10,000 bonus points per 20 transactions

[simongr]

surely this is tantamount to fraud on the part of AMEX? Promising something and then not delivering when we fulfil our side of bargain?

Surely the ACCC would have to take some action, otherwise this will set a very dangerous precedent.

Imagine if other businesses start doing this....promise something and then retroscpectively changing the rules.

Are you actually reading this thread? Pretty much this has been posted word for word more than a few times.

I can imagine a few businesses doing exactly this. Jetstar advertises 1c fares SYD-MEL. Website crashes due to the uptake and the sale ends pretty quickly. Offer made and withdrawn. Petrol station advertises 90c a litre, you queue for 45 mins for gas and by the time you get to the pump the price has risen. Neither situations are much fun but are also not fraud.

Sadly we have very few facts at this point and thus very little to progress forward on.

I am half tempted to start another thread to capture:

• Actual confirmed points adjustments
• Written confirmation from Amex on caps etc.
• Commenced "legal" actions

And leave the speculation to die in the ar$e here. Frankly the info received from a CSR is worth about as much as a buy option on the A$ at 99c:US$1

 

[vet]

Its been said by a forumite with velocity that the ff contract is between him as the customer and the ff program/velocity, and is not with amex. However Velocity's terms refer to a definition of "Program Partners" and go on to say ff points held by the ff program can be cancelled at the request of the partners. The various agreements also refer to 'subject to the terms of ...'. So does amex have rights to cancel, or cause the cancellation of, points sitting in the program? If so, how can one 'cut amex off' at the pass (short of gong to the Practice Court for an injunction).

Its been said there's no nexus between gaming permits - taken out by amex - and the mr program. However amex (not some DJ Store) amex couldn't withhold bonus points/tickets without , under penalty of a fine and conviction, the Commission varying the permit. And if amex can't, under penal laws, change the terms without the Commission's consent, I wonder if amex will have trouble saying it can change the mr terms at all, let alone retrospectively. Add other problems for amex such as ASIC's powers to look into extracting enforceable undertakings to force amex into giving the bonuses, the Fair Trading Act and the Consumer Credit Code.

Its been said ACCC can look into things. S51AF says otherwise, but the ACCC will still like to receive reports according to its staff.

The ASIC can look into things: s12DA etc's consumer protection laws in the Australian Securities & Investment Commission Act 2001 (Commonwealth).

Overall, I'd prefer to turn the heat up on amex so its management get legal advice on whether they can just say 'we can change our terms with impugnity'. As noted earlier, the Gaming Commission successfully prosecuted a promoter from changing terms so maybe amex can't change terms legally. And I repeat: Amex took out the permit and the airlines and points programs agreed to give the prize. So maybe QFF Velocity etc should lean on amex to make it sort out its own mess at amex's sole cost by awarding points as per terms at the time people signed on. After all, amex may prefer to use its muscle against small fry, but should think twice about picking on small fry if QFF, Velocity ASIC and Ombudsmen tell it to give points as per the original uncapped terms.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

Dear VET,

As pointed out to you in a reply by White 22 the Lottery was a completely seperate promotion and nothing to do with this "No Limits" MR promotion.

You have also been told this by several other posters as well.

If you wish to keep posting on that matter can you please start a thread for that purpose as it is a seperate matter and is not at all relevant to this thread.

Thank you.

 

[oz_mark]

Overall, I'd prefer to turn the heat up on amex so its management get legal advice on whether they can just say 'we can change our terms with impugnity'. As noted earlier, the Gaming Commission successfully prosecuted a promoter from changing terms so maybe amex can't change terms legally. And I repeat: Amex took out the permit and the airlines and points programs agreed to give the prize. So maybe QFF Velocity etc should lean on amex to make it sort out its own mess at amex's sole cost by awarding points as per terms at the time people signed on. After all, amex may prefer to use its muscle against small fry, but should think twice about picking on small fry if QFF, Velocity ASIC and Ombudsmen tell it to give points as per the original uncapped terms.

This promotion is not a game of chance. There are no prizes. There is no gaming permit. It has nothing to do with Virgin Blue. It has nothing to do with Qantas.

 

[bravoecho1]

I think its time to provide a bit of levity and get this thread back on topic by incorporating something that hasn't been mentioned (surprisingly) previously - HP's

 

[straitman]

I think its time to provide a bit of levity and get this thread back on topic by incorporating something that hasn't been mentioned (surprisingly) previously - HP's

Perhaps we could travel by Bus to buy the HP's :!:

 

[straitman]

Sadly we have very few facts at this point and thus very little to progress forward on.

I am half tempted to start another thread to capture:

• Actual confirmed points adjustments
• Written confirmation from Amex on caps etc.
• Commenced "legal" actions

And leave the speculation to die in the ar$e here. Frankly the info received from a CSR is worth about as much as a buy option on the A$ at 99c:US$1

simongr,

I'm in full support of your suggestion. I don't think it will be very hard to work out the list of who would be banned from posting on factual thread :!:

I'm glad I'm not involved with how some of these people lead their 'real lives'

 

[NM]

Perhaps we could travel by Bus to buy the HP's :!:

But the real point is which debt card will you use to pay for the b*s ticket and the HPs and how many reward points will those transactions accrue?

 

[kelix]

Has anyones supp card earnt them points (pre the 8-10 week posting times)?

Ive had a supp on my acount for a few weeks now.. but points arent posting (normal points) do i need to register the card to my MR.. shouldnt it automatically just be added as its a supp?

 

[oz_mark]

But the real point is which debt card will you use to pay for the b*s ticket and the HPs and how many reward points will those transactions accrue?

Hmm, Did you get a postcard? What date did you sign up?

 

[QF WP]

Has anyones supp card earnt them points (pre the 8-10 week posting times)? I've had a supp on my acount for a few weeks now.. but points aren't posting (normal points) do I need to register the card to my MR...shouldn't it automatically just be added as its a supp?

Yes, I have a supplementary card and a business account card that are attached to my primary card and all transactions have been earning me MR points. Not exactly sure whether there is an automatic link to the MR account (because that is a separate "account" as it is not your credit card account). I'd think that you'll need to clarify with Amex/MR.

As a separate issue, if you added the supplementary card before the promo started, all transactions from both your primary and supplementary cards should be eligible transactions towards the MR promo. If you added it after the beginning of the promotion, I wouldn't think the transactions from the supp card would be eligible (in line with the original and amended T&C's).

 

[lovestotravel]

So much for:
The promised letters being sent to all customers
The promised phone calls that all customers would receive

Now more rubbish about a 5,000 point limit

Again I signed up to the promo and the T&C's were clear pre 20th September

I haven't been notified otherwise so the original T&C's are still valid as far as I am concerned

I'll worry in about 6-7 weeks if no more bonus points are posted

 

[oz_mark]

So much for:
The promised letters being sent to all customers
The promised phone calls that all customers would receive

Now more rubbish about a 5,000 point limit

Again I signed up to the promo and the T&C's were clear pre 20th September

I haven't been notified otherwise so the original T&C's are still valid as far as I am concerned

I'll worry in about 6-7 weeks if no more bonus points are posted

Same here. I received a postcard and have signed up for the promo on that postcard (and the original promo that started this thread off), but have heard nothing official from Amex ever since. So from my POV I am still on that promo.

 

[beardoc]

So much for:
The promised letters being sent to all customers
The promised phone calls that all customers would receive

Now more rubbish about a 5,000 point limit

Again I signed up to the promo and the T&C's were clear pre 20th September

I haven't been notified otherwise so the original T&C's are still valid as far as I am concerned

I'll worry in about 6-7 weeks if no more bonus points are posted

Thank you for some sense here. I think people here in this thread are the victim of believing that everything in this thead is absolute truth.

 

[lovestotravel]

Thank you for some sense here. I think people here in this thread are the victim of believing that everything in this thead is absolute truth.

No problems, I have said it a few times, but now we have been 2 weeks down the track and no letters sent, even though at least 5-10 people were promised them

Then the "everyone will get a phone call to explain the situation" at least 3 people started that one off.

Now we are having the 5,000 point cap rumor.

The ONLY facts are:
The FAQ on the website
People reporting (I have seen this for a fact though) that some points have been taken off them with POC as the note in their MR

Once agian wake me in 7 weeks

 

[Happy Dude]

snip....

Just to take your moronic argument further by way of example:

I was planning to redeem my membership rewards points accrued during this promotion for the “prize” of a Victa “Hawk” lawn mower. Others may wish to convert their MR points to QFF or Velocity rewards, but not me, as the missus keeps reminding me, my lawn needs mowing .

Unfortunately it appears that I will be capped retrospectively and I won’t earn enough points to redeem for the lawn mower. Dang. But at least the grass will be relieved to hear it. The missus, well, not so much.

But wait! Now you’re saying that because AMEX has a gaming license and Victa have offered the “Hawk” as a prize, I have legal recourse against them all and that ASIC will “extract enforceable undertakings to force amex into giving the bonuses” under the Fair Trading Act and the Consumer Credit Code.

Does anyone have the number for the Victa complaints department?

It’d be completely farcical if it weren’t so funny (or vice-versa). So vet, for the love of God, please stop posting that the third parties associated with AMEX are in ANY way liable in this promotion.

 

[vet]

This promotion is not a game of chance. There are no prizes. There is no gaming permit. It has nothing to do with Virgin Blue. It has nothing to do with Qantas.

The Permit Numbers and Amex as the Promoter appear in "Subject to the terms and conditions of the Membership Rewards program. The redemption of points will be administered solely by American Express and will take 1 business day to transfer. Competition commences 9/07/2008 at 00:01 (AEST) and closes 30/09/2008 at 23.59 (AEST). Authorised under NSW Permit No. LTPS/08/05912, VIC Permit No. 08/2691, A.C.T. Permit No. TP 08/02481, SA T08/2538. The Promoter is American Express Australia Limited (ABN 92 108 952 085) ® Registered Trademark of American Express Company."

Anyway after involving the commission, mr points and bonuses that were recovered by amex were returned. Has anyone with clawed back points got them back into the ff account?

 

[oz_mark]

The Permit Numbers and Amex as the Promoter appear in "Subject to the terms and conditions of the Membership Rewards program. The redemption of points will be administered solely by American Express and will take 1 business day to transfer. Competition commences 9/07/2008 at 00:01 (AEST) and closes 30/09/2008 at 23.59 (AEST). Authorised under NSW Permit No. LTPS/08/05912, VIC Permit No. 08/2691, A.C.T. Permit No. TP 08/02481, SA T08/2538. The Promoter is American Express Australia Limited (ABN 92 108 952 085) ® Registered Trademark of American Express Company."

This has absoultely nothing whatsoever to do with the promotion being discussed in this thread.

 

[straitman]

Same here. I received a postcard and have signed up for the promo on that postcard (and the original promo that started this thread off), but have heard nothing official from Amex ever since. So from my POV I am still on that promo.

... and you haven't been POC'd either :!: :shock:

Thank you for some sense here. I think people here in this thread are the victim of believing that everything in this thead is absolute truth.

A few, but I'm sure most have more sense :!:

The Permit Numbers and Amex as the Promoter appear in "Subject to the terms and conditions of the Membership Rewards program. The redemption of points will be administered solely by American Express and will take 1 business day to transfer. Competition commences 9/07/2008 at 00:01 (AEST) and closes 30/09/2008 at 23.59 (AEST). Authorised under NSW Permit No. LTPS/08/05912, VIC Permit No. 08/2691, A.C.T. Permit No. TP 08/02481, SA T08/2538. The Promoter is American Express Australia Limited (ABN 92 108 952 085) ® Registered Trademark of American Express Company."

Anyway after involving the commission, mr points and bonuses that were recovered by amex were returned. Has anyone with clawed back points got them back into the ff account?

I think It's time that a few people contact the moderators to hose down this sort of hysteria :!:

 

[nlagalle]

I am sure everyone has been very patient. It has been a long 3 weeks of waiting for some sort of decent explanation from Amex, in some kind of formal/written way, addressed to each one of us. It looks like they either don't care or want to clarify what is our situation. It is more convenient for them to keep us scared of what their interpretation of the T&C will be. In this way we will not reach for Unlimited points any further, and just be satisfied with any deal better than the given to the post-20Th.

:mrgreen::mrgreen: nlagalle you will have to wait another 1000 posts more :mrgreen::mrgreen:

rodgerbranch,

The "freeze" happened around 2 weeks ago for a start. And why do you feel the need that they must contact each and everyone one of us. They have stated on the website if you registered prior to the 20th, you are on the old T&C. simple.. I wouldn't believe what a CSR tells you at the moment simply because none have said the same thing twice it seems.

I'm just going to continue to spend as I normally do and wait out the 8-10 weeks or so and see what gets posted to my MR account.