A320 German-wings accident in Southern France

[Mattg]

For that or Malcolm Fraser, the Harbour Bridge flags are at half mast as well.

You might be right. I heard that the flags at AB and 4U HQs were at half-mast so assumed it was for the same reason at QF.

 

[drron]

It seems the airline was aware of his medical situation based on the following report.

Claims killer Alps pilot Lubitz had just been dumped before Germanwings crash | Daily Mail Online

That article does not say the airline was aware of his past problems when he joined.It says he passed the airlines psychological tests they conducted.

 

[Ansett]

Germanwings crash: Andreas Lubitz profile - the most abnormal thing about the Airbus co-pilot was that he appeared so totally normal

Lufthansa, the Germanwings parent company, said his flying abilities were exemplary although he broke off his training for six months for “medical reasons” that were not fully explained. It did not elaborate, citing “medizinische Schweigeplicht” (medical confidentiality). A woman who went to the same school as Lubitz told the Frankfurter Allegemeine that he had a “burnout six years ago” but had appeared healthy at Christmas.
Lufthansa’s chairman, Carsten Spohr, told a press conference in Cologne that Lubitz had undergone normal training and medical tests and that nothing had led the company to suspect he was ill-suited for the job. Authorities added that he had no known links to terror groups. “We can only speculate what caused the co-pilot to do this,” Mr Spohr said. “I can only say that somebody who deliberately takes himself and 149 others to their deaths is guilty of more than just suicide.”

 

[MEL_Traveller]

So... Qantas' media release on this matter...

Comments – to be attributed to Qantas Group spokesman​

The safety and health of customers and employees is the Qantas Group’s number one priority.


We have a comprehensive safety management system that guards against risks to our operations. This includes multi-layered systems to protect the flight deck on our aircraft.


We are monitoring the information coming out of the French investigation and considering if any changes to our existing safeguards are needed. This includes discussions with regulators.


Background on pilot health and safety
Psychometric testing is carried out as part of the recruitment process for pilots.


Periodic aeromedical tests are carried by doctors out once a year for pilots under 40 years old and every six months for pilots over 40.


Ongoing formal and informal performance monitoring is carried out for all pilots, and intended to identify any potential issues that may affect a pilot’s performance.


All pilots must complete regular Crew Resource Management training, which among other things includes training in stress management, teamwork, communication and behavioural awareness.


Like all employees, pilots have access to confidential counselling services and safety reporting channels.

Translation... removing the spin:

Qantas has the same or similar locking override system on its aircraft.
Qantas is not going to follow the lead of other airlines, at this stage, to require two people at all times on the flight deck.
Psychometric testing is only carried out at the time of recruitment, and not after that.

 

[amaroo]

Change is coming ... Air NZ changes coughpit rules

Air New Zealand is changing its coughpit rules in line with other international airlines after the Germanwings crash in France.It comes after French prosecutors said the co-pilot of Germanwings flight 9525 'intentionally' crashed the jet into the side of a mountain in the French Alps earlier this week.
Authorities say recordings from inside the coughpit show Andreas Lubitz initiated the plane's descent while alone at the controls, refusing to open the locked coughpit door for the pilot, who was believed to have gone to the toilet.
There was no immediate clue as to the motive.
The revelations have prompted airlines around the world to apply a rule requiring two crew members to be in the coughpit if one of the pilots leaves for any reason.
On Friday Air New Zealand chief flight operations and safety officer Captain David Morgan said it would make the same changes to its procedures effective immediately.
- See more at: Air NZ changes coughpit rules

 

[knasty]

I still feel safer with 1, 2, 3 or 4 tech crew up the front of most airlines than I do driving in Sydney traffic. You can never remove the risk of the .001% who want to do things like this intentionally (or through mental illness). There is a much higher percentage of people that do things stupidly. I am much more concerned about eradicating the cause of AF447 than this tragic event.

 

[amaroo]

I feel extreme sadness the passengers had to witness this..

Germanwings flight 4U9525 crash: captain reportedly tried to force way through coughpit door with axe: http://www.smh.com.au/world/germanwings-flight-4u9525-crash-captain-reportedly-tried-to-force-way-through-coughpit-door-with-axe-20150327-1m9oda.html

They say the coughpit flight recorder shows the captain repeatedly knocked and tried to get back in as the plane went into its fatal descent.

However, German daily Bild reported on Friday that he also tried using an axe to break down the armoured door.

Germanwings has confirmed an axe was on board the aircraft.

The budget carrier said on Thursday it was also equipped with a video surveillance system that allowed someone wanting to enter the coughpit to be identified.

"Only a pilot inside can unlock the door," a spokesperson added.

The system was widely adopted after planes were used in the September 11 attacks that killed almost 3000 people in New York and Washington.

 

[dodgeyhack]

Change is coming ... Air NZ changes coughpit rules

Meh.
You've got to be pretty committed to crash a fully loaded airliner.
Sure, you'll take the easiest option - it seems in this case that was to wait until the other pilot is off in the loo. But if that's not an option, you could always overpower the FA or even the captain. They can't fight back AND regain control of the plane.
If this really is a case of a lone pilot locking out the other pilot and crashing the plane intentionally, then the only way to stop it is to make sure the pilot isn't behind the controls at all.

I wouldn't be surprised if the FA in the coughpit in the US is more to assist the pilot in the coughpit in case anything happens to the pilot in the cabin - e.g. some evil terrorist grabs them and tries to force them to open the coughpit door.

In phases of flight where the captain is likely to go to the toilet, even if the pilot remaining has a heart attack or some medical condition that renders them unable to operate the aircraft, the plane is still going to fly itself until the captain gets back.

I agree it can't hurt to have an FA in the coughpit, but don't think it'll be some major boon to safety. Actually I don't think it'll make any difference at all, although it probably makes some feel more comfortable flying in light of this recent accident.. If Qantas are currently in the situation where a single pilot can be in the coughpit and aren't changing this, then I think that backs up this statement.

 

[anat0l]

I agree it can't hurt to have an FA in the coughpit, but don't think it'll be some major boon to safety. Actually I don't think it'll make any difference at all, although it probably makes some feel more comfortable flying in light of this recent accident.. If Qantas are currently in the situation where a single pilot can be in the coughpit and aren't changing this, then I think that backs up this statement.

Read again. Some of your fellow passengers here think that if it's of little effort to do, then it should (read: must) be done. Even if it makes little to no difference (assumed it actually won't decrease the safety or increase risks). Yes, it may just be for "comfort" (despite this board countless times rebutting many 'irrational' remarks that have no basis in compromising safety and yet may not be about "comfort").

Your view that Qantas not acting immediately in light of this incident is not supported here - indeed, it is viewed that Qantas are actually, negligently putting their customers at risk.

 

[AdMEL]

Firstly, I feel for for everyone involved. I've never been 100% ok with flying, though I love it.

I'm trying to decide where I sit with respect to a (possible) solution - haven't figured that out yet.

An interesting observation I will make:

On a NZ flight MEL-AKL a couple of weeks ago, whilst I was sitting in row 1, the pilot or co-pilot came out of the coughpit to use the toilet and whilst he was doing so, a flight attendant stood in front of the door to the coughpit. Observed this twice - have never seen it before.

 

[Ansett]

Have seen this many many many times on Qantas cant speak for NZ as never fly them after the Ansett debacle

 

[drron]

You need to fly on AA.An FA goes into the coughpit and the other FA in the F cabin often blocks the aisle with a food/drinks cart.

 

[RooFlyer]

On a NZ flight MEL-AKL a couple of weeks ago, whilst I was sitting in row 1, the pilot or co-pilot came out of the coughpit to use the toilet and whilst he was doing so, a flight attendant stood in front of the door to the coughpit. Observed this twice - have never seen it before.

It is pretty common these days . On United States airlines they will clear out the entire forward galley/toilet area of pax and bar the way with a trolley.

QF and VA dom also bar the way with a trolley and/or a crew member. Sometimes its subtle (as it should be). On the US airlines, its not subtle!

 

[TomVexille]

On the US airlines, its not subtle!

I think it's so that they are "seen" to be doing the right thing.

 

[amaroo]

It is pretty common these days . On United States airlines they will clear out the entire forward galley/toilet area of pax and bar the way with a trolley.

QF and VA dom also bar the way with a trolley and/or a crew member. Sometimes its subtle (as it should be). On the US airlines, its not subtle!

Perfect for reducing the threat from passenger - totally useless against a homicidal pilot! Geez, just make it happen already!

 

[medhead]

Read again. Some of your fellow passengers here think that if it's of little effort to do, then it should (read: must) be done. Even if it makes little to no difference (assumed it actually won't decrease the safety or increase risks). Yes, it may just be for "comfort" (despite this board countless times rebutting many 'irrational' remarks that have no basis in compromising safety and yet may not be about "comfort").

Your view that Qantas not acting immediately in light of this incident is not supported here - indeed, it is viewed that Qantas are actually, negligently putting their customers at risk.

Fortunately, the opinion of most others here about safety is meaningless and can safely be ignored. Still this sounds very much like putting a lead apron on the abdomen of a pregnant patient having a chest X-ray. It does next to nothing to protect baby, but it makes people feel safe.

 

[dodgeyhack]

Meh = Indifference; to be used when one simply does not care.

I'd suggest this is not the topic to use this expression ... are you a troll?

I am indifferent to the response of those airlines who are changing their procedures to ensure multiple crew members are in the coughpit at all times.
That should have been pretty clear from the quote I included. I don't see how you can think that this would be trolling.

Your view that Qantas not acting immediately in light of this incident is not supported here - indeed, it is viewed that Qantas are actually, negligently putting their customers at risk.

Some may view it that way but I don't.
Anyway, as I said, I don't disagree with the practice - it can't hurt. But it won't make any difference to my general feeling of safety on board an airliner.

 

[AdMEL]

Have seen this many many many times on Qantas cant speak for NZ as never fly them after the Ansett debacle

Last time I flew QF was a couple of years ago and it was international Y exit row, nowhere near the coughpit! Can't remember the last time I flew QF domestic.

Haven't noticed it in VA or JQ - maybe it is more subtle.

I take it you don't fly VA either then?

You need to fly on AA.An FA goes into the coughpit and the other FA in the F cabin often blocks the aisle with a food/drinks cart.

Have flown AA a couple of times, but again only Y nowhere near coughpit!

It is pretty common these days . On United States airlines they will clear out the entire forward galley/toilet area of pax and bar the way with a trolley.

QF and VA dom also bar the way with a trolley and/or a crew member. Sometimes its subtle (as it should be). On the US airlines, its not subtle!

Always in Y exit row nowhere near coughpit have never noticed it.

 

[straitman]

A third person may not be able to stop them, but certainly raise the alarm for immediate assistance.

Matt

Perfect for reducing the threat from passenger - totally useless against a homicidal pilot! Geez, just make it happen already!

You are still overlooking the obvious that jb747 pointed out. That is that a pilot can, if he wishes, make the a/c go out of control very quickly. In this case for example all he had to do IF they were actually gaining entry into the coughpit is increase the rate of descent and hit the ground a whole lot quicker.

There are many ways to quickly disable an aircraft. This is a statement of fact NOT of opinion.

 

[amaroo]

You are still overlooking the obvious that jb747 pointed out. That is that a pilot can, if he wishes, make the a/c go out of control very quickly. In this case for example all he had to do IF they were actually gaining entry into the coughpit is increase the rate of descent and hit the ground a whole lot quicker.

There are many ways to quickly disable an aircraft. This is a statement of fact NOT of opinion.

This is why they created "aviation authorities" - pilots fly, others make the decisions.