Abbott in Government

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Debating what is 'better' fraud now? Oh dear! :oops:

Just me, but given the history of all sides of Parliament having former members who have played very fast and loose with the public purse, isn't this all very loaded when trying to score points.

i'd rather commend those (from any side) who saw public office as a chance to add to our communities (not discuss those who just saw us as mugs waiting to be shaken down).
 
Re: Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

I didn't get into that fraud debate much so have no issues with any of it.

There's that glass shattering again.
 
Debating what is 'better' fraud now? Oh dear! :oops:

Just me, but given the history of all sides of Parliament having former members who have played very fast and loose with the public purse, isn't this all very loaded when trying to score points.

i'd rather commend those (from any side) who saw public office as a chance to add to our communities (not discuss those who just saw us as mugs waiting to be shaken down).

Yes. It's very loaded. Hence my comment that there are good and bad people on both sides. Plenty of examples of poor behaviour that doesn't care what side of the political divide they come from.
 
Yes. It's very loaded. Hence my comment that there are good and bad people on both sides. Plenty of examples of poor behaviour that doesn't care what side of the political divide they come from.

Not a comment directed at anyone really Pushka, but I'm glad you see why it caused me to grin lol. There are no heroes in that battle lol.

The whole car 'industry' debate you mentioned is an interesting one too - with deeply murky waters. It's always sad to see things fall, and this one was a long time coming - afraid short term gains mentality killed the industry.
 
The whole car 'industry' debate you mentioned is an interesting one too - with deeply murky waters. It's always sad to see things fall, and this one was a long time coming - afraid short term gains mentality killed the industry.

Bad management (at least from the perspective of making and selling cars - they did manage to milk hundreds of millions from the public purse fairly skillfully) and the high dollar killed the car industry.
 
Bad management (at least from the perspective of making and selling cars - they did manage to milk hundreds of millions from the public purse fairly skillfully) and the high dollar killed the car industry.

Previous governments tried to steer the car industry into diversifying and relying less on large V6/8 cars but I think the US car markers made their minds up long ago.
 
What's happened to the car industry in Oz is an example of what unlimited 457 visas would do for local employment in many industries.
 
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Fraud allegations now referred to AFP.

Fraud allegations levelled against a recently retired Liberal Party MP will be evaluated by the Australian Federal Police.
A package of classified documents has been mailed to the AFP containing details of tens of thousands of dollars worth of allegedly fraudulent taxpayer-funded payments made to the wife of Alex Somlyay, a senior MP who retired at the September election after 23 years in Federal Parliament.

Mr Somlyay's ''relief staffing budget'' states his wife worked 270 days or 2030 hours between September 2012 and December 2013. Yet halfway through his wife's alleged period of employment - on June 24, 2013 - Mr Somlyay gave his farewell speech to the House of Representatives. The month after Mr Somlyay announced his retirement his wife received a pay rise.
Documents obtained by Fairfax Media show that on July 1, 2013, the salary of Jennifer Donovan increased from $64,085 to $78,844. She was employed on that salary as Mr Somlyay's researcher until December 9, 2013 - four months after he stopped doing committee work.
Mr Somlyay billed taxpayers $69,157.15 for his wife's employment during 2012-13 alone.
 
So allegations about a retired politician who is never going to be part of Tony Abbott's government is on topic but discussion of Bill Shorten's false comments about the Abbott government are not for this discussion.Well,well.

And the promise to stop the boats looks like being delivered much earlier than I would have thought-
The head of Indonesia's military says he reached a private agreement with the Chief of the Australian Defence Force to accept boat turn-backs as a way to defuse the diplomatic row over the policy.
General Moeldoko said late on Tuesday that boat turn-backs by Australia were ''justifiable'' as he had spoken to Australia's military commander on the issue - apparently referring to Chief of the Defence Force General David Hurley.
''He told me that Indonesia should understand if Australia drove back undocumented migrants attempting to enter the country using Indonesian boats or if any Indonesians were found aboard,'' General Moeldoko said. ''I have agreed. Therefore, we don't need to feel offended.''

Read more: Indonesian military head says boats turned back will be accepted
 
I am glad we are defending our borders now.
It has to be our choice on immigration and not boat smugglers wallets.
 
Re: Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

Drron, you know relevant issues that demonstrate that Abbott is keeping his election promises are going to be ignored. I posted something similar a few days ago but they want to bang on about something else.
 
I don't believe it was "stop the boats (from coming)", the only concern is "stop the boats (from arriving)" and I'd mark that one as a pass.

It was "stop the boats" full stop. For operational reasons we don't know whether this is happening or not.
 
It was "stop the boats" full stop. For operational reasons we don't know whether this is happening or not.

I'm sure Bill Shorten could find out what's happening & I don't hear him banging on about it so my guess is it's working.
 
I'm sure Bill Shorten could find out what's happening & I don't hear him banging on about it so my guess is it's working.

"Stop the boats" is a slogan by morons - for morons, so in that respect it's working great!

Unfortunately the issue is a tinsy bit more complex and I will try to explain in simple terms.

Many people want to come to Australia - it's a nice country with an excellent standard of living and lots of opportunities. And the way that capitalism works, Australia wants people to come to feed the growth engine. But of course you need the "right" people in the "right" amounts. This has been the bone of contention ever since the First Fleet arrived and unfortunately we haven't really moved on much since then (though we stopped using un-PC terms like "White Australia Policy" some years back).

The preferred method is for people to apply and for us to accept them - this goes for all categories, including refugees. Of course not everyone follows the rules (e.g. - Pommy cricket fans, scared diplomats, etc.) and this is where the ugly side of Australia comes to the fore. It's all down to HOW they arrive.

Let me be blunt here - I don't think anyone wants to see people drowning at sea, suffocating in shipping containers, or dropping out of the undercarriage of a 747. Even the Greens. The issue is how you deal with all categories of arrivals in a way that is fair and consistent and discourages unsafe methods of arrival. There's a very, very simple way to do this that is already in place, but that seems to have been forgotten in the hysteria.

All individuals without a visa (arrivals or over-stayers) should be processed in Australia and either immediately sent home or resettled in PNG, Malaysia, or any other country in the region that we can come to an agreement with. Once there they can apply through the usual channels (including UNHCR) to come to Australia.

Ideally we would fix the relationship with Indonesia and get cooperation from them, but that would rely upon good diplomacy.


This is really just a slightly tweaked version of what was put in place before Despicable T came into power and lowered the bar to sub-gutter levels, but I think including Pommy cricket fans is fair and balanced.

Oh - and if past corruption is irrelevant we would have to drop all charges against Ebeid, Macdonald, Thompson, etc. I think that would be a bad idea, don't you? It's bad enough that politicians can just pay back thousands of dollars in rorts with no questions asked (in most cases).
 
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Oh - and if past corruption is irrelevant we would have to drop all charges against Ebeid, Macdonald, Thompson, etc. I think that would be a bad idea, don't you? It's bad enough that politicians can just pay back thousands of dollars in rorts with no questions asked (in most cases).


Agreed, paying back is just not good enough. I'd sack them. It would also leave a few blanks on both sides, including the former PM.
 
Oh dear Moody context is important.I did not say discussing the allegations against mr.Somylay should not be discussed here but the fact that those on the left think it is but not Mr.Shorten's comments on TA's government.
And by the way I don't think Obeid and cronies should be discussed here as they were part of a State ALP government and this thread is about Tony abbott's government.
 
Oh dear Moody context is important.I did not say discussing the allegations against mr.Somylay should not be discussed here but the fact that those on the left think it is but not Mr.Shorten's comments on TA's government.
And by the way I don't think Obeid and cronies should be discussed here as they were part of a State ALP government and this thread is about Tony abbott's government.

Sorry - I missed something here. Who said that the Opposition leader's comments are off-limits for discussion? And the point I was making about corruption is that if you don't deal properly with the past you are unlikely to improve things for the future. The same concept is currently being applied to institutional child abuse, for example. I merely cited Obeid and co as they are examples of right-wing Labour rorters that we all agree should be held to account, regardless of when the offences took place. Despicable T as a matter of principle should ensure that the proper action is taken against all those accused of corruption whilst they were members of parliament, don't you think?
 
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