYD

1. The business max bundle pays 280SC :shock: QF pays 240SC for Business and 270SC for Business Flex

2. The bundle isn't cheap at $480 - $490 per sector

3. MASA I did a couple of months ago BNE-SYD-SIN-BNE works out (using $0.0097/QFP) at $8.51SC ... J* example below works out to be $9.23SC * this includes the additional 20Sc one earns with J* over the 260SC that my MASA delivered due to the BNE-SYD sector (40SC)

It cost >$5k to fly QF business flex to earn less SC than flying J* at half the cost!


View attachment 54883

I'm struggling with the numbers here. $492/140 is $3.5/SC. It is the $492 that gets you the SC, not the base fare. It's a point of difference from Qantas cash fares and MASA where the SC were part of the base fare, not an optional add on.

Plus you get 9000 points, Qantas will consistently decrease other payments by $63 (@$0.007/point) if you redeem those points. So $3.06/SC.
But 9000 points probably won't get you a toaster.

 

[sumthinfornuthin]

Yet Qantas points are a monopoly currency. Many others here seem to think qantas with return cash to me per point at the same price that they seek them into the market. I think that is wishful thinking. Spillage from unredeemed points is just the cream. Also I'm talking about the average cost of a wholesale point across all partners, not just CBA. I'm certainly not making a claim about what it cost CBA to give you a point. But the cost to CBA does not tell us the cost to a multitude of other businesses. I've already mentioned other numbers which need to be balanced against the low price that CBA might pay. How much were my qantas restaurant points, how much per Woolies fuel point? How many points do people get at 0.5/$ spend on cards?

At a cost of $0.01 per point, $0.015 is only 50% higher.

I also did not get any points from CBA.



This thread has started as being about my travel with respect to the accusation that I'm a status cheat. I don't think I made any claims about QF customers in general. I'm sure other QF customers will share their numbers if they wish.

I would suggest looking at red-e-deal earning. As I pay for all of my flights, that is my earning region. It is certainly possible to get $79/$89/$99 airfares, even now on short domestic routes earning 10SC per flight. I was fairly consistently averaging $120 on a route earning 15SC just by forward planning and booking.



I don't get what you're saying here, an SC costs $10. So on that MEL-SYD flight for $145, the 20 SC cost $200. :?: That doesn't seem correct.

What does an SC cost anyway. Gold is an easy comparison point. 600 SC to retain (lowest potential cost point). 30 flights x 20SC = 30x$145=$4350. Qantas club is roughly $400 at full cost - so $13 per flight, $0.66/SC. :?:

My next JQ bundle is getting me 90SC and 8650 points for about $140. take out meals, points, seat selection (but not luggage) that doesn't leave much to pay for SC.

I think I have had my eye off the ball for too long since JASA's/MASA's became history. How do you get 90SC and 8,650 points from a $ 140 JQ flight ??? well done by the way !!!!!!!

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I think I have had my eye off the ball for too long since JASA's/MASA's became history. How do you get 90SC and 8,650 points from a $ 140 JQ flight ??? well done by the way !!!!!!!

If I understand correctly the $140 s the price of the bundle - not the underlying fare.

Same applies in an earlier example I gave - MEL-SIN bundle is $200, less lounge access - so about $160 for 120SCs and points.

 

[sumthinfornuthin]

If I understand correctly the $140 s the price of the bundle - not the underlying fare.

Same applies in an earlier example I gave - MEL-SIN bundle is $200, less lounge access - so about $160 for 120SCs and points.

thanks..........................

 

[dfcatch]

Quite. This whole thread is predicated on a self serving, delusional argument that by purchasing a JASA they were spending the full quid at Qantas. Despite the fact they were getting full SC and only actually paying a quarter of the price in $$ terms.

The only delusional argument is the one being made that those redeeming a JASA would have otherwise been buying with $$$ an actual full J Revenue fare (on QF).

The empirical evidence is totally the opposite.

The evidence appears to show that those who buy revenue J fares (on QF) were/are doing so regardless of JASAs (already earning SCs, more flexible etc).

Everyone else has either switched to redeeming Classics, buying Y fares, or flying better/cheaper carriers.

mASAs were not something to be compared to a full revenue fare, they were simply Classic Awards that earned points/SCs. (To which QF received a higher cash co-pay which compensated for the SC earn).

AND - these Classic Buckets were tightly Inventory-Controlled.

Until such time as this light-bulb actually goes off - your argument will remain "off the reservation".

To use a real world analogy:

David Jones has a special on 50% off widgets. Becomes so popular - they sell out of widgets.

Next month, some brainiac at David Jones orders the same number of widgets - and decides not to have a sale (wrongly assuming that all those shoppers would have purchased at Full Widget Retail Price).

Brainiac then wonders why he lost his job after managers realize that 90% of the widgets never sold.

Why? Because shoppers like value / bargains, so the shoppers either bought other items on special (or simpler better value), or they shopped at Myer who had better value or specials.

 

[Mr_Orange]

The only delusional argument is the one being made that those redeeming a JASA would have otherwise been buying with $$$ an actual full J Revenue fare (on QF).

The empirical evidence is totally the opposite.

SNIP

To use a real world analogy:

David Jones has a special on 50% off widgets. Becomes so popular - they sell out of widgets.

Next month, some brainiac at David Jones orders the same number of widgets - and decides not to have a sale (wrongly assuming that all those shoppers would have purchased at Full Widget Retail Price).

Brainiac then wonders why he lost his job after managers realize that 90% of the widgets never sold.

Why? Because shoppers like value / bargains, so the shoppers either bought other items on special (or simpler better value), or they shopped at Myer who had better value or specials.

This........

 

[TonyHancock]

As a reference point I used to pay for QF Long Haul J prior to discovering the mASA. Use of the mASA dropped my travel spend with QF by more than half.

Problem for me, of course, is that with the mASA gone there is no way I can get back to the budget I had prior to the mASA. (I'm spending that money in the business elsewhere.)

I can't afford QF so now know BA/MH/UL quite a bit better.

So the introduction of the mASA led to me spending less with QF and then it's withdrawal has reduced my spending with QF further.

The hidden "cost" for me is the points aspect. What was QF making out of me on the points side?

 

[wandering_fred]

As a reference point I used to pay for QF Long Haul J prior to discovering the mASA. Use of the mASA dropped my travel spend with QF by more than half.
Problem for me, of course, is that with the mASA gone there is no way I can get back to the budget I had prior to the mASA. (I'm spending that money in the business elsewhere.)
I can't afford QF so now know BA/MH/UL quite a bit better.
...

You might want to consider adding AY to that list...

Especially if you continue wandering

Fred

 

[medhead]

I think I have had my eye off the ball for too long since JASA's/MASA's became history. How do you get 90SC and 8,650 points from a $ 140 JQ flight ??? well done by the way !!!!!!!

If I understand correctly the $140 s the price of the bundle - not the underlying fare.

Same applies in an earlier example I gave - MEL-SIN bundle is $200, less lounge access - so about $160 for 120SCs and points.

Yes, that was just the bundle price, and my memory based guesstimate of the bundle.

Reflecting on amaroo's post that included both bundle price and base fare. This JQ set of flights, with bundle, has a total cost of $7.08/SC not accounting for the 8650 points, or the other bundle inclusions. Consistently in my long term cost range. At least the fare benefits Qantas group.

 

[greenfish]

As a reference point I used to pay for QF Long Haul J prior to discovering the mASA. Use of the mASA dropped my travel spend with QF by more than half.

Tony, I suspect you're a little unique in being able to substitute revenue fares for MASAs. You're very fortunate in being able to structure your flights around redemption availability. Many (most?) don't have the same flexibility.

 

[TonyHancock]

Tony, I suspect you're a little unique in being able to substitute revenue fares for MASAs. You're very fortunate in being able to structure your flights around redemption availability. Many (most?) don't have the same flexibility.

Absolutely right!

I am lucky enough to be able to book UK/Europe trips almost a year out. I agree I am definitely in a better position than most in this regard.