WikiLeaks

[drron]

The funniest thing about this is Sarah Palin calling Assange Un american after her website was taken down.DUH.

 

[samh004]

I'm not sure who you mean. Assage? If so, I can only say that treason is a big word and that requires a lot of proof. Certainly not something I'd accept based on the ramblings of gillard or some teaparty nutcase especially since I've yet to hear of an Interpol warrant for treason.

I’m pro-WikiLeaks. I meant Mark Arbib.

 

[simongr]

Then I guess you support the dirty tricks the USA is using to try and extradite him?

http://www.legitgov.org/Assanges-Alleged-Rape-Victims-Bragged-Conquests-After-Crimes

Why would you assume that? In the same way that stealing information and publishing it "for the public" doesnt offset the theft - using dirty tricks to extradite someone because they have done something wrong is not appropriate. My main concern is (again) the theft and distribution of confidential information.

 

[Oneworldplus2]

Why would you assume that? In the same way that stealing information and publishing it "for the public" doesn't offset the theft - using dirty tricks to extradite someone because they have done something wrong is not appropriate. My main concern is (again) the theft and distribution of confidential information.

The theft of the info was by someone in the US system. Wiki only publish what they get. Some people are also saying that he is anti-American. Well, if someone in the Russian/Chinese government would send sensitive material to WikiLeaks, l'm sure it would also get published.

I agree that it's a double edge sword simongr. There can be sensitive material, but l am curious to how governments work behind closed doors and also think that the military cover-ups are shocking.

So far, it can be argued that the material released hasn't contained any significant intel. Couple of bruised ego's on the diplomatic front and some leaks about how certain foreign governments are perceived by the USA that the public already knew, big deal.
Possible targets that terrorists might use (ie, pipelines, infrastructure, etc etc), anyone with half a brain can work that out, so l don't think that that's anything "classified" either, or new (ask BP/Chevron about their African operations that have been attacked over the past decade by militants/terrorists).


It should be interesting when the "Howard years" leaks come out.

 

[Hvr]

A couple of things about WikiLeaks:

1) Sometimes it is necessary for people to report unpalatable news, Nixon would not have been forced to resign except for Deepthroat and the reporters he spoke to.

2) The moon landing was real, if it had been faked then we would know about it by now.

 

[Alanslegal]

I am probably on the other side of the fence here. I don't support the distribution of illegally obtained documents.

Without these documents, the world would have been a less fortunate place. The folks at Reuters would have believed - the spin, the lies and deception by the US - that their cameraman and driver was carrying weapons rather than their cameras and thus were killed in cold blood; all because the army folks in helicopters felt it was more like a Playstation 3 game and got trigger happy.

Sargeant Pat Tillman's family would have believed he died a hero - the americans wanted him to be tha symbol - but the cruel reality was he died by accident, three shots to the head by his fellow soldier. The deceit shown to Tillman's family, the lies, the heartbreak ..... and all because of a pursuit for greed. Greed to only tell the world what it wants to tell, to spin the truth.

Sadly two wrongs don't make a right but I'll be grateful that a few young men are willing to stand up, and do what they believe is in the public's interest, to air open the truth that is often deliberately hidden up - no matter what the ultimate personal consequences they may end up in.

But regardless, the distribution of alleged illegal documents continue through a variety of media outlets - not just on Wikileaks - and I do not see the US government or whoever the powers may be trying to close down SMH.com.au, Youtube.com, CNN, CNAI, Channel 10, 2UE, 2dayFM etc etc.

 

[odysseus]

But regardless, the distribution of alleged illegal documents continue through a variety of media outlets - not just on Wikileaks - and I do not see the US government or whoever the powers may be trying to close down SMH.com.au, Youtube.com, CNN, CNAI, Channel 10, 2UE, 2dayFM etc etc.

I find that comparison very odd, and am surprised you do not see the reason. It's because they have policies regarding the accuracy and merits and can negotiate to hold back on publishing there is detriment.

Wikileaks seems to be more about the kudos of getting some other's secrets and publishing without concern. It's all about responsibility - some have it, others don't.

With Assange, it's all about glory for him. Though his own disclosure and principles are not as strong as he demands from others.

 

[medhead]

I’m pro-WikiLeaks. I meant Mark Arbib.

Ah, yes, I see. I haven't really kept up with the story too well, hence why I really shouldn't comment. During the week while at work I only really see Sunrise and it is pretty weak on news reporting (so I tend to ignore it). But at least it makes me get out of bed and go to work. :shock:

 

[medhead]

I did like John Howard's view on this:

Kevin Rudd, John Howard speak out over WikiLeaks' Julian Assange | Herald Sun

Mr Howard said Mr Assange had not done anything wrong by publishing cables that contained "frank commentary".

"Any journalist will publish confidential information if he or she gets hold of it, subject only to compelling national security interests.

"The issue is whether any of this material and the publication of it will endanger people lives or endangers individual countries.

"The bad people in this little exercise are the people who gave the information to him, because they're the people who breached the trust.

"They deserve to be chased and prosecuted."

Sargeant Pat Tillman's family would have believed he died a hero - the americans wanted him to be tha symbol - but the cruel reality was he died by accident, three shots to the head by his fellow soldier. The deceit shown to Tillman's family, the lies, the heartbreak ..... and all because of a pursuit for greed. Greed to only tell the world what it wants to tell, to spin the truth.

I don't know this story but it sounds like something that should never have been told to his family - either way.

I find that comparison very odd, and am surprised you do not see the reason. It's because they have policies regarding the accuracy and merits and can negotiate to hold back on publishing there is detriment.

Actually it is a very good comparison. If it is dangerous for wikileaks to publish this information then surely it is also dangerous for these other media outlets to publish the stories as well. Sure the information is out there but if publishing it is high treason that's going to kill thousands then why is CNN even giving it air to breathe. Because they want to make money?

 

[samh004]

I don't know this story but it sounds like something that should never have been told to his family - either way.

Friendly fire.

Is it right to let the family believe that their son, brother, uncle etc was killed by an enemy in a foreign land and let the hate continue for the people in that foreign land that seems to be oh so prevalent right now?

Or are you saying the government shouldn’t have lied in the first place, because that’s easy to say.

 

[medhead]

Friendly fire.

Is it right to let the family believe that their son, brother, uncle etc was killed by an enemy in a foreign land and let the hate continue for the people in that foreign land that seems to be oh so prevalent right now?

Or are you saying the government shouldn’t have lied in the first place, because that’s easy to say.

I'm saying nothing should have been said either way; the government shouldn't have made up a hero story because that is only going to lead to the lie being exposed. Once they did lie then the story shouldn't have been blown.

IMO someone's active service is a matter between the people they served with and their family. Again I'm talking blind on this story but unless someone has won a VC or similar then the government must say nothing.
At the very least it is a privacy matter.

 

[drron]

I'm saying nothing should have been said either way; the government shouldn't have made up a hero story because that is only going to lead to the lie being exposed. Once they did lie then the story shouldn't have been blown.

IMO someone's active service is a matter between the people they served with and their family. Again I'm talking blind on this story but unless someone has won a VC or similar then the government must say nothing.
At the very least it is a privacy matter.

Tillman was a high profile NFL player before serving.The media interest in his story was very high.I was in the states when he died.i doubt the government could have kept stonewalling for long.But they should not have lied.

 

[medhead]

Tillman was a high profile NFL player before serving.The media interest in his story was very high.I was in the states when he died.i doubt the government could have kept stonewalling for long.But they should not have lied.

IMO celebrity doesn't belong in the military. By that i mean making someone a celebrity war hero, not a sports celebrity joining up. No real need to stonewall. Simply say "he died, it is a great loss".

I would write more but it is OT and wouldn't add anything, just say my thoughts are more complex than the simple view I've written here and I do appreciate there are a range of competing issues on this matter

 

[browski]

A couple of things about WikiLeaks:

2) The moon landing was real, if it had been faked then we would know about it by now.

Actually, initially nobody ever really contested that the moon landing was real. It is just that the US fabricated some images of the moon landing so that we could "better see" the achievement.

It was the falsification of the photos that lead people to question as to whether the entire landing was fake. To hide their deception, the US Govt claimed that people who said the images were fake, were actually saying that the Moonlanding did not occur - this form of exaggerating the accuser's claims is a well practiced form of deception in the PR game.

 

[Alanslegal]

Just attended the rally at the steps of the Sydney Town Hall and what a great turn out at very little notice and from all walks of life. One sign that caught my attention, I don't know the author/writer so I can't acknowledge them is this .....

You can cage the singer, but you cannot cage the Song.

That is soooooo true. The Americans can cage Assange, but his song will remaining singing. The truth will come out, the leaks will keep on flowing and the openess means accountability.

 

[PineappleSkip]

I think I'm over wikileaks. And anti wikileaks. And Anti-anti-wikileaks. Twitter is infested with commentary.

I've watched the hysterical overresponse of some in the US (e.g. Palin and Sen Lieberman) change coverage from hostile towards wikileaks to sympathetic towards the attacks on wikileaks. On my reckoning, the tide, outside the US, had turned by about Wednesday.

Meanwhile in the US the hysteria appears to continue...

Cheers skip

 

[albatross710]

People are making decisions at Visa, Mastercard and Paypal and need to be aware how those decisions are affecting their customers. If you are concerned that you can't use your payment methods to make donations to an organisation (wikileaks) that you appreciate, please take a moment to let you financial institution know how you feel.

Westpac Online complaints or phone 132 032.

NAB online

Commonwealth Bank complaints

If you have the time to ring your bank that is also appreciated. Every phone call and complaint makes a difference.

Alby

 

[Oneworldplus2]

The Wikileaks bunker, or part of where they store their info.

WikiLeaks now storing files in 'James_Bond' bunker - CNN Video

[video=youtube;hMUey7Zt2u0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMUey7Zt2u0[/video]


Wikileaks' Swedish Bunkers [Al Jazeera]
[video=youtube;eExRG2qpRaI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eExRG2qpRaI[/video]


WikiLeaks servers safe in Stockholm nuclear bunker

WikiLeaks servers safe in Stockholm nuclear bunker | World | DAWN.COM



This is the Nuclear Bunker where Wikileaks will be located

This Is the Nuclear Bunker Where Wikileaks Will Be Located

 

[Oneworldplus2]

Something interesting, "Openleaks" may be on the way soon.

WikiLeaks may get a rival Openleaks - The Economic Times


WikiLeaks may get a rival Openleaks


STOCKHOLM: A group of former WikiLeaks collaborators who quit the project are to launch a new campaigning site next week to protest against its founder, a Swedish newspaper said.

Respected daily Dagens Nyheter said the decision was made to launch the site, Openleaks, in protest against Julian Assange . It did not elaborate.

"Our long-term goal is to build a strong, transparent platform to support whistleblowers, both in terms of technology and politics, while at the same time encouraging others to start similar projects," the newspaper quoted a source connected to the new site as saying.

The report, headlined "'New WikiLeaks' rebels against Assange," said the person wished to remain anonymous. Unusually, the newspaper printed the article in both English and Swedish on the front page of its website, DN.se - Nyheter - DN.se .

The source said a short-term goal was to complete the technical infrastructure and ensure that "the organization continues to be democratically governed by all its members, rather than limited to one group or individual," an apparent reference to Assange's leading role at WikiLeaks.

Assange, who was remanded in custody in Britain after an arrest warrant issued in Sweden over accusations of sexual misconduct, has been the public face of WikiLeaks.

The WikiLeaks site has attracted international attention in the past two weeks with leaks of secret U.S. diplomatic cables, angering Washington.

The newspaper also said it had documents which showed discontent within WikiLeaks and that accessibility issues with the site earlier this year had been arranged by insiders as a signal for Assange to step back.

The report said that though the new website was also aimed at providing the means for whistleblowers to publish information, it would not itself publish information directly.

Instead, other organizations would access the Openleaks system and then present their audience with the material. Documents would be processed and published by various collaborating groups such as the media, non-profit organizations, trade unions or other groups.

"As a result of our intention not to publish any document directly and in our own name, we do not expect to experience the kind of political pressure which WikiLeaks is under at this time," the report quoted another person as saying.

"In that aspect, it is quite interesting to see how little of politicians' anger seems directed at the newspapers using WikiLeaks sources," the person said.

 

[odysseus]

Actually it is a very good comparison. If it is dangerous for wikileaks to publish this information then surely it is also dangerous for these other media outlets to publish the stories as well. Sure the information is out there but if publishing it is high treason that's going to kill thousands then why is CNN even giving it air to breathe. Because they want to make money?

Two things.

1) The statement was not about it being dangerous, so that's a bit of a straw man.

2) Regarding "giving it air to breathe", it is part of the news and people would complain about it being a conspiracy if CNN didn't talk about wikileaks. CNN and others are not publishing individual pieces just because they can though.

Assange may have more credibility if he came across with principles. Unfortunately, he appears to be more like Oprah, just publishing because he can and it helps him.

The reports that came out today about others breaking away and his response towards that support that impression I had of him. It's more about him than about any cause or principles.