Ethiopian 737 Max 8 crash and Fallout

[Bundy Bear]

I can’t watch this sort of show, as the lack of integrity normally bugs me too much. How was MCAS described....what was it’s purpose?

As for slowing the aircraft....nice idea, but pulling the power back would give a strong nose down pitch change. Speed brakes would give nose up, but not of the same magnitude, so overall it would simply add to the problems.

This thread is more informative than the TV Show although it had some pictures, almost needed a 2 hour show to explain both crashes in detail.

I guess Boeing thought that all you need to do it cut the switch and everything will be fine and you could fly away happy.

 

[OATEK]

I guess Boeing thought that all you need to do it cut the switch and everything will be fine and you could fly away happy.

I would not put think in the same sentence as the word Boeing. Assumed maybe.

 

[woodborer]

FAA has published an updated draft MMEL for the Max, if anyone feels like commenting

https://www.faa.gov/aircraft/draft_docs/mmel/

 

[serfty]

The FAA issued a document with additional rules for the airlines on how to operate the 737 MAX jets when the jet returns to the service.

The public has 30 days to comment on the document. Boeing is finalizing changes to a flight-control system and is also altering the plane’s flight-control computers after tests showed they were vulnerable to failure.

Contact Support

 

[OATEK]

Internal FAA Review Saw High Risk of 737 MAX Crashes

U.S. regulators decided to allow Boeing’s 737 MAX jet to keep flying after its first fatal crash last fall even after their own analysis indicated it could become one of the most accident-prone airliners in decades without design changes.

www.wsj.com

 

[woodborer]

Internal FAA Review Saw High Risk of 737 MAX Crashes

U.S. regulators decided to allow Boeing’s 737 MAX jet to keep flying after its first fatal crash last fall even after their own analysis indicated it could become one of the most accident-prone airliners in decades without design changes.

www.wsj.com

Certainly some big questions need to be asked about the aviation industries response to the first accident.

And whether the players have learned anything. Has Boeing learned and changes? Has the FAA learned and changed? Has LionAir learned and changed?

Maybe the FAA has....

 

[jb747]

I wonder if the biggest issue for Boeing now, is that nothing they do will be without added scrutiny.

Boeing removed a feature that protects its 787 planes during lightning strikes as a cost-cutting measure, even after FAA experts objected

The FAA administrator will be questioned by Congress today over its certification of the change to the 787 Dreamliner as well as the 737 Max.

www.businessinsider.com.au

 

[drron]

Interesting front page on the IC Fiji's hotel information channel.
.

 

[drron]

Seems the FAA don't believe the MAX will be flying in the next few months.

Official: Boeing 737 MAX "Ungrounded" By FAA

The US Federal Aviation Administration has given the go-ahead for the Boeing 737 MAX to return to service. Here's what happens now.

onemileatatime.com

 

[jb747]

Boeing need to make the decision soon as to whether or not to keep the production like operating. That has huge downstream effects with the various suppliers, and once stopped, it won’t start again instantly.

I wonder how much an entirely new aircraft would have cost, versus the ongoing cost of this debacle.

 

[serfty]

FAA will not certify 737 Max in 2019: FAA chief

The US Federal Aviation Administration will not clear the Boeing 737 Max to fly until sometime in 2020, the agency's chief said on 11 December.

www.flightglobal.com

The US Federal Aviation Administration will not clear the Boeing 737 Max to fly until sometime in 2020, the agency’s chief said on 11 December.

FAA Administrator Steve Dickson confirmed the 2020 timeline on the same day he laid out remaining steps the FAA will take before lifting the Max grounding.

“We are not on any timeline,” Dickson told CNBC’s Squawk Box. “There are about 10 or 11 milestones left to complete.”
...

I suspect that Boeing are trying extremely hard to have conversion certification via tablet and avoid the need for full Pilot Simulator Training.

In my reading this month, it seems those pilots involved in recent simulation tests of the changes are not responding in the ways Boeing would prefer.

 

[AviatorInsight]

I wonder how much an entirely new aircraft would have cost, versus the ongoing cost of this debacle.

Or how much it’d cost to bring back the 757. Wishful thinking though...

 

[jb747]

FAA will not certify 737 Max in 2019: FAA chief

The US Federal Aviation Administration will not clear the Boeing 737 Max to fly until sometime in 2020, the agency's chief said on 11 December.

www.flightglobal.com

I suspect that Boeing are trying extremely hard to have conversion certification via tablet and avoid the need for full Pilot Simulator Training.

In my reading this month, it seems those pilots involved in recent simulation tests of the changes are not responding in the ways Boeing would prefer.

It's really amazing. The iPad "training" was never an acceptable way of training people for what is a totally different coughpit. It's about time a regulator grew some balls and got rid of most of these cross endorsements. Similar is happening with the A330 and the A350. The 350 coughpit is actually closer to the 380, but the 330 has two engines...so it must be the same.

Or how much it’d cost to bring back the 757. Wishful thinking though...

It was originally expected that the 757 would replace the 737, and those airlines that operated the 757 loved them. I wonder if Southwest can be blamed for that too. It might not be totally in the realm of wishful thinking though. Apparently they're actually considering a new 767 passenger aircraft, so why not a 757. As a passenger, I'd rather fly on either of those than some of their alternatives, and as a pilot, the 767 was great to fly.

 

[flyer89]

Similar is happening with the A330 and the A350. The 350 coughpit is actually closer to the 380, but the 330 has two engines...so it must be the same.

A mate at another airline who flies both the 330/350 says it’s a PITA. They simply fly differently and he doesn’t recommend it at all.

 

[Mogul]

Boeing will now suspend production of the MAX from January.

The ripple effect of this will be huge.

 

[flychrisfly]

Boeing need to make the decision soon as to whether or not to keep the production like operating. That has huge downstream effects with the various suppliers, and once stopped, it won’t start again instantly.

Portentous!

Boeing to suspend 737 MAX production from January | Flightradar24 Blog

Boeing will suspend 737 MAX production beginning in January 2020. The 737 MAX has been grounded since March 2019 and Boeing now has 400 MAX in storage.

www.flightradar24.com

"Boeing announced today that it will suspend 737 MAX production beginning in January 2020. "

 

[p--and--t]

Interesting developments, maybe put a note in the diary for a few months away to check eBay for an aviation clearance sale - new unused

 

[jb747]

My recently developed distrust of Boeing knows few limits. As the downstream effects are so huge, I wonder if they're looking for friends in Washington to push the FAA along. Most of their commentary thus far seems to have had that as a goal...putting pressure on the FAA via the media. A total shutdown will lead to lay offs in the myriad suppliers, which will, of course, have political ramifications.

 

[defurax]

Interesting developments, maybe put a note in the diary for a few months away to check eBay for an aviation clearance sale - new unused

A neighbour had a "Boeing engineering" labeled package at their door yesterday. Maybe you can buy direct
Maybe I should find out what my neighbour does for a living

 

[Berlin]

Boeing will now suspend production of the MAX from January.

Not at all surprised.