FWA: Some reduction in Sunday/PH rates for some Industries

[wandering_fred]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

I think part of the rationale was that there are quite a few in hospitality that don't open when the surcharges are so high. Perhaps some incentive to open in the first place.
Whether true or not I have not verified, but apparently Woolies and Coles have a very large percentage of weekend workers and their contract is already at 150% for Sundays.

Perhaps Moslems and Jews should get 150% for Fridays and Saturdays. :shock: And atheists can pick any two consecutive days of the week for a year in advance.

Happy wandering

Fred

Fred

 

[TomVexille]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

I thought hospitality was excluded from this latest ruling? And that they would make a decision on it soon

 

[Steady]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

Requiring someone to be a union member would be a breach of the Fair Work Act. But as you say, never let the truth get in the way of a good story.

Coming from the construction industry, I have first hand experience of what happens in the construction industry. While construction workers in most states definitely have the choice, there is a state where that has not been my experience.

Believing everybody, or every company abides 100% by legislation, acts and the law, sounds like a fairy tale - wouldn't it be nice?

 

[Moindardt]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

Requiring someone to be a union member would be a breach of the Fair Work Act. But as you say, never let the truth get in the way of a good story.

43.2. The Employer will invite the SDA to attend the Induction of new employees. Theinvitation will be given to the SDA at the earliest possible time so as to enable theSDA to attend the Inductions. The parties agree that fifteen minutes shall bereasonable time for the SDA to address employees. All new employees covered bythis Agreement shall, upon induction, be given access to an application form andany other appropriate literature to assist employees to decide whether to join theSDA.
43.3. The Employer undertakes, upon authorisation by the employee, to deduct SDAmembership dues, as levied by the SDA in accordance with its rules, from the payof employees who are members of the SDA. Such monies collected shall beforwarded to the SDA at the beginning of each month, together with the necessaryinformation to enable the reconciliation of the crediting of subscriptions to members'accounts.

Fact: The union gets 15 mins with every new employee
Fact: Every employee is handed a union enrolment and deduction form
Fact: McDonalds explicitly says the union is their partner

I think criminal lawyers called this "implied threat". If you ask a McDonalds worker, I am pretty sure you will find the threat is pretty blatant and open.

<redacted comment>

 

[Moindardt]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

Just watched part of the ridiculous Bill Shorten press conference and he has some guy there saying he is losing $109 because of the cuts. Given that it is from double time to time and a half, that means he normally earns $436 on a Sunday. How about we do some basic maths people and understand why the country is going broke. Oh and he pays almost no tax.

Lets try and look at the real amounts of tax paid by people and tell the truth for a change.

Bill Shorten's Sunday rates cut protester 'won't be affected' - 9news.com.au

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Hilarious!!!! I am sure there are certain people who are still going to find a way to still believe old Bill!!! Facts people, get the facts right!!!

For those who don't know the story, the guy Bill Shorten trotted out as losing $109 because of the cuts, isn't actually losing anything. Sounds like a few things written on these forums.

 

[love_the_life]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

I agree it was pretty sloppy work on the part of the Labor Party but hardly worth the glee that you seem to greet it with. Similar things have happened to the other side as well I seem to recall.

 

[froggerADL]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Hilarious!!!! I am sure there are certain people who are still going to find a way to still believe old Bill!!! Facts people, get the facts right!!!

For those who don't know the story, the guy Bill Shorten trotted out as losing $109 because of the cuts, isn't actually losing anything. Sounds like a few things written on these forums.

Bill Shorten's Sunday rates cut protester 'won't be affected' - 9news.com.au

I think your political commentary would be much more appropriate in the comments section of the Daily Telegraph.

 

[Pushka]

The totally off-topic thread

I agree it was pretty sloppy work on the part of the Labor Party but hardly worth the glee that you seem to greet it with. Similar things have happened to the other side as well I seem to recall.

But where is the fun in that?

Actually from both sides it's really galling that they think they can feed us BS and we gladly accept it. Clearly they think we are morons.

Australia Post works; parcel sent from Victoria arrived this morning before 10am, that is all.

And how sad we need to get excited when it does! What the heck happened and why did we let it.

 

[JessicaTam]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

[mod hat]
As happens all too frequently on AFF, political discussion tends to end in tears.

At the end of the day, this is a travel forum.

There are plenty of other places online to engage in political repartee.
[/mod hat]

 

[Moindardt]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

I agree it was pretty sloppy work on the part of the Labor Party but hardly worth the glee that you seem to greet it with. Similar things have happened to the other side as well I seem to recall.

spacebar
Bill Shorten is attacking the government for cutting penalty rates and then he trots out this guy as an example. The government didn't cut penalty rates, the Fair Work Commission did. Bill Shorten was the Industrial Relations Minister when it transitioned to the FWC and has many interviews where he espouses the independence of the commission. I won't go into who is on it but let's say it is not very balanced, appointed by Bill Shorten. This is one of the few judgements which haven't gone the way of the unions and straight away Bill Shorten is their abusing it. The actual review was part of changes made to the Act when Bill Shorten was minister. ie Bill Shorten set the whole thing up and is now complaining about his own work. He then trots out this guy claiming to be hard done by.. who isn't.

That is quite a few own goals by anyone's count. I don't recall that many complete stuff ups of the facts in such a short time by anyone else (the ones I can think of that come close are pretty minor by comparison). There was talk around last night about making this an election issue.

 

[love_the_life]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

spacebar
Bill Shorten is attacking the government for cutting penalty rates and then he trots out this guy as an example. The government didn't cut penalty rates, the Fair Work Commission did. Bill Shorten was the Industrial Relations Minister when it transitioned to the FWC and has many interviews where he espouses the independence of the commission. I won't go into who is on it but let's say it is not very balanced, appointed by Bill Shorten. This is one of the few judgements which haven't gone the way of the unions and straight away Bill Shorten is their abusing it. The actual review was part of changes made to the Act when Bill Shorten was minister. ie Bill Shorten set the whole thing up and is now complaining about his own work. He then trots out this guy claiming to be hard done by.. who isn't.

That is quite a few own goals by anyone's count. I don't recall that many complete stuff ups of the facts in such a short time by anyone else (the ones I can think of that come close are pretty minor by comparison). There was talk around last night about making this an election issue.

Did you not read the mod comment above? Bored now...

 

[AA KAZ]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

...

Fact: The union gets 15 mins with every new employee
Fact: Every employee is handed a union enrolment and deduction form
Fact: McDonalds explicitly says the union is their partner

I think criminal lawyers called this "implied threat". If you ask a McDonalds worker, I am pretty sure you will find the threat is pretty blatant and open.

In action?

I was given a job by maccas a couple of years ago.

Compulsary inducution session with boss and union rep. Given union union enrolment forms and offer of movie vouchers if signing up at session.

Wanted time to consider and said so during the one-on-one each new employee had to have with union dude. Nice at first but came a bit more tight when I said I wanted to think. First it was sign now to get movie vouchers, then three weeks. He went to get boss to tell me I should sign. At end of session I still hadn't and I was pointed out to whole group that I had not signed up. Very uncomfortable.

I was given some shifts at poor times, went to punctual and did ok. But work dried up. I never joined.

 

[GarrettM]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

I think your political commentary would be much more appropriate in the comments section of the Daily Telegraph.

I suspect Mr Mointdardt and I would have very different views on a lot of things, but here I agree with him.
Labor could surely have gone and found someone who actually would be worse off under these changes. But it seems at best they got lazy, or deliberately disingenious. Neither is overly helpful to their cause.


LtL is correct when she says the other side has done similar.

The fact that any party continues to try to playing the electorate for fools is outrageous, and the punishment for these stunts shouldn't be restricted to a triannual trip to the ballot box.

 

[froggerADL]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

I suspect Mr Mointdardt and I would have very different views on a lot of things, but here I agree with him.
Labor could surely have gone and found someone who actually would be worse off under these changes. But it seems at best they got lazy, or deliberately disingenious. Neither is overly helpful to their cause.


LtL is correct when she says the other side has done similar.

The fact that any party continues to try to playing the electorate for fools is outrageous, and the punishment for these stunts shouldn't be restricted to a triannual trip to the ballot box.

My comment said nothing about whether Mr Mointdardt was right or wrong. In my view all political parties treat the electorate with contempt. I was simply suggesting that he toddle off to the Daily Telegraph where his comments would be more appropriate and appreciated. As one of the mods pointed out, this is a frequent flyer forum, and in my view his comment was innapropriate even for the playground, as is yours.

 

[Steady]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

So much politics and sport talk...

I agree, the Bin 9 is helping

In my view all political parties treat the electorate with contempt.

My first ever political post on AFF, I strongly agree with froggerADL

 

[froggerADL]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

Thanks for that. I was aware of the Coles deal, which I believe failed the BOOT test.

We might have to send that one off to the grammar thread JT . It's either a BOOT or a BOO test. Bit like an ATM machine.

 

[GarrettM]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

My comment said nothing about whether Mr Mointdardt was right or wrong. In my view all political parties treat the electorate with contempt. I was simply suggesting that he toddle off to the Daily Telegraph where his comments would be more appropriate and appreciated. As one of the mods pointed out, this is a frequent flyer forum, and in my view his comment was innapropriate even for the playground, as is yours.

Fair enough.

I'll head back to your current TR, which is more enjoyable anyway.

 

[Moopere]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

I've got to be honest, I've never really understood why I should get paid more to work Saturday or Sunday, so long as I get 2 days off a week all seems fair to me and its been this way wherever I've worked for pretty much the last 30 years. The working week was negotiated at position start, whether that was 38 or 40 or more per week and excess on top of that was (sometimes) classified as 'overtime' and paid accordingly. It seems somewhat artificial to me to simply nominate some days as being worth more than others - particularly nowadays when we should be aiming towards a 24x7 economy.

 

[JessicaTam]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

We might have to send that one off to the grammar thread JT . It's either a BOOT or a BOO test. Bit like an ATM machine.

Don't forget PIN number.

But we digress...

 

[Hvr]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

<snip> It seems somewhat artificial to me to simply nominate some days as being worth more than others - particularly nowadays when we should be aiming towards a 24x7 economy.

As someone who does work in a 24x7 industry on all days and at all hours I wish it was so easy.

My health suffers working these hours. I am limited on what I can do at times. e.g. if I finish at 4.00am I can't go shopping, see my regular GP, access many services etcetera. Accessing other professional services see me missing sleep, which carries health risks.


Television is rubbish and I either get the last version of the newspaper or none at all when I wake up.

Family events, forget about them. I work virtually every weekend unless planned months in advance.

My penalty rates are included in my base rate so this decision doesn't affect me, yet.

And amazingly politicians and senior members of companies aren't going to lose any money or benefits. Their hypocrisy is amazing but not surprising afterall they know better than us and don't hesitate to tell us.

As for increasing jobs, not a chance. If a company could make more money by haing staff rostered on then they would already do it once there is a return on investment, i.e. wages cost is offset by profit from sales. If they're not doing this now then they deserve to go broke.

Or maybe they need to address the real issues, shopping centre landlords are rapacious in their demands for money but this hasn't been addressed.

The franchise model allows franchisees to avoid paying wages with near impunity. Not being addressed with any real vigour because the franchisors are still getting their fees.

Many companies don't pay compulsory superannuation, again with impunity because it's not a crime.Just some slight embarrassment for the company.


The attacks on workers are increasing and will hurt society in ways that will cost us so much more than the wages saved.