Dear John

[notzac]

Re: Dear John - usa a okay!

Unless they are going to plough a huge amount of cash into capital improvement, the US “no empty premium seats & pay for (basic) lounge access (at major ports only)” loyalty model should be a highly attractive consideration.

Qantas would find it very hard, not to respond in kind, highly impacting the profitability of their model. Surely this is a tactical opportunity where the Blues have little to lose and everything to gain? (Given Premium Economy's anacdotally poor performance.)

The reason whY+ hasn't sold for DJ (at least, certainly not on the flights I've been on) is because it's a rubbish product that isn't worth the asking price. If the food was better and we were in Europe, we'd probably think it was wonderful - if you compare DJ whY+ to many carriers' Euro J, there are a lot similarities. Given the competitions' product, that's obviously not going to cut it.

Given all the noise here and in the press - I'd hazard a guess that the domestic premium product is in the list of things due for overhaul. At least, that's what I'm hoping..

 

[Oneworldplus2]

Re: Dear John - usa a okay!

The reason whY+ hasn't sold for DJ (at least, certainly not on the flights I've been on) is because it's a rubbish product that isn't worth the asking price. If the food was better and we were in Europe, we'd probably think it was wonderful - if you compare DJ whY+ to many carriers' Euro J, there are a lot similarities. Given the competitions' product, that's obviously not going to cut it.

I totally agree. I've only flown J once (on QF and l have to be honest, that was rubbish too. SYD-PER, I can't remember the plane, but it was tiny. Cotton seats that looked like something from 1980! Even on a recent ADL-PER, J didn't look very impressive). BA Short haul J is basically the same as DJ's Premium whY, IMO, a joke. Middle seat closed, on short haul, cleaver marketing, that's for sure. Mind you, the new A330 (PER-SYD/MEL runs) J looks very nice, how it should be. Not that it really effects me, lol.
So, should be interesting times for the Virgin Group in the coming years. New planes on order, a tie up with AIR starting to bear fruit starting on TT routes and an ex QF Director as the new CEO. Might give QF a bit of a shake up? As they say, watch this space!

 

[dk4]

Re: Dear John - location, location, location (upgrade, upgrade, upgrade)

I don’t think that Virgin Blue is about to launch an ultra-premium domestic in-flight product, in the short term. That is not the way the industry is trending at the moment, with regard to short haul flying.

Virgin Blue is not in a position to take on Qantas domestic J, head on. Personally, I doubt they would be able to convert sufficient full paying business from QF (or stimulate new business) to recover the outlay, let alone make a profit from it. (Particularly as Qantas would have a solid response prepared, well modelled and designed to maintain its current business base.)

Qantas has the top of the market momentum at the moment. Don’t forget, amongst other things, Qantas operates three different types of domestic lounges at all of its major south-eastern Australian terminals; Virgin Blue hasn’t got a hope in hell of matching this (let alone surpassing it, in order to encourage customer defection).

Some posts on here are concerned with what Virgin Blue can do to make Qantas pull up its socks, with the sole purpose of ensuring that the poster will have a better experience flying Qantas, rather than make the choice to switch their flying to Virgin Blue. Why would Virgin Blue invest in these initiatives, when there is no expected return?

So, what are some of the barriers to change?

• Qantas Global Alliance reciprocal benefits
• Quantity & Quality of Premium Ground services (beginning with lounges, ending with baggage collection)
• Onboard experiences (from staff flair, to PAYG F&B)
• Irregular operations processes & procedures, Virgin Blue’s ability to cope with network problems in real time or even proactively when compared with Qantas
• Virgin Blue’s inflexibility, regarding ticket rules, with taking ownership of problems when things go wrong due to non-mechanical situations, does not endear them to customer relationship building
• No cheaper all-inclusive fare options (from checked bags to onboard entertainment)
• People already committed financially to banking with a QFF partner, and now even the weekly grocery shopping
• QFF points upgrade systems
• Qantas corporate account management savvy

For those not experienced with Virgin Blue Premium Economy or Qantas Domestic Business, see Flyertalk - TWO TAILS

I would contend that, adding a written status benefit to Velocity, confirming complimentary P.E. upgrades, when seats were left empty after check-in has closed, (e.g. an upgrade monitor screen ranking at the gate, perhaps with rank based on status, fare bucket then ticket date of purchase) would be the single most effective tactic for Virgin Blue to grow their business.

Sure, I think that there should be a few minor changes to P.E. as well. But this tactic is unlikely to cannibalise much existing business (as their doesn’t seem to be any), and leaves the door wide open to evolve a new domestic class beyond P.E., at some future point (if required) for the cream at the top of the market. (One not tainted by the “upgrade process”.)

 

[Oneworldplus2]

Re: Dear John - location, location, location (upgrade, upgrade, upgrade)

...Might give QF a bit of a shake up?

Some posts on here are concerned with what Virgin Blue can do to make Qantas pull up its socks, with the sole purpose of ensuring that the poster will have a better experience flying Qantas, rather than make the choice to switch their flying to Virgin Blue. Why would Virgin Blue invest in these initiatives, when there is no expected return?

I was more trying to point out that customers might be on the receiving end of better benefits with more competition, that's all dk4.
Example; If DJ allowed DJ Silvers access to Australian Domestic Lounges, would QF offer more to QF Silvers (OW Ruby), than an 1 time QP entry that comes with achieving that milestone? (CX Marco Polo Silver's (OW Ruby) get access to Dragon Air Lounges)
Cathay Pacific - Frequent Flyers : The Marco Polo Club > Club Benefits

 

[pauly7]

Re: Dear John - location, location, location (upgrade, upgrade, upgrade)

Qantas corporate account management savvy

I think this is actually a cornerstone of DJ's issue. QF still has 80% of the business market. 80%! Until DJ get a decent slice of this, how can they extract the premium to warrant the corresponding benefits we are all asking for.

I guess you could argue it the other way though, its because DJ don't have these benefits and services in the first place that they don't attract these accounts and passengers.

Its a bit chicken and egg but I think if they want it - a bit of capex is going to have to flow!

 

[scibo10]

Branding. I've heard plenty of rumours suggesting a change is imminent here, but 4 different brands? Why? Just call the whole lot V Australia, paint the fleet in that awesome VA livery (personally not a fan of the red jet thing) and be done with it.

I agree with this view. After 10 years of DJ embedded as a low cost carrier in peoples' minds, I think it is will be a hard sell for people to view it as a true competitor to QF, even if DJ continue to upscale their product (which I feel they are doing).

VA is seen as a premium full service offering, and if this branding is implemented domestically (even if it does fall short of full-service, such as US legacy carriers for example), it would be taken more seriously. This would leave DJ or another rebranded name to compete directly with Jetstar or Tiger. Surely one brand would also save on administrative and operating costs.

I also agree that the VA livery on domestic fleet would look awesome.

 

[jsd]

Is the 'Virgin' part of Virgin Blue under a licensing agreement similar to Virgin Mobile Aus?


Josh

 

[medhead]

[*]Quantity & Quality of Premium Ground services (beginning with lounges, ending with baggage collection)

On paper they might have a premium baggage service. But in practice the premium service is nothing short of a joke. The priority tags do not work. All they do is make you look like a wanka to other pax when you pick up your bag. Mainly because of the large number of non priority tagged bags that come out before your bag. One would probably be better off without the tag as then you'd have a better chance of getting your bag early.

 

[oz_mark]

On paper they might have a premium baggage service. But in practice the premium service is nothing short of a joke. The priority tags do not work. All they do is make you look like a wanka to other pax when you pick up your bag. Mainly because of the large number of non priority tagged bags that come out before your bag. One would probably be better off without the tag as then you'd have a better chance of getting your bag early.

I know people keep saying this about Qantas baggage handling, but my experience is that on average a bag with a priority tag will come out before a non tagged bag. I have flown a few times without tags, and they really do take much longer to come out. There are exceptions, which as always, seem to be the ones that people say always happen, but IME, the priority baggage system, while not perfect, does do fairly well.

 

[Oneworldplus2]

On paper they might have a premium baggage service. But in practice the premium service is nothing short of a joke. The priority tags do not work. All they do is make you look like a wanka to other pax when you pick up your bag. Mainly because of the large number of non priority tagged bags that come out before your bag. One would probably be better off without the tag as then you'd have a better chance of getting your bag early.

Same thing happens with me on QF+BA.
I've had no tag, bag out first. Other times, baggage tagged, bag out last. Figure that one out?!??
OT, PER has to be the slowest for baggage collection. IMO, they are severely understaffed. 30 minutes to get your bag, that's a bit rich.

YMMV

 

[medhead]

I know people keep saying this about Qantas baggage handling, but my experience is that on average a bag with a priority tag will come out before a non tagged bag. I have flown a few times without tags, and they really do take much longer to come out. There are exceptions, which as always, seem to be the ones that people say always happen, but IME, the priority baggage system, while not perfect, does do fairly well.

I can only say that must be the walking exception then. In the last 5 years I can count the number of time my bag is out before non tagged bags on one hand. But then again a small sample size as I probably only have 25 flights in that time with checked luggage

 

[777]

I will never cease to be amazed at the QF FF's around here's ability to take even the threads in the Velocity section and turn them into discussions about QF!

Maybe someone should set up a Qantas forum given how few opportunities you guys get to talk about QF

777.

 

[QF WP]

Well now that JB has taken over from Brett (effective Monday), I hope he is aware of some of the issues we have...

 

[crazydave98]

Well now that JB has taken over from Brett (effective Monday), I hope he is aware of some of the issues we have...

Yes he is acutely aware.
cheers
CrazyDave98

 

[QF WP]

Thanks crazydave98 (I'm sure that AFF member experiences are synonymous with other DJ flyers).

 

[Oneworldplus2]

I will never cease to be amazed at the QF FF's around here's ability to take even the threads in the Velocity section and turn them into discussions about QF!

Maybe someone should set up a Qantas forum given how few opportunities you guys get to talk about QF

777.

LOL
If there was more to talk about DJ, we all would.

 

[jsd]

Oh I almost forgot crazydave98,

Please for the love of god, send it across the whole guest contact centre (mainly the overseas one) to not address premium pax (namely Velocity Gold members) by their first name, its just does not feel very professional, even as a QF NB they still address me as Mr. jdevereux3

Also the DJ gold membership contact centre should be located in Australia, not where ever it is now, some of the staff overseas have very thick accents and its sometimes hard to understand them


Cheers,

Josh

 

[ejb]

Oh I almost forgot crazydave98,

Please for the love of god, send it across the whole guest contact centre (mainly the overseas one) to not address premium pax (namely Velocity Gold members) by their first name, its just does not feel very professional, even as a QF NB they still address me as Mr. jdevereux3

Also the DJ gold membership contact centre should be located in Australia, not where ever it is now, some of the staff overseas have very thick accents and its sometimes hard to understand them


Cheers,

Josh

Josh,

Are you DJ Gold or is this the experience of someone else?

ejb

 

[jsd]

Josh,

Are you DJ Gold or is this the experience of someone else?

ejb

I am DJ gold, but I'm not giving the finer details on how I managed to achieve it, they are on as need to know basis

Enough Said:!: Move Along


Josh

 

[crazydave98]

Oh I almost forgot crazydave98,

Please for the love of god, send it across the whole guest contact centre (mainly the overseas one) to not address premium pax (namely Velocity Gold members) by their first name, its just does not feel very professional, even as a QF NB they still address me as Mr. jdevereux3

Also the DJ gold membership contact centre should be located in Australia, not where ever it is now, some of the staff overseas have very thick accents and its sometimes hard to understand them


Cheers,

Josh

Josh, John Borghetti (henceforth in all posts "JB") picked this up with cabin crew on his first flight, but it hadn't occured to me that this also applies for Guest Contact Centre staff. Will pass this on. Enjoy your first flight with us in a few weeks - hope you get an E190 - my favourite bird in the fleet to travel on (and my pet - did the business case for purchasing them).
cheers
CrazyDave98