Worse than feet on bulkheads

[Boca68]

The clue is is the thread title.

And if it's there long enough for me to take note and rouse my camera to action, then yes, it's inordinate.

Yeah! Still not buying it?

TBH, its a very wierd picture. I know in this age, the 'selfie' and the facebook post have taken over. Feet on bulkheads (or worse) is a fun discussion. I'm just not comfortable with the pic. Sorry. Just can't get my head around why you would even take a pic like that? He stood up for a few seconds? Yet, you had the forethought to have phone in hand ready to take a pic of it? Or is it taken from a website?

I see the pun intended, but ....yep! why? Just freaks me out!

 

[marki]

Earful awful view from that seat

 

[Deleted member 29185]

I wouldn't put my feet on a wall in my own home (or anyone else's) because I am never going to be sitting in a chair facing a wall with limited opportunities for movement for 12+ hours. I see no reason why that means I shouldn't do it in clean socks on a plane.

Some time ago, someone posted here on AFF, a pic of a person in C (aisle) reading a cough mag ... pictures and all displayed for all to see. He obviously considered his entertainment "right" outweighed everyone else's right to a flight without being subjected to content that would offend many people. The vast majority of flyers (myself included) can sit in an aircraft for 12 hours without the need to place feet on bulkheads, clip toe nails, pick noses, treat tinea or read cough. It's important to realise that we are speaking about the minority. Those in that minority come up with all kinds of excuses as to why they have a need/right/desire etc etc to place themselves before the needs/rights/desires of all those around them. I don't buy the "12 hours = I must have a right to drape my feet over everything" argument and quite aside from that, many of the posts here in this thread are about short haul flights. This whole debate is really about the inability of a minority of people to behave in a socially accepted manor when in public.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Some time ago, someone posted here on AFF, a pic of a person in C (aisle) reading a cough mag ... pictures and all displayed for all to see. He obviously considered his entertainment "right" outweighed everyone else's right to a flight without being subjected to content that would offend many people. The vast majority of flyers (myself included) can sit in an aircraft for 12 hours without the need to place feet on bulkheads, clip toe nails, pick noses, treat tinea or read cough. It's important to realise that we are speaking about the minority. Those in that minority come up with all kinds of excuses as to why they have a need/right/desire etc etc to place themselves before the needs/rights/desires of all those around them. I don't buy the "12 hours = I must have a right to drape my feet over everything" argument and quite aside from that, many of the posts here in this thread are about short haul flights. This whole debate is really about the inability of a minority of people to behave in a socially accepted manor when in public.

I think most people agree certain things are unacceptable... clipping toe nails can lead to stray bits flying around the cabin. Treating tinea might expose others to catching the condition. Changing babies at your seat on the tray table... no need to say more.

But feet on bulkheads doesn't fall in to any of those categories. It may offend you personally, or perhaps even challenge your desire to be 'in control', but it doesn't appear to lead to any harm. In the absence of that harm, what's the problem?

 

[Rebekkap]

I think most people agree certain things are unacceptable... clipping toe nails can lead to stray bits flying around the cabin. Treating tinea might expose others to catching the condition. Changing babies at your seat on the tray table... no need to say more.

But feet on bulkheads doesn't fall in to any of those categories. It may offend you personally, or perhaps even challenge your desire to be 'in control', but it doesn't appear to lead to any harm. In the absence of that harm, what's the problem?

Exactly. There's a huge difference between any of the unhygienic and gross things mentioned and putting your clean socks on a plastic bulkhead. And reading cough in public is actually illegal, FYI.

 

[drron]

On one of my flights coming to Whyalla there was a woman over the aisle from me who gave me some moments I considered worse than feet on bulkheads.
She needed a seat belt extender.Tattooed all over.how do I know because she wore a see through white skirt split right up the front.So believe me when she stood up and went to the toilet I saw things I wished I hadn't-but the looking was reflex I add.She made a commotion and as one does you look to see what the noise is.
How she got to her condition was obvious.As soon as she sat in her seat she got out a takeaway container and devoured a large sausage roll and a meat pie,washed down with a bottle of Coke.When the "meal'was served she let the other 4 members of the family have the water but she collected the food items consuming 2 and putting the other 3 in her bag.
But although my camera was out of my pocket I only used it out the window.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

I think most people agree certain things are unacceptable... clipping toe nails can lead to stray bits flying around the cabin. Treating tinea might expose others to catching the condition. Changing babies at your seat on the tray table... no need to say more.

But feet on bulkheads doesn't fall in to any of those categories. It may offend you personally, or perhaps even challenge your desire to be 'in control', but it doesn't appear to lead to any harm. In the absence of that harm, what's the problem?

I'm not sure of what I'm in control, but throwing the issue back at me is a cop out. I don't sit with my feet on bulkheads and nor do the vast majority of flyers. It's funny that no one yet (including you) have stated they'd be happy to have guests place their feet and/or shoes on their own walls at their home, yet you continue to imply that the exact same behaviour is acceptable when those walls belong to an airline. Thank heavens only the minority seem content with anti-social behaviour and that's exactly what it is, no matter where along your all important hygiene scale the behaviour rests.

And reading cough in public is actually illegal, FYI.

It's not for my information. I wasn't the one reading the cough on a plane, but the guy who was, obviously thought as strongly about his "right" to do so as you do about your "right" to disrespecting other peoples property. Anti-social behaviour comes in varying degrees of magnitude, but none the less it is anti-social behaviour. Feet on bulkheads, armrests, tray tables etc is not the norm now and hopefully it will never become the norm, even though a few people disagree.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I'm not sure of what I'm in control, but throwing the issue back at me is a cop out. I don't sit with my feet on bulkheads and nor do the vast majority of flyers. It's funny that no one yet (including you) have stated they'd be happy to have guests place their feet and/or shoes on their own walls at their home, yet you continue to imply that the exact same behaviour is acceptable when those walls belong to an airline. Thank heavens only the minority seem content with anti-social behaviour and that's exactly what it is, no matter where along your all important hygiene scale the behaviour rests.



It's not for my information. I wasn't the one reading the cough on a plane, but the guy who was, obviously thought as strongly about his "right" to do so as you do about your "right" to disrespecting other peoples property. Anti-social behaviour comes in varying degrees of magnitude, but none the less it is anti-social behaviour. Feet on bulkheads, armrests, tray tables etc is not the norm now and hopefully it will never become the norm, even though a few people disagree.

A couple of posts do answer your question about whether it is acceptable to put your feet on the walls in a private home, and have discounted that argument because guests at your home aren't seated 18 inches away from a blank wall for 12 hours. They have room to move around at home.

And no doubt when I have guests over, if we are relaxing for an extended period of time, shoes might come off and feet tucked behind/under/beside the person on the sofa, couch or chair. It's about comfort.

By the same token you haven't addressed the issue of having a couple of spare seats beside you on the plane and the ability to stretch out... or are we not allowed to do that because our feet are on the seat? Qantas actually sells rows of seats for main cabin passengers ex DFW. I don't think anyone would agree with your notion that stretching out over spare seats is anti-social.

 

[Rebekkap]

It's not for my information. I wasn't the one reading the cough on a plane, but the guy who was, obviously thought as strongly about his "right" to do so as you do about your "right" to disrespecting other peoples property. Anti-social behaviour comes in varying degrees of magnitude, but none the less it is anti-social behaviour. Feet on bulkheads, armrests, tray tables etc is not the norm now and hopefully it will never become the norm, even though a few people disagree.

I understood you weren't the one reading cough, but the point is the guy who was doing so not only didn't have a "right" to do so, what he was doing was illegal as well as anti-social. Unlike putting clean feet on a plastic bulkhead - which is neither illegal nor has any effect on people around you. And as MEL_Traveller already pointed out, several of us have already addressed the issue of feet on walls in homes - it's not analogous, as you are not stuck in a cramped seat facing a wall for hours on end in people's homes.

You claim the majority of travelers wouldn't put their feet on the bulkhead - I suspect that's only because the majority are not lucky enough to be seated in a bulkhead where they have room to put their feet up.

Feet on a bulkhead is nothing like feet on a tray table or arm rest - you don't eat off the bulk head. You don't put your arms on a bulkhead. The fact that someone's feet have been on it doesn't affect other people like feet on a tray table or arm rest does. In fact, someone having their feet on a bulk head doesn't affect anyone else in the slightest, unlike the other behaviours those against it keep bringing up.

And putting your feet up isn't "disrespecting someone's property" - it doesn't hurt the property either.

 

[drron]

Are these pax going to far-

.

https://www.instagram.com/p/BKV0NwNBw-z/

All on here-
https://twitter.com/PassengerShame

 

[Moody]

You claim the majority of travelers wouldn't put their feet on the bulkhead - I suspect that's only because the majority are not lucky enough to be seated in a bulkhead where they have room to put their feet up.

No - the majority were well brung up. I have sat in the bulkhead row many times and never even thought of showing off in such a crass manner. I also don't slam my seat back as soon as the seat-belt sign goes off in some sort of pathetic parody of a Mr Bean episode.

I guess I'm funny like that .....

 

[Rebekkap]

No - the majority were well brung up. I have sat in the bulkhead row many times and never even thought of showing off in such a crass manner. I also don't slam my seat back as soon as the seat-belt sign goes off in some sort of pathetic parody of a Mr Bean episode.

I guess I'm funny like that .....

Pretty funny to equate putting your feet up - which again, has no effect on anyone around you - with slamming your seat back, which has a distinct and uncomfortable effect on the person behind you.

I was also "well brung up" (or even brought up, since I was also taught to use proper grammar). I have good table manners, I'm considerate of other people, I'm not rude - but I fail to see how finding a more comfortable position on a long flight is "showing off in a crass manner". It has ZERO effect on anyone else, which I was brought up to understand is the essence of good manners. I'm not doing it to "show off", any more than someone who's lucky enough to get a whole row of seats to themself is "showing off" by lying down. Honestly, it's ridiculous how het up people are getting about someone doing something that has zero effect on them, doesn't damage the plane in any way, and has literally nothing in common with any of the other actually rude (or in some cases, actually illegal) behaviours they keep trying to claim are analogous.

 

[Pierre_a]

No - the majority were well brung up. I have sat in the bulkhead row many times and never even thought of showing off in such a crass manner. I also don't slam my seat back as soon as the seat-belt sign goes off in some sort of pathetic parody of a Mr Bean episode.

I guess I'm funny like that .....

I'm not sure instruction on the correct etiquette pertaining to the occupancy of a bulkhead and/or reclining seat on an airliner is part of the upbringing of a typical child. In fact I would say accepted norms of behavior are rather subjective in general. I would think it is up to the airline to implement regulations dictating what is and isn't acceptable on their aircraft. That way if those regulations don't meet our personal subjective judgements we may travel with an airline whose does.

 

[Moody]

I'm not sure instruction on the correct etiquette pertaining to the occupancy of a bulkhead and/or reclining seat on an airliner is part of the upbringing of a typical child. In fact I would say accepted norms of behavior are rather subjective in general. I would think it is up to the airline to implement regulations dictating what is and isn't acceptable on their aircraft. That way if those regulations don't meet our personal subjective judgements we may travel with an airline whose does.

The trouble with etiquette is that many people leave it at the cabin door .... if they had any in the first place.

"Etiquette means practices and forms of good manners followed by a class. Good manners are not in the eyes of the persons forming the group, but making other people feel comfortable by the way one behave. They can be prescribed by social conventions or by authority.
Etiquette means respect for the dignity and worth of a fellow human being. [State v. Smith, 1999 SD 83, P63 (S.D. 1999)]"

 

[dajop]

For those that are ever so offended by the arrogant puerile offensive activity of people putting socked feet against bulkhead is it OK to put their feet against the bulkhead provided they are not elevated? Is it OK if they only put their feet against the bottom 20cm of the bulkhead? If not, is it OK for them to rest their toes on the bulkhead as long as the heel is planted on the floor? No? They should sit there with their feet firmly planted on the floor?

Where is the line?

 

[Quickstatus]

That way if those regulations don't meet our personal subjective judgements we may travel with an airline whose does.

Which airline is that?

 

[Moody]

For those that are ever so offended by the arrogant puerile offensive activity of people putting socked feet against bulkhead is it OK to put their feet against the bulkhead provided they are not elevated? Is it OK if they only put their feet against the bottom 20cm of the bulkhead? If not, is it OK for them to rest their toes on the bulkhead as long as the heel is planted on the floor? No? They should sit there with their feet firmly planted on the floor?

Where is the line?

Feet should be on the floor for good posture as much as politeness - the BS about the "comfort" of wall climbing would have you laughed all the way to your chiro/osteo/physio.

 

[dajop]

Feet should be on the floor for good posture as much as politeness -.

Oh if that's the case I pity the poor folk in business and first who elevate their feet during their journey.

Just realised I have my feet against the bulkhead more often than I had previously remembered. I try to get bulkhead seat whenever I happen to travelling in SQ business. It's the sort of arrangement from picture below (unashamedly stolen from FT after a google search). Quite often when sitting like that I am tall enough that my soles of my feet do rest against the bulkhead. Acceptable or not?

 

[JohnK]

The bogan twins.



I am really sorry but that is disgusting. The male twin on the right slammed his seat back as soon as he finished dinner but the meal trays still not collected. He wasn't happy when my fist accidentally struck the back of his seat. His childish protest didn't last long either.

And that is how rage occurs in an airline cabin confined space.

 

[Rebekkap]

Feet should be on the floor for good posture as much as politeness - the BS about the "comfort" of wall climbing would have you laughed all the way to your chiro/osteo/physio.

Find me a chiro/osteo/physio who says on a 24 hour flight to Europe we should have our feet on the floor the whole time - particularly those of us whose feet swell badly and lower backs ache if we sit with our feet on the floor for an extended period of time, and I'll laugh too