Another VA low point - denied meet lounge access

[Deleted member 29185]

I must of misinterpreted these quotes then .

Yes you did. I am certainly not the least bit interested in VA (I'm not sure why you could have misinterpreted that, but you did somehow), nor QF. It's so very easy to cherry pick a few quotes, but harder to find the truth. Go and look and you will find them here on AFF. It's like you asking me to go and look for the Ts&Cs of this debate so you can benefit. Go and look for yourself. Don't expect me to do it for you.

As for the other cherry-picked doozie, I bought a heap of QF J tix because they allowed me to gain QF gold as QF had reneged on their status challenge. It would be a mistake for you to read that as "my undying love for QF". Have you ever heard the saying "hedging ones bets"? It's actually quite apt, as this whole FFer loyalty con is nothing more than a bet. Just today, I took another step in hedging my bets which includes neither VA nor QF but I won't be bothered in revealing whether that works out well or not. As I said, you obviously have not read my posts well enough to comment, but don't let that stop you.

 

[Pleb Status]

Yes you did. I am certainly not the least bit interested in VA (I'm not sure why you could have misinterpreted that, but you did somehow), nor QF. It's so very easy to cherry pick a few quotes, but harder to find the truth. Go and look and you will find them here on AFF. It's like you asking me to go and look for the Ts&Cs of this debate so you can benefit. Go and look for yourself. Don't expect me to do it for you.

I did look for myself and presented clear evidence in my post which showed that you were completely wrong in your argument. I was just giving you the opportunity to present evidence to defend your argument. If you cannot defend your argument with documentation that is not my problem.

If you going to make a lot of noise and not be prepared to back that up with leaving VA for good, what is the point of the rant? They are not going to change otherwise and we cannot do anything about it.

 

[flying_double]

There is no anytime access. You weren't flying. Therefore no access. You can't guest three people if you're not flying, so you couldn't take three beer guzzlers in with you out of spite. Your +1 would have been eligible for arrivals access, but for them only, as there is no guest entitlement for non-status J travel. The only scenario where you might have gained access legitimately was if your +1 is gold or platinum (which your post does not state), in which case you quite rightly had to wait for their arrival before gaining entry (if in fact they are gold or platinum).

You haven't been wronged so stop carrying on like you have. There was not another low point for VA in all of this, just lounge attendants enforcing access rules.

 

[JohnK]

There is no anytime access. You weren't flying. Therefore no access. You can't guest three people if you're not flying, so you couldn't take three beer guzzlers in with you out of spite.

Anytime access still exists. Just find a "friend" that is flying.

 

[Princess Fiona]

I'm with swanning_it here.
The post was not a whine, not a complaint about anything he wasn't entitled to.
It would have cost VA very little if anything and engendered a good sense of customer care if they had allowed him to wait in the lounge whilst waiting for the mrs. I've also asked politely at the SYD VA lounge whilst waiting to pick up my daughter one night if I could wait there and was permitted. It was much appreciated.

The tangential posts about anytime access are just that, tangential. VA does not permit anytime access for Golds and Plats no matter who they are guesting that's flying VA.
Any such access is outside the published T&Cs and shouldn't be permitted IMHO. I think it's very different from asking to wait in the lounge when picking someone up. Neither are technically allowable but the latter is unlikely to affect the bottom line of VA.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

I did look for myself ...If you going to make a lot of noise and not be prepared to back that up with leaving VA for good, what is the point of the rant? They are not going to change otherwise and we cannot do anything about it.

How odd. You clearly did not look for yourself, or you would have not bothered to ask me. Suggesting that I have to "leave VA for good" to entitle me to make an observation is not just ridiculous, but it flies in the face of what AFF is about. Perhaps you've failed to notice, but AFF is built on a premise that flyers (frequent or otherwise) post up experiences, good and bad, for the benefit of other members. You on the other hand, seem to think you can put words in peoples mouths that were not uttered and berate them for posting their honest experiences. I note you do not argue that my experience did not occur. Simply that I have no right to post it. I understand now why you called yourself Pleb Status. Whether VA change their attitude is of no interest to me.

You can't guest three people if you're not flying, so you couldn't take three beer guzzlers in with you out of spite. Your +1 would have been eligible for arrivals access,

Wrong on both occasions. I can guest 3 beer guzzlers in with me and +1 as a non-status J flyer is not entitled to arrivals access AFAIK, but keep in mind that there is nothing consistent with VA policy, so given the day, perhaps you are right.

 

[kpc]

swanning_it.....all airlines are the same unfortunately! This Thursday I'm flying QF to Sin with my elderly parents....I PMed Red Roo twice to see if I could guest both my parents in the QF F lounge in Sydney with me....I have been QF Plat for 7 straight years and have forward QF bookings that will get me Plat for another year...I was hoping that QF could bend the rules this once so I could take both my parents in but have not had even the courtesy of a reply in the +ve or -ve. I hit QF LT Gold in March at which time I'll stop going out of my way to fly QF and just choose airlines that take me to my destination the quickest and in the best comfort....

 

[trippin_the_rift]

I'm torn.

On the one hand - the airline isn't going to send an official update allowing "Gold/Plat may enter the lounge when waiting for their arriving colleague who must be Gold/Plat or in business class." And I can't see a change made being "Lounge agents have absolute discretion on who is allowed, regardless of status or circumstance."

Need to remember that lounge agents are employees, and acting outside company policy could lead to undesired consequences for them so it's understandable why some agents follow the rules to the letter.

Now, on the other hand - the OP case seems legit.

But how could VA standardize access policy to allow for cases like yours, without allowing every other status holder in?
Answer: Lounge invites! Give each Gold/Plat 2-4 anytime passes which can be used to access any VA lounge. Make it 2-hour max per pass.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

swanning_it.....all airlines are the same unfortunately!

In my OP, I was not attempting to, nor implying, that QF were any better. I simply made an observation that what had been permitted in the past with VA, was (on the basis of my single experience) no longer the done thing.

That fact that VA did permit this previously is not disputed in this thread. The fact VA no longer permits this in not disputed in this thread. About the only thing that's disputed is whether I have a right to post up my experience without quite a degree of personal insult, from lying, to being an idiot, to not buying my wife a phone, to being a DYKWIA, to being blacklisted by VA ... all I might say without substance and against the rules of AFF and to what end? I might also say that I was not attempting to guest in 2 people into a first class lounge. I simply asked if I could read a newspaper in a regional lounge whilst I waited for my wife to arrive!

 

[kpc]

Well you posted online for comments, you got some who agreed with you and others who didn't....what did you expect?

 

[Abdul_A350]

Answer: Lounge invites! Give each Gold/Plat 2-4 anytime passes which can be used to access any VA lounge. Make it 2-hour max per pass.

But there will always be someone wanting to take it one step further.

Different cultures, definitely, but it would not occur to me to ask for something knowing I was not entitled to it, let alone get annoyed when refused.

But then I did struggle with eigenvectors the first few times I encountered them.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

Well you posted online for comments, you got some who agreed with you and others who didn't....what did you expect?

What I didn't expect was to be personally attacked for it!

 

[sven89]

Wrong on both occasions.

Swanning_it, are you able to point to where VA supports? Several of us (and admittedly I'm new, so understand if my opinion doesn't hold as much weight) have highlighted that VA's terms and conditions for lounge access clearly state that you must be holding a boarding pass for same day travel. But above, you're adamant that flying_double is wrong in saying you can't access the lounge "if you're not flying".

As you were not travelling that day, VA's terms and conditions, as of 2012, make it quite clear that you are not entitled to any access to the lounge.

I think we've shown that VA acted completely within their published terms and conditions and as unfortunate and disappointing as it is, you were simply not entitled to access.

Now, whether those terms and conditions should be changed to return anytime access, to allow for situations exactly as you found yourself in, is a whole different conversation. I actually agree that anytime access for status flyers should be brought back, allowing them access to the lounge if they're waiting to collect someone, or seeing someone off. But as shown on this board, this benefit hasn't been in play since 2012 so I don't think it's fair to chalk it up as "another low point for VA", as if it's a new thing.

Unless you can show T&Cs indicating you were eligible for access, VA were simply upholding their publicly available access policy.

 

[kpc]

What I didn't expect was to be personally attacked for it!

I've reread the posts....I don't see it that way and I assume the moderators haven't either, otherwise those posts would have been edited / deleted.

 

[Quickstatus]

Loyalty is unidirectional

 

[RooFlyer]

<snip>
But how could VA standardize access policy to allow for cases like yours, without allowing every other status holder in?
Answer: Lounge invites! Give each Gold/Plat 2-4 anytime passes which can be used to access any VA lounge. Make it 2-hour max per pass.

Lounge operators always reserve themselves the right to refuse access to anyone, even if they are perfectly entitled, for 'operational' reasons. Therefore they would have the discretion to let some-one in, not otherwise entitled. I would hope that discretion is made very rarely, but it should be possible and as Princess Fiona has said, it HAS occurred.

Lounge passes a very good idea but too sensible for our airlines to embrace.

 

[Abdul_A350]

Unless you can show T&Cs indicating you were eligible for access, VA were simply upholding their publicly available access policy.

Yes.

And please also look at it from the perspective of the people [wo]manning the front desk. It is a little much to expect them to be required to perform the role of rabbi or imam or figure skating judge or boundary umpire in ruling just how great a transgression is permissible. Even in a 'regional' airport where they presumably have nothing else to do but watch the tumbleweeds blow by, while outside there is no newspaper shop nor place to read.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

Swanning_it, are you able to point to where VA supports? Several of us (and admittedly I'm new, so understand if my opinion doesn't hold as much weight) have highlighted that VA's terms and conditions for lounge access clearly state that you must be holding a boarding pass for same day travel. But above, you're adamant that flying_double is wrong in saying you can't access the lounge "if you're not flying".

As you were not travelling that day, VA's terms and conditions, as of 2012, make it quite clear that you are not entitled to any access to the lounge.

I think we've shown that VA acted completely within their published terms and conditions and as unfortunate and disappointing as it is, you were simply not entitled to access.

Now, whether those terms and conditions should be changed to return anytime access, to allow for situations exactly as you found yourself in, is a whole different conversation. I actually agree that anytime access for status flyers should be brought back, allowing them access to the lounge if they're waiting to collect someone, or seeing someone off. But as shown on this board, this benefit hasn't been in play since 2012 so I don't think it's fair to chalk it up as "another low point for VA", as if it's a new thing.

Unless you can show T&Cs indicating you were eligible for access, VA were simply upholding their publicly available access policy.

Believe it or not, I disagree that ATA should be brought back. ATA was one of the ridiculous scams that caused VA all kinds of grief. On one hand they were giving status away like lollies at a kids birthday and then they were allowing all and sundry of the disloyal set to arrive, en masse, and demand copious quantities of food and drink whilst flying JQ.

As for your first bit, it's been mentioned and even linked to, that VA were inept at properly describing their offering. It rested with the VA rep here on AFF to clarify many poorly written concerns and these were often classed as unwritten benefits. This is one of them. There are a number. The thing with an unwritten benefit is that they can change it at a whim and no one knows until someone posts the experience up here on AFF for the benefit of others. It happens from time to time, but the bull**** that accompanied this thread is over the top. People can argue whether it should or should not be allowed, but all I did was post up an experience and I even went as far as to say it didn't particularly bother me. Make of it as you will. I don't particularly care.

PS... I will point you toward this. As stated, I'm not about to go searching for VAs inclusions, but IIRC it was this part of your sentence that is different

VA's terms and conditions for lounge access clearly state that you must be holding a boarding pass for same day travel

. From memory, the term was not "you". It was simply a BP had to be presented for day of travel by anyone in your group. Have another read, perhaps it has not actually changed!

 

[JohnK]

I've reread the posts....I don't see it that way and I assume the moderators haven't either, otherwise those posts would have been edited / deleted.

I think some of the posts have gone out of their way to attack and or ridicule.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

I think some of the posts have gone out of their way to attack and or ridicule.

I don't think there is any doubt at all, but I'm a big boy. It doesn't worry me in that regard. I do fear though, that if these personal attacks are allowed to continue, AFF and the members will be the losers because people will not post for fear of belittling. Perhaps some may wish to ponder that thought.