Asked to give up your Meticulously Selected Seat when on board.

[mannej]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

Is there an age limit or is physical physique taken into the equation? I posted a few months ago that on a PER-SYD JQ Flight, the 2 older ladies in the exit row with me looked like they had no chance of lifting 5kg, let alone a emergency exit door (which l believe is heavier).

On QF yes

Qantas Seat Selection

 

[oz_mark]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

On QF yes

Qantas Seat Selection

Jetstar have the same list
In The Air - Travel Information - Jetstar Airways

 

[BadgerBoi]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

looked like they had no chance of lifting 5kg, let alone a emergency exit door (which l believe is heavier).

Qantas site says must be able to lift 15kg. Mind you, some of those grannies can pack a whallop - ever tried getting in between an old lady and the "Specials" aisle at Coles?

 

[KateMayo]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

Assuming no buttering up on your side of the story...

Absolutely none.

Actually, given that the OP was fairly benign in the whole context in the first post (i.e. the post just ended with, "I said no"), I thought this thread wouldn't get so long.

My original post was deliberately benign – it was, for the most part, intentionally objective, presenting the facts only. The reader was thereby invited to form their own opinion.

Now had it ended with something like, "The man gave me death stares for the rest of the flight", or "He kept kicking the back of my seat for the rest of the flight," or "He yelled that I was extremely rude and insensitive," or even a personal comment from the OP, then I could think that it would seed a whole lot more in this thread. But there you go.

I don’t know who wanted my seat other than what the CSD told me – which was that he was tall and wanting more leg room. He may have been giving me death stares throughout the flight :shock:, but I don’t know that.

[FONT=&quot]I actually didn’t even start this thread (still finding my way around this place) -- it was initially a comment in this thread:
[/FONT]http://www.australianfrequentflyer....flyer-program/seat-80k-new-a380-qf-16487.html[FONT=&quot]

I’m assuming Serfty, in his infinite wisdom, thought my post might have legs and so moved it to its own thread…[/FONT]

Thanks for taking the time to post your comments, everyone, it's been an interesting discussion.

[FONT=&quot]Please continue...
[/FONT]

 

[JohnK]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

Infants or children under the age of 18 are not permitted to sit in the exit row seats.

That depends on the cabin crew's interpretation of the rules.

I was on a QF flight to/from SIN where 3 teenage girls were sitting in exit row. This is after QF removed the benefit for Platinums to pre-allocate exit rows. Not sure if they paid for the privilege or were allocated the exit rows at check-in but they certainly did not need to sit there and in my opinion would have been of little use had there been an emergency.

 

[superchris]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

Several years ago, I gave up my carefully procured exit row seat in Y on SIN-FRA SQ leg as a family wanted to sit together...and you guessed the new "my" seat was right down the back.
The CSM applauded by compliance and asked me to wait to one side and said follow me after a minute wait...thru J and up to F.
You must sit in the seat requested of you even if it means a downgrade...or in my case super upgrade.
Got slipped a nice bottle of red before departing too

 

[Archphoto]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

For me, it all comes down to my comfort and if I'm happy to do so at the time.

I really hate flying in middle and window seats due to knee problems that aren't helped by sitting in tiny spaces for hours on end. I often have to get up and walk around to relieve the (intense) discomfort plane travel offers when I can't fly J.

I *always* use OLCI (when possible) and choose my seat at the time of booking. On those occasions when I haven't been able to, I've called the Call Centre of the carrier I'm using, and asked politely if I can book a seat over the phone.

If the answer has been "Sorry, you are unable to do so." You can bet I'm at the airport *well ahead of time* to grab an aisle seat - my comfort on anything over 3 hours is non-negotiable.

One the one occasion I've been asked to change seats, it was on a flight from IND-DFW; for some reason a couple had been booked into 2 separate seats upon checkin and he asked if I'd be happy to move. . . . . . forwards! Still a middle seat, but 4 rows ahead of where I was, was fine by me.

I have asked to change seats myself - from a middle to an aisle "If one was available." (I wasn't asking for anyone to move for me, just asking if there was an unoccupied one.) The FA told me she'd look around once we were airborne, and about 20minutes after departure, she indicated a spare aisle seat that was forward; a mother had her kid sitting in it, but it appears she hadn't paid for the seat, so it became mine. :mrgreen:

As an aside, I actually had to call Qantas when I booked 2 seats SIN-BNE as I could allocate my seat (WP - bulkhead aisle 23J) but my partner was Bronze. Needless to say - couldn't book us together online (23J & 23K) and was told I had to move *backwards* to be seated together (48A & 48B) as the "Bulkhead seats are reserved for WP."

I politely informed the QF rep that I was WP and I had expected that being booked on the same ticket would allow for us to be seated together and I wasn't willing to move backwards. A couple of minutes later it was all confirmed and I got the seats I had originally requested.

 

[straitman]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

I don't see how this is all so complicated. And when and whose idea was it to have the vitriol introduced into the thread? I think some people also have to try and contend with the idea that not every unfortunate or negative situation necessitates that at least one person is at fault. It also means that one doesn't have to be at fault to oblige - in this case, we do it because we are human beings.


For what it's worth, I think I agree with most people here in that the decision to move is based on two main facets:

• A human / moral element, i.e. why the move, do you need to move, why should I move or an incomplete combination of those and others
• A comfort / needs or wants element, i.e. why I chose this seat, why I don't want to sit in their seat

For me, I find it hard not to be accommodating to someone with a genuine need, and sometimes that does extend to parents with an infant. I've only had one case so far of being swapped out due to this (see later in this post), but sometimes if I really don't mind even if the seat I get is worse than my seat I will oblige to swap. Yes, it is not my fault that they didn't get themselves "organised" (if you will). (And maybe it isn't their fault either - as someone said, we often assume plainly that the person who is inconveniencing is always at fault and we have a canned reason for it.) But I choose to move anyway at times. Why do I do it "anyway"? Does that make me an idiot or a sucker?

I probably wouldn't swap seats if I'm in a good seat to just to accommodate a family of four to sit together. Having grown up and flown as a young lad in a family of four, there were times when it was either 3 of us (mum/dad plus us 2 kids) sitting together with the 1 in another spot, or we were split 2 and 2. Even a family of 3 I may not move. Family of 5 or more - forget it, unless it meant all the ankle biters (no parents) were sitting next to me and they were unruly (in which case I'll probably swap to get away from the noisy little ankle biters, 'cos I ain't gonna lose my patience and yell at them myself).

My "line" on swapping seats is that I won't swap into a middle seat, but there has been an exception, and probably can be others. Also, I see seat poaching as just plain wrong. Request for a seat swap, if you absolutely must after careful consideration and with a degree of courtesy. But don't just poach my seat and then use that as the seed to start negotiations (those who made a genuine mistake of misreading their BP and/or row number are excepted).

So here are my cases:

• US red-eye flight. A320 Y class. My seat is 5A (pretty lucky - these seats sometimes are "good choice" seats which are levied with a fee); mother and daughter (teenager) board with mother in 5B and daughter in 5F. Mother asks me to swap into 5F - no problem.
  But that's pretty easy - probably all of you would have done that without thinking twice about it.
• FJ to Australia. 744 J class. Travelling with another person, we are seated in row 1. Leg room is huge in this row; I could lazily slouch all the way down in my seat and still not touch the front of the cabin. After take off before the meal, FA approaches me and asks if we want to swap out of row 1 to accommodate a couple who want to use the row for the bassinet. The couple was in row 5 but on this flight row 2 was free. So after checking with my seat mate, we obliged and moved back a row. Not as much leg room in row 2, but it really didn't bother me (still plenty of it!) We could've moved back to row 5 and still be just as good (and for you nuts on boarding and disembarking early, we would've been able to disembark earlier in row 5!)
  Then again, there isn't such a thing as a bad premium seat, is there? (Well, perhaps there are...)
• QF 3 hr domestic flight. 738 Y class. I was in an F seat somewhere behind the window exit rows and there were two gentlemen next to me - I think they were on holiday. Their mate was in 10E - yes, a middle seat - and they asked if I could swap with him. After take off, I decided to oblige with their request. They couldn't thank me enough.
  Was I stupid? I said I would never swap into a middle seat. But their offer of $50 was a little hard to pass up.

I've heard many stories from friends (both on and off the travel forums) of earnestly unreasonable requests for swaps, as well as stories of those who have to try and force a seat poacher out of their seat. In a lot of cases, sanity, common sense and bureaucracy prevails; in other cases, karma can prevail (e.g. had a few stories from friends where their seats have been poached, FAs can't convince the poacher to move, so friend is instead moved into the next best class of service, and the story often ends that the poacher ends up disgusted with the action and now feels "robbed" for some perverted reason).


Now the short answer to the OP:

Assuming no buttering up on your side of the story, then there was no reason for you to oblige to move except out of kindness. However the reasons given do not suggest that the person who wanted your seat had any great reason to ask for it.

Actually, given that the OP was fairly benign in the whole context in the first post (i.e. the post just ended with, "I said no"), I thought this thread wouldn't get so long. Now had it ended with something like, "The man gave me death stares for the rest of the flight", or "He kept kicking the back of my seat for the rest of the flight," or "He yelled that I was extremely rude and insensitive," or even a personal comment from the OP, then I could think that it would seed a whole lot more in this thread. But there you go.


I should finally add that people will always ask others to swap seats if they are seeking your seat and even if their seats are "unreasonable". Apart from some people not understanding what constitutes a more "unreasonable" seat, and the definition of a "reasonable" seat varies from person to person, you can blame this attitude on everyone in life that always offers the adage, "They can only say 'no'" (which I think is a ridiculous bit of advice).

Thanks anat0l for a well written, balanced post.

 

[samiam]

Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board.

I was using the prioroty boarding line, (you know the one, behind all the Y pax)

Love it- that cracks me up!

 

[ozbeachbabe]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

Several years ago (pre olci) my sister and I were flying home from FRA and arrived at the check in to be informed that we could not be sat together. We weren't late and were on the same booking but according to the QF CSA it was all too hard as she was flying to PER from SIN and I was going to SYD. Ironically it had not been to hard for the BA CSA to sort it out on the way there when we were checking in from different airports . The solution proposed to us was that he would sit us near to each other and then we could try to swap on board but when we got to our seats we discovered he had put us both in middle seats needless to say we didn't bother asking anyone to swap as we were pretty sure of what the answer would be.

If you were travelling FRA/SIN/SYD and your sister was travelling FRA/SIN/PER you would not be on the same pnr as itineraries have to be identical to be on the same booking. So in your case it was two single travellers on separate pnrs trying to get seats together.

If you can, it's always a good idea to call the airline before you travel and ask them to cross reference your bookings. Chances are if you'd done this you may have had a better outcome.

Although you say you didn't checkin late, it depends what your definition of late is - 2 hours before, 90 minutes, 60 minutes? Bear in mind that it's no so much a case of what time you checkin but how many people ahead of you have checked in. You also need to consider that there's always passengers to contend with who may have checked in even earlier from another European port and transiting through FRA.

Several years ago the seat editing for international flights was done around 48 hours prior to departure so groups, families, couples & singles whose bookings were cross referenced would have already been pre-allocated seats together prior to them arriving at the airport. It's quite possible some of these people may have even checked in after you.

I don't believe it was "all too hard" for the QF CSA as I'm sure if there were seats together he would have given them to you but it's highly likely that the flight was quite full and the best he could do was getting you as close as possible even though they were middle seats.

It's a good idea before you leave the checkin counter to ask what seat choices you have, if any. If one of you can get an aisle or window somewhere at least you've got a decent seat to swap with another pax. As you didn't look at you boarding passes until you got onboard the aircraft it's a little bit late to do something by then. It's even worth asking at the gate before you board if there are any seats left together in case a couple or family who may have had seats allocated together noshowed.

I wouldn't say it's ironic that BA were able to seat you together on the way over as you're comparing apples and oranges. Every flight is different & it's quite possible that the flight wasn't as full. Bear in mind that the flight you and your sister were on together was the second sector ex SIN not the first flight ex Oz unlike your return ex FRA so the BA CSA had more success getting you seats together as that flight would have been around 8 hours away.

 

[Jobu]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

I have always moved when requested politely by the FA. All I expect is some gratefulness from the benefiting pax and the FAs who should understand the "inconvenience" more.

Alot of people who travel are not FFs and dont always realise that you can preallocate your seat or link your bookings, and would innocently expect that to be taken care of at the airport. I dont hold it against them.

cheers

J

 

[Keith009]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

Alot of people who travel are not FFs and dont always realise that you can preallocate your seat or link your bookings, and would innocently expect that to be taken care of at the airport. I dont hold it against them.

Being able to pre-allocate 'better' seating is a bit like a perk of being a loyal FF IMO, and many airlines like QF make this clear by reserving certain seats for their elite FFs. Hence, my view is that I am quite justified in refusing to move unless encountering various exceptional situations which have been covered in this thread.

 

[ozbeachbabe]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

Although AFAIK parents travelling with children and infants should be able to select forward rows/bulkhead seats where the bassinets are located they wouldn't be able to do this until T-24 when OLCI opens.

However PS and above can pre-allocate seats a T-80 so it's quite likely that even if people with kids do try to get these seats the day before a WP or similar may have already selected 23AB or 23JK.

If a WP is asked to move seats it should never be to their detriment. I know of WPs who have been called on their mobile a couple of hours before the flight departed & one was happy to move from 23A to 23K so a couple with an infant (that was young enough to fit into a bassinet) could sit in 23AB. Another time a WP was happy to move from 23K to 26K if there was a chance of a spare seat next to him. Flight wasn't full so not a problem to block one off.

These are what I call win/win situations but at all times the original holder of the seat in question should be asked politely & not made to feel like an a**ehole if they refuse the request.

I don't think it's fair that people travelling with toddlers (who are technically still classed as infants if under 2) should get a bassinet row when it's clearly not suitable for their child and won't be used. If when checking in they're told that their child is too big for the bassinet they often reply "I know but we like sitting at the bulkhead because there's more room". Well so do WP's & in this instance it's the premium pax who should get priority here.

If there are a number of infants on a flight I believe the pecking order for bassinets should be premium pax with young infants, followed by other pax with infants. In the situation that there's a couple plus infant vs a parent travelling solo with an infant (assuming all pax are NB or no status) I think it's fair the latter gets it so they can get a break during the flight when they don't have to nurse the infant on their lap.

Not everyone requests a bassinet beforehand but it's a good idea to do this so the airline is aware you would like one. A lot of people think you just ask when you get to the airport but often it's too late by then. There are many times also when people travelling with infants are the last pax to checkin so they've got buckleys chance then.

After reading some of the comments above about pax who try to steal seats by sitting there before the rightful owner boards, if I had 80A or 80K on the A380 I'd be at the boarding gate champing at the bit to board first so nobody would even get a chance to nick it otherwise you look like the mean one when you're trying to oust the trespasser.

 

[Timba-Jet]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

I think it is OK to respectfully refuse to swap and stay in your chosen/preferred seat, and not be made to feel guilty for it. But think we should all consider the merit of the request, before declining though.

On the other side, I've been caught out in a pickle once or twice, once by not checking my my boarding pass and assumming i was given my online pre-allocated seat choice, and was one of those people who was asking my next door neighbour if they wanted to swap seats. I would hope fellow passengers would consider my request, instead of ignoring me or looking at me with disdain as happened. I was in middle seat of mid section of 2-3-2, friend was in window seat. I was offering my friends window seat but still no luck.

Also, the average traveller (me until a few years ago and discovering AFF ) probably don't appreciate the importance of pre-planning and be ultra organised, so often find themselves stuck in a hard place in flight. So i say if it aint going to make your comfort onboard, then lets try to help each other out.

 

[FlyboyAl]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

After reading some of the comments above about pax who try to steal seats by sitting there before the rightful owner boards, if I had 80A or 80K on the A380 I'd be at the boarding gate champing at the bit to board first so nobody would even get a chance to nick it otherwise you look like the mean one when you're trying to oust the trespasser.

Wow, I never thought I'd do it but I willingly GAVE UP 80A yesterday :!:

The 380 was so lightly loaded that everyone in the rear cabin had the opportunity to have 3 or 4 seats to themselves. So after take off I moved into the middle rows and after some adjustments with pillows and blankets to fix the lumps and bumps, I had such a good sleep that the FA actually had to wake me for breakfast, and I can't remember how long it is since that has occurred.

The really wierd thing was that the row I started out in was not even used because the armrest on 80A can't be put up

 

[futurism]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

I have been asked to move on a 737, Sydney to Adelaide twice recently.
both times from 4 or 5a to at least row 20, I havent really been given a reason, one time it was 'would you mind' and the other time it was 'you fly every week dont you? you probably understand that sometimes we need to move people'

that one was interesting, because after I was moved I was sat in a window, next to me was a rather rough looking lady, and next to her was an equally rough looking lady clutching a clipboard with a check list titled 'SERCO - work instruction for flight escort' or similar, so I presume I was sat next to someone being escorted between jails.

 

[trippin_the_rift]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

Was asked in the lounge today to move from my carefully chosen seat of 1D, back a row. I politely declined highlighting there was a spare seat next to me and id like to keep it that way. The lounge dragon said the flight was full and there was no spare seats, then proceeded to make me feel guilty for not wanting to help fellow passengers.

This is probably the 5th or 6th time I've had issues with this lady in the bne Dom lounge over the years. Middle aged, blonde woman ... Anyone else had a run in with her?

 

[JohnK]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

This is probably the 5th or 6th time I've had issues with this lady in the bne Dom lounge over the years. Middle aged, blonde woman ... Anyone else had a run in with her?

Front counter or business class counter.

If business class counter and it is the one I am thinking of then she does not appear to be too bad. But then I have not had these type of dealings with them.

Doesn't seem like a fair swap from 1D with spare seat to go back a row. Perhaps they just see us all as cattle (yes, premium passengers as well) and it does not matter where we sit!

 

[BadgerBoi]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

Note that (for example) Qantas permit children under 2YO who are not occupying a seat to travel with their parent free of charge domestically and at 10% of the adult fare Internationally.

For these situations the "Bassinet Position" is useful due more to its bulkhead location than whether the kid can fit in the bassinet. The extra room gives the 'seat-less' infant some additional room to stand and relieve the parent of the need to continually nurse the child.

So they are getting both a free ride (or 90% discount) and more room...
Even more reason for me to refuse a request to move for such reason. For some odd reason, I feel that my comfort is no less important than theirs.

 

[simongr]

Re: Requested to give up your Meticulously Researched and selected Seat when on board

BadgetBoi - have you ever travelled with an infant? Even with more space (e.g. flying international J) there is no element of comfort travelling with 8-12kg of extra weight on your lap.

Also free ride? The kid doesnt take up a seat, gets no meal service and weighs about as much as a piece of carry on - I think on a fee for service basis 10% for int'l is expensive...