Dear Mr Joyce...

[Jack Melon]

Red is my reply.

You do have some good points
With the food part, Virgin still wins because they have a new Fare structure, Saver, Flexi and Premium. Virgin's flexi is as cheap as Qantas's cheapest deal most of the time, and you get a proper package in flexi compared to qantas.

And i reckon keep with Qantas for the time being, once Virgin's new FFP is rolled out, join them

 

[Galleo]

I used to be a QF employee - not frontline - and was there at the time it was privatised and ended up taking over Australian Airlines (Previously TAA). In the days before privatisation there was a level of staff loyalty at the airline that has been lost and I have not seen again at any other company at which I have worked. The loyalty I'm talking about meant that staff would do absolutely anything to keep the customer happy no matter what the personal cost - extra hours etc - I even know of airport staff paying for cab fares for passengers who forgot their passports to get home and back in time for an international flight - this would never happen today.

When James Strong came along and then Dixon and now Joyce the company's fate was sealed. Focus on the bottom line and the staff become just numbers, just non-core airline resources. Redundancies became regular and cost cutting became the motto of all senior managers at the direction of the CEO and board. Staff lost their job security and hence the level of loyalty previously driving the excellent reputation and quality in the airline disappeared and probably never to return. Treat staff like a number, a disposable resource, and what do you expect you will get in return.

Its always amazing to me that accountants and finance guys never understand that sometimes you need to spend money to make money and this is what we are seeing at Virgin with John Borghetti sealing the QF fate first domestically and then progressively internationally. You need to invest in your staff, support, nurture and communicate with them, treat them with respect and courtesy and they will walk through fire for you. The end result of such an approach is your product becomes the best.

QF shareholders are rapidly losing patience with current QF Mgmt and board - they will not sit back much longer without a return on their investment or even the prospect of one and at the same time see plummeting share prices. This can all be turned around easily - yes it will cost some $$ but it will mean you will likely make $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$. And don't underestimate the Australian publics fondness for the flying rat. They will come back in droves if they see quality, service and value for money return to such an iconic brand that uniquely identifies us to the world!

 

[samiam]

JS complicit? Is that harsh?

I don't have access to the Qantas Board minutes to determine if he has supported or opposed the ongoing degradation of quality, risk management, customer service and people management - not likely that any such minutes would be that explicit anyhow.

He does, however, remain a member of the Board that (depending upon governance & delegation authority) is approving the current initiatives.

Harsh? No. All directors share responsibility for the performance of any company.

 

[drron]

You havent seen the age of AA Fa's have you ? I surprised they FA's can fly with wheelie walkers
I agree with the bitterness some staff do have, which i would blame management on.

Oh nasty!
But reading this thread I have been comparing in my mind the difference in service between AA and QF-and I am comparing the domestic premium cabins.
AA FAs have very similiar complaints as their QF counterparts re management etc and are in a long running dispute re pay and have been going through a very long process to strike.You have FAs wearing their union badges,even one wearing a badge-Shaft Arpey(AA CEO).Also have spoken with an old ex TWA FA who hate the AA management,their AA colleagues and their union.However I am more likely to get very good even great service in AA F as compared to QF J(and lets not get into discussion as to whether domestic AA premium cabin should be called F-I am happy for mrsdrron to collect the extra SCs because they do).
Sure I can get a surly AA FA and a really good QF FA but there is a definite difference despite the greater age of the AA staff.

Now in the Y cabin it is a different story.My impression is less staff AA cf QF.And you pay for your meal,and cash not accepted.

Also a bit unfair to just blame AJ.I jumped ship from QFF in 2006 switching to AA.It was because I had been able to get an Aaward in J return to SEA even though I had no status.I was only QPPS with QF but had no chance of getting an award.It helped that at the same time Lindsay Wilson started his Great Points transfer to AA at that time.I was only in the Aadvantage program prior to that as we regularly flew JAL J to the USA and could get AA miles but QF points only to NRT at that time.,

It is also unfair to point the finger then at Geoff Dixon.He should have had some understanding of marketing having been an executive in the marketing departments of AN and australian airlines.In 1992 I became QP life,mrsdrron Golden Wings life.Over the next 4 years we flew both OW and *.After 1996 we switched to * completely due to better service and easier awards-at that stage I was SG with QFF.The demise of AN saw us return to QFF.

 

[Dee Thom]

When James Strong came along and then Dixon and now Joyce the company's fate was sealed.

I feel you are being a bit unkind to James Strong, he did a top job of merging TAA and QF in a swift and decisive action, and still retained the respect and loyalty of all the staff at that time.
You'r right about Dixon and Joyce and their senior management though, we nearly saw QF go off-shore with a pension company, and now see QF heading the way of JQ with much downturn in service, product and equipment
All this makes J.B. and VA look good !

Cheers Dee.

 

[serfty]

... After 1996 we switched to * completely due to better service and easier awards-at that stage I was SG with QFF. ...

Of course, at that time "SG" was actually top level QFF. Back then there was "white", Blue, Silver and Gold.

 

[rlarosa]

You make a god point there - the standard of service in this country is pretty ordinary. A good example (apart from QF) is retail. It drove me crazy yesterday every time I heard the DJ's CEO being quoted on the news saying that their profit was being downgraded because consumers were wary of the carbon tax. Another bloody CEO who doesn't get it - customer service is non existent in their stores! And I mean literally - half the time you can't even find someone to help you.

It's a shame these organisations don't get that all they need to do is go back to focussing on the basics. I shouldn't say this as i'm doing on at the moment but too many MBA's and not enough front line experience I reckon!!!!!

This is quite important. Its a massive generalisation but true nevertheless, we give cough customer service. Usually, the only places within Oz that I find decent customer service is when front line bosses take it seriously and really drive their teams.

Not being able to easily sack people is no excuse, its just slack management. There are at least a zillion ways to look after your business whilst removing bad performers from interfacing with your customers. Back office duties in the immediate term followed by redundancies if things get too out of hand with certain employees. The most important thing is to present your best face to your paying customers, always ... no excuses.

To this end, AJ is indirectly in control of the customer experience. He drives senior management who pushes his (and the boards) "will" out to the front line managers. What you see as a customer should be an extension of the boards perspective on running the airline, customer service included.

 

[Noob]

I am sick of this comparison to Airlines in America, they are not directly QF's competitors and are some of the worse airlines in the world.

 

[serfty]

I am sick of this comparison to Airlines in America, they are not directly QF's competitors and are some of the worse airlines in the world.

Now that is a huge generalisation.

I'd happily fly AA domestic first class over QF domestic Business.

 

[Stuser]

I'd second that, and add that it bugs me considerably that when I show my card to get into the lounge in CBR, they almost always suspiciously demand "where's your boarding pass?" - as if the lounge is so fabulous and I have so much free time that I just want to hang out there when I'm not flying!

When Qantas sent me my last three cards, each time the pack said (I'm paraphrasing) no matter how you check in, your FF card is now your boarding pass.

I'm fine if they want to scan it to check that I've checked in, but these suspicious demands are downright rude. I'm a customer - and you told me I didn't need a printed boarding pass!

I'm glad it's not just me!

"Sorry, Sir, you're not wearing a suit, so p..s off..."

 

[Rebekkap]

I'm glad it's not just me!

"Sorry, Sir, you're not wearing a suit, so p..s off..."

Funny, though, I've never had that happen in Melbourne, ever. They only ever glance at card, wave on through. Or in Sydney, for that matter.

 

[Stuser]

Funny, though, I've never had that happen in Melbourne, ever. They only ever glance at card, wave on through. Or in Sydney, for that matter.

Well,I was perhaps being a <little> dramatic there.

I think it may just because there are lots more passengers travelling through melbourne and sydney. There they will very sometimes swipe my card, usually they just let me through.

In Canberra they almost always swipe.... fewer passengers.....

Let's take Hobart as an extreme example.... small QP.... always check my card there, too.

 

[drron]

I am sick of this comparison to Airlines in America, they are not directly QF's competitors and are some of the worse airlines in the world.

And the point is if QF are slipping behind what you consider the worst airlines in the world..........

 

[Katie]

As anyone with a Kindle will know, when it is 'off' there is a still screensaver displayed. Maybe you can disable this feature, but I never needed or wanted to and have never found a button or menu for it.

OT:On my Kindle, you can hold the button that turns on the screensaver for a count of 5-8 or so, and it will power off completely, no screensaver.

 

[dfcatch]

yes travel is the best education!!!!

we should be thankful here, we forget all too often.

I'm sorry - but I disagree.

Just because other airlines around the world offer poor product/service - is no excuse for QF to engage them in a race to the bottom.

This is no excuse for the decline / devalue in product and service offering that has been clearly enunciated in this thread.

Yes - QF has some good product/service/lounges compared to other offerings around the world. No-one is taking that away from QF.

But that doesn't excuse them, and it doesn't change the perception of AJ trying to turn QF into a budget airline.

 

[EmilyHoward]

Wow, a lot of you guys seem to be ready to burn Alan at the stake! I think we should all give him .. and the Board.. a chance to digest things and move forward!

EH

 

[patrickk]

Hi Everybody,

There seems to be a fair bit of discussion lately about the 'disconnect' between those at the top of Qantas, management, and those at the bottom of the chain. Oh top of this it seems that the front line staff, have been working in aviation for just a bit too long, particularly some of the cabin crew, ground staff and lounge staff (Read lounge dragons). Add to this the decline in onboard catering, aging aircraft and the Virgin 'Game Change' program, the Red Roo is looking a bit ill.

So, my question is this.... If you had to make a couple of suggestions to the CEO. What would they be?

I'm strictly talking about Qantas Service. Not QFF, not the website, not the airport parking. Anything that happens from the moment you walk in the door of the airport, to the moment you collect your baggage and walk out the door.

I'm willing to combine our ideas and send them off to Qantas.... (I just happen to know somebody who would be really interested in this sort of feedback)

So if your still reading... This is what I think needs to be improved:

Domestic:

• Meals! Go back a few years and Qantas had some great onboard food. It has seriously gone down hill in the past 2-3 years. I know I can eat in the lounge, but still!
• Blankets! I never really used them, but I know a lot who did. I thought this was part of a premium airline?
• All those kids packs, toys, and playing cards. As a kid I loved colouring in stuff, and always got a kick out of playing a card game at 32,000 feet.
• Priority Boarding & Baggage (Insert AA Reference to Priority Boarding Here) I rarely check in baggage. But its a joke. 40min wait isn't acceptable.
• Some of the Aircraft, particularly the 763's are getting past their used by date. I know you've been stuffed around with the 787/380 saga. But have you thought about giving them an upgrade? I hear Boeing Sky Interior is available as a retrofit on 767's now.
• Staff
  • Flight Attendants:
    • I think its safe to say, a fair few QF Cabin Crew have been flying for a little too long now. I can't tell you the number of grumpy crew I have had, making me feel unwelcome to be onboard.
    • Can they be a little more friendly? Don't get me wrong, there are some great staff out there. But on my last few flights the FA has been talking on the phone while welcoming guests on board. Unprofessional much?
    • On Virgin, I'm welcomed onboard with a smile and a "Lovely to see you again Liam/Mr Rasmussen" constantly checking on me, and given a bottle of water every now and again. They really try hard to make you have a nice flight.
  • Ground Crew:
    • Consistency of Training.
    • Some can be grumpy, once again. There are a number of staff that have been at the airline too long.

That's all I can think of for now.

Disclaimer***

Don't get me wrong, I'm proud to call Qantas my airline of choice, there are some great people within Qantas and I think products like the J Lounge, and NCGI are great. But I'm having an increasing number of bad experiences, and just a general feeling of "Ugh..." sometimes when I get on a flight, be it a angry flight attendant, a old aircraft or just a tired feeling when I step onto a Qantas aircraft.

Virgin on the other hand, aren't there yet, but they are certainty bringing the magic back to flying. I hope it gives Qantas a bit of a wake up call.

Look forward to hearing what everybody has to say....

Liam.

I am sorry but I cannot disagree more. I have been flying QANTAS since the mid 1980s and cabin service is much the same over that time some good some bad; food is much the same or probably a bit better nowadays on International (some of the best Goan curries to be had I have had with the Hindu meals in economy) just depends where food is loaded; but in a tight spot such as the recent ash cloud they were brilliant at getting me to the rescheduled earlier flight to avoid the airport closure, and staff n planes tedn to tell you what is happening unlike most others.. People compare QANTAS unfavourably with Emirates but I doubt the have flown Emirates Asian regional sectors such as Colombo KL (not a pleasant experience and v old planes). QANTAS has a greater consistency across its network than most. Much better than Cathy on London for example, and evybody has some old planes (try the US for starters).

Patrickk

 

[Simo]

I'm glad it's not just me!

"Sorry, Sir, you're not wearing a suit, so p..s off..."

I have had the same thing happen as well.

I thought some one was just not thinking for a second...

I said all done on my card...

And then said no probs in you go Sir...

 

[Stuser]

I have had the same thing happen as well.

I thought some one was just not thinking for a second...

I said all done on my card...

And then said no probs in you go Sir...

I must remember to shave my week old beard before flying tomorrow....

 

[ozflier]

I just wonder if Mr Joyce realizes that QF shareholders are at the suffering end of his cost cutting exercises.

Us investors may just start wondering if one of the reasons our shares are going nowhere is because , apart from the "legendary"top 15% elites , Qantas is heading down at a fast rate .

I would never have believed, even 3 years ago, that I would have thought that United SYD - LAX ( at least in J) would be a better experience than our beloved Aussie icon.

Sadly its not just United's real lie flat beds and real Champagne - their FAs actually now seem to care about service.