Australian Reports of the Virus Spread

[jase05]

And the number of cars speeding and people along the Esplanade tonight for a last night reprieve will not be missed tomorrow.

Going to be delightful driving around tomorrow

 

[RAM]

It just proves that this fantasy of eradication that numerous states have convinced themselves is purely a result of their good work is nothing but pure dumb luck.

The lack of preparation defies belief. As @Lynda2475 points out, surely there are plenty who could've been trained to take swabs in the intervening period, just in case.

No does not defy belief unfortunately, just illustrates the bureaucracy is alive & well.

Anyone who is a threat is moved out & only those that 'agree' or are no threat percolate up over time in many cases.

A bit like everytime there are floods and there's a shortage of equipment, taupaulins etc.

 

[RAM]

The SA CHO was just on TV on The Project saying it is actually 14 days - 6 days super strict (no movement), then another 8 days with lesser restrictions - although they have yet to say what changes on day 7.

Interestingly when PVO asked her why there was no policy to prevent security guard from medi-hotel having a second job in food preparation, she dodged the question. PVO then called out that was a key learning from Vic, again a general comment about hindsight - but is it hindsight when the need to stop preople working between hotels and other sites or multiple aged care facilities was highlighted back in July?

Even before that in NSW with the first nursing home cases as well as the quarantine hotels with one security guard also working at a shopping centre.

Lessons are only learnt by those who listen & realise they don't know everything.

I still would like to know what kind of legislative authority they are using to enforce that no one leave their homes - for ANY reason - other than essential workers?! Bizarre to not allow people out for exercise. Totally lost the plot in this country, even in the UK now with the numbers they have - exercise, fine - with one person from one other household if you wish - with mask on.

I think everyone is a bit surprised about no exercise (is that true?) and takeaways closed, that seems quite harsh, hopefully it will be short and sharp and life can resume to some semblance of normal very quickly, although I expect masks might be there to stay for a while. Best wishes from the rest of us on AFF, although it is still fairly small imposts compared to what many are facing Europe, USA etc, at the moment.

To add - yes - of course I have. But even with those numbers you can still go for a walk which is a basic right in a free country.

What is to be achieved by stopping people from walking their dog?

It's bizarre, it's ill thought out in terms of practicality even if theoretically coming from a good place. In short, it's pretty much insane.

As usual it are the selfish DYKWIA types that cause the problems for the majority.
Exercising for many may just be walking but for others it is running which expels many fold the aerosol droplets - so the risk of cross-contamination is high. How often have you been out walking & some jogger (not all but some) are in such a hurry that they will brush against you & someone walking towards you so they can maintain their pace?
The best protection is to both wear a mask AND eye cover. The large number of doctors & nurses catchin CV in non-CV facing roles early on in Italy & Germany was traced by some 'Agatha Christie-like' observation that 90+% of those with perfect eyesight were getting infected vs only 8-9% of those who wore glasses. A university medical faculty then contacted their graduates & acquaintences to see if the thesis could be confirmed. It was. This was back in March & is believed to be one reason that the German mortality rates were so much lower (& remain so).
'House arrest' for 6 days is unpleasant but is the alternative of 4 months (Melbourne) much worse?

Why the problem with a manual system? Not taking a shot, just genuinely interested ( Tassie based) as I've had limited exposure to the venue recording systems.
Personally, I'd rather take out my pen and note my name and phone number on a piece of paper, rather than engage with dubious data entry on my phone which goes I know not where. In the normal execution of my business, with or without COVID, I enter basic details onto site logbooks multiple times, every day.

Too many morons around.
For months where there was the clipboard - here in Sydney - I'd see Scott Morrison, Gladys, Mickey Mouse amongst other equally helpful IDs.

 

[Lynda2475]

Why the problem with a manual system? Not taking a shot, just genuinely interested ( Tassie based) as I've had limited exposure to the venue recording systems.
Personally, I'd rather take out my pen and note my name and phone number on a piece of paper, rather than engage with dubious data entry on my phone which goes I know not where. In the normal execution of my business, with or without COVID, I enter basic details onto site logbooks multiple times, every day.

Manual system:
1. Requires you to handle clipboard/notebook (and pen if you forget your own) touched by countless others
2. Takes longer than QR if its a place you go regularly, my phone remembers details for return visits
3. Other customers can see your name, phone and email when they sign in, some creepo could easily get your details by signing after you or taking a photo of the sign in page
4. Venue has to retype the sign-ins to submit to contract tracers, poor penmanship can lead to errors
5. No guarantee venue safely disposes of data after 14 days

QR system:
1. No touch
2. Faster as allows you to save details on your device for next viisit, automatically records date and time, return visit checkin takes about 3 seconds.
3. Only the govt or venue (depending on QR provider) have your details, not visible to everyone else who signs in after you.
4. Stored electronically so venue can extract and email list to authorities when required (or goes straight to govt if their code is used).
5. Details are automatically deleted after 14 days.
6. One touch check out. Some venues do this automatically after a set period, but others allow one touch to verify when you left.

In my experience businesses who have gone to effort to organise a code, tend to have better covid safe practices.
They enforce distance requirements, dont have shared condiments, have signage up and floor markers to remind customers where to stand, sanitiser etc

Some cafes/restaurants also have a second QR code sticker on the table which takes you to a online version of the menu, so you dont have to touch printed menus.

 

[davistev]

Does Australia require proof of Covid-19 negative result before boarding these repatriation flights back to Australia? Considering the amount of "imported" cases at hotel quarantine, it would seem that either there are a lot of last minute cases or Australia does not have this as a boarding requirement.

Meanwhile - 11 years on AFF and still an intern.

 

[Flashback]

Does Australia require proof of Covid-19 negative result before boarding these repatriation flights back to Australia? Considering the amount of "imported" cases at hotel quarantine, it would seem that either there are a lot of last minute cases or Australia does not have this as a boarding requirement.

Meanwhile - 11 years on AFF and still an intern.

Not a requirement, hence the 14 day quarantine.

 

[davistev]

mmm! - I just assumed a negative Covid19 result PLUS a 14 day quarantine upon arrival would be the bare minimum needed

 

[love_the_life]

Manual system:
1. Requires you to handle clipboard/notebook (and pen if you forget your own) touched by countless others
2. Takes longer than QR if its a place you go regularly, my phone remembers details for return visits
3. Other customers can see your name, phone and email when they sign in, some creepo could easily get your details by signing after you or taking a photo of the sign in page
4. Venue has to retype the sign-ins to submit to contract tracers, poor penmanship can lead to errors
5. No guarantee venue safely disposes of data after 14 days

QR system:
1. No touch
2. Faster as allows you to save details on your device for next viisit, automatically records date and time, return visit checkin takes about 3 seconds.
3. Only the govt or venue (depending on QR provider) have your details, not visible to everyone else who signs in after you.
4. Stored electronically so venue can extract and email list to authorities when required (or goes straight to govt if their code is used).
5. Details are automatically deleted after 14 days.
6. One touch check out. Some venues do this automatically after a set period, but others allow one touch to verify when you left.

In my experience businesses who have gone to effort to organise a code, tend to have better covid safe practices.
They enforce distance requirements, dont have shared condiments, have signage up and floor markers to remind customers where to stand, sanitiser etc

Some cafes/restaurants also have a second QR code sticker on the table which takes you to a online version of the menu, so you dont have to touch printed menus.

No, there is an issue with point 3. For non government systems it has been seen that the information has been sold on in some cases.
The only info I put on a manual is surname and mobile.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

mmm! - I just assumed a negative Covid19 result PLUS a 14 day quarantine upon arrival would be the bare minimum needed

Assuming those on repatriation flights are citizens, PR or other permanent visas arrangements... Australia can't refuse entry. So the test is a bit of a moot point.

 

[Pushka]

Semaphore types invading Henley Beach?

Semaphore is quite the expensive suburb these days with a fantastic village atmosphere. They have their own beat. These are more like eastern suburbs rich kids .

Anyways, this morning it is so quiet and deserted. Normally full of bikes, dog walkers and joggers. Little guy downstairs looks very confused. No one to bark at.

Post automatically merged: Nov 19, 2020

The CHO stated they are looking to get assistance from other states to provdie more testing staff, surely in all these months they could have trained more nurses (or even medical students) to do swabs? Is performing a swab super specialised?

As part of their training, all nurses are trained to take swabs. At least those in Public Hospitals. My SIL has been doing them for years and has also worked in the FMC covid clinic. I don't understand that comment at all.

 

[Lynda2475]

My understanding is that the recent government sponsored repatriation flights require a negative covid-19 test within 48 hours of departure but that people arriving on commercial flights (so everyone arriving in Sydney, Perth and Brisbane, and most people arriving into SA) do not as a rule, but may vary by airline or transit country.

The negative test requirement is only new, and reports about recent repatriation arrivals from UK and India via Darwin have noted how people have been negative upon boarding but then positive when tested on day 1 of quarantine (which can be 3 days after their pre-flight test).

As others have said we are required to accept Australian citizens under international law, and our government has opted to also accept permanent residents, but govt can ask people delay travel if known to be unwell.

The caps exist to ensure we are not overwhelmed but with Vic and SA refusing arrivals competition for seats is even more fierce, so hard to tell if some might be faking test results.

Most airlines are making you wear a mask and taking temp at boarding, if obviously unwell assume they will refuse to let you board.

 

[Lynda2475]

No, there is an issue with point 3. For non government systems it has been seen that the information has been sold on in some cases.
The only info I put on a manual is surname and

Well ive used non govt systems since May and have not had a single marketing email nor scam call on the details used. As stated before it is easy to set up a new email address specifically for this purpose. Better than every customer being able to get your name and number.

QR sign is mandatory from Monday in NSW if you refuse to use it here then you will be refused service.

 

[davistev]

Assuming those on repatriation flights are citizens, PR or other permanent visas arrangements... Australia can't refuse entry. So the test is a bit of a moot point.

I beg to differ. People who have a communicable disease are deemed "not fit to fly" hence why many countries around the world require a test before flying. No one is saying that Australia is refusing a citizen rather, it is safer and better to travel at a later date once the citizen is no longer a community risk. I think this a huge hole in the current system.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I beg to differ. People who have a communicable disease are deemed "not fit to fly" hence why many countries around the world require a test before flying. No one is saying that Australia is refusing a citizen rather, it is safer and better to travel at a later date once the citizen is no longer a community risk. I think this a huge hole in the current system.

yeah - good point! They could possibly require the test on that basis - health and safety etc. Could get tricky if someone on the repatriation flight was mandated to leave the country because of something like a visa overstay, might be difficult for Australia to deny carriage. But as pointed out above - the negative test within 72 hours isn't really a definite indicator.

 

[Toula92122]

My understanding is that the recent government sponsored repatriation flights require a negative covid-19 test within 48 hours of departure but that people arriving on commercial flights (so everyone arriving in Sydney, Perth and Brisbane, and most people arriving into SA) do not as a rule, but may vary by airline or transit country.

I can confirm that if you are returning to Oz on commercial flights from the USA no CV tests have to be taken pre departure. On board it's masks on all the time. I had disposable masks which I changed every few hours. I have to say I was impressed at the way we were processed from landing at Sydney to our arrival at the quarantine hotel. There are a few tweaks I think would make it quicker and safer. We get tested on day 2 and day 10 whilst in quarantine.

 

[RooFlyer]

Just to lighten things up a bit. Tasmania’s bogan Senator, Jacqui Lambie has happily announced that she stocked up on toilet paper yesterday ( In Tasmania). The Oz:

Tasmanian senator Jacqui Lambie has admitted she “rushed” to buy toilet paper after South Australia went into a six-day lockdown.

“I can see what is going to happen here so I thought I would get in early just in case,” Senator Lambie told the Today show.

“I don’t know if six days will do it or not,” she said.

 

[Pushka]

We now understand why the Police Commissioner didnt seem to be particularly onboard with the significant lockdown announced late yesterday and stated it was the CMO's idea and he initially questioned why it needed to be so strict. His son was supposed to be getting married this Saturday and it's had to be cancelled last minute.

The sadness that the families and friends thinking they were finally in the clear to welcome people from across Australia, hold a large gathering and be able to dance and do all the things you do at weddings, maybe some already here and now stuck, only to be cancelled three days prior.....

And the funerals for people who had died a few days ago and funerals being prepared for the next couple of days only to now be delayed, at least another six days.

 

[RAM]

What stunned me more what that the SA CHO stated on 7:30 tonight the issue with testing capacity wasnt pathology/test processing but having enough qualified staff to adminster the tests!

The CHO stated they are looking to get assistance from other states to provdie more testing staff, surely in all these months they could have trained more nurses (or even medical students) to do swabs? Is performing a swab super specialised?

Sounds like the 'not my responsibility' game has begun. The evidence of what is required to respond has been available since January (Wuhan), February (Italy, Austria, Spain, Germany, France, US, UK), March (Sydney).

Lack of planning on the other hand still seems available in November

Assuming those on repatriation flights are citizens, PR or other permanent visas arrangements... Australia can't refuse entry. So the test is a bit of a moot point.

You missed out the other group (up to 2/3rds on some flights back in June into Melbourne) - close relatives of the above.

Which also explains why so few of the 'stranded Australians' registered with DFAT have made it back since the 18,800 figure was announced back on July 31st. Now the registered figure is above 35,000 despite international arrivals since then numbering over 55,000.

The Fed Govt is playing games one this. The backlog could be solved by simply saying only those registered with DFAT will be allowed entry. Foreign nationals aka close relatives of Aust citizens, or Aust PR holders are not elligible to register. On one repatriation flight in early June over 2/3rds were 'close relatives', including one group numbering in the teens (suspected to be actually people smuggling by official) who only 1 had the phone number of their close relative. Official alerted higher ups to their suspicion, especially as in the end it took nearly 90 minutes before the phone number got answered - higher ups said 'Drop it, you're holding up the transfers!'

 

[Toula92122]

It's been a total eye opener being back and watching TV and seeing CV being handled by adults and decisions being made to actually attempt to control it. There is no CV management in the US. I got so tired of hearing people talking how it was all a hoax, masks make no difference, Trump had a cure, it was no worse than the flu and the total mismanagement at the top, it was extremely stressful. People would not even wear masks though they were mandatory. Interestingly enough since CV the TSA security theatre has toned down, they have actually been nice each time I have flown and suddenly bags aren't passing through the machines 2-3 times because they seem to be able to read the screen.

 

[Pushka]

So the restrictions have been revised an hour ago. Again. And good news for animal lovers is that you can travel to feed your animals if there is no one else to care for them. There are additional services that can be open, like Hardware but Bunnings had shut their stores based on last nights advice. Not sure if they will open now for tradies and click and collect. They really have to provide a service for tradies in emergency situations. Like a broken toilet!