General Coronavirus chit chat thread - non-travel specific

Not sure if I should start another thread, but there are already so many other threads on this damn virus.

One of the things that has been at the back of my mind for the last couple of months is the rapid changes of "rules" and the disparity between the messaging between the feds and state governments.

Don't get me wrong, in the whole scheme of things, a few glitches here and there, between them they have done a reasonable job in a once in a century type event.

In the normal course of events, laws are proposed, discussed at length, lots of media attention, various lobby groups have their say, laws get debated, passed and gazetted and come into force sometimes 12 months or more later accompanied by copious coordinated advertising to effected parties via both the gov and the various associations, industry bodies etc.

This time round temporary emergency health rules were changing rapidly and one had to rely on watching the right politician at the right time in the right state to get some idea of what the restrictions were at that point in time. The public declarations were imprecise, sometimes not documented and often altered/nuanced a day or so later.

If you were not an internet savvy person, or did not have the internet at home, or worked shift work and missed the news on TV, how were you supposed to know what was allowed and what wasn't. How could you find the documentation that did exist to tell you what was going on. Could some of the fines have been issued to, not only flagrant deliberate breeches, but also those genuinely unaware.

Just among my own friends on phone calls I heard them often say things that weren't correct because they had heard or seen a summary of a different premiers comments in the media.

Was wondering what suggestions the brains trust have of what changes could be made for a future event (and maybe next 3 stages of the unravelling) to ensure the information is conveyed in a more coherent manner.

Edit: Just to be clear, I'm not complaining or seeking to have a go, just think we can always learn to improve.
 
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Could some of the fines have been issued to, not only flagrant deliberate breeches, but also those genuinely unaware.

Supposedly not, because police had discretion and were supposed to issue warnings where people were genuinely unaware. Some people received two or three warnings (or more) before being issued a fine.


Just among my own friends on phone calls I heard them often say things that weren't correct because they had heard or seen a summary of a different premiers comments in the media.

Was wondering what suggestions the brains trust have of what changes could be made for a future event (and maybe next 3 stages of the unravelling) to ensure the information is conveyed in a more coherent manner.

People should listen to the premier in their state. Or simply ask their friends. The rules in Victoria were pretty clear. Do not go out unless essential. And four reasons were given. The people who seemed 'confused' were the media, some talking heads on tv out to create 'news', and those looking for loopholes. It doesn't help when Victoria had such clear rules, but the news says 'it's so confusing because NSW allows xyz'. It doesn't help when the media makes sensationalist claims like children are going to be at risk from drowning because their swimming lessons have been cancelled. We're talking 9 week of lockdowns, not 9 years.

The whole schools issue seems a bit of political game playing. The Federal government dug their heels in and weren't going to budge no matter how little sense their position seemed to make.
 
I seem to remember in one of these threads (very early in all of this) where some posters were totally convinced that our Australian Government would have contingency plans to deal with pandemics, or such, that could be pulled off the shelf and implemented. 😉
 
.... One of the things that has been at the back of my mind for the last couple of months is the rapid changes of "rules" and the disparity between the messaging between the feds and state governments ....

... People should listen to the premier in their state. Or simply ask their friends. The rules in Victoria were pretty clear. Do not go out unless essential. And four reasons were given. The people who seemed 'confused' were the media, some talking heads on tv out to create 'news', and those looking for loopholes ....

At some point, I decided to only follow what was happening in the State where I live. There was a lot going on, nationwide, and many differences between the States, so I tried to ignore most about the rest of Oz, just to keep it simple.

Edited
 
I seem to remember in one of these threads (very early in all of this) where some posters were totally convinced that our Australian Government would have contingency plans to deal with pandemics, or such, that could be pulled off the shelf and implemented. 😉

Yep, was all known some 15 months ago that we would run into the problems we did. Panic buying, shortage of chemicals for water supply, medications, etc etc etc. And guess what, no surprises, they didn't prepare.

 
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Our dentist and optician are now back open so that’s good.

Master FM has just told me he will probably be working from home until December:oops: Apparently Google are opening their offices in the USA, but 15% of staff first and slowly increasing. Because it is easy for him and his partner to wfh they will be at the end.
 
Mike Pence delivering PPE, but he has a hot mic and the boxes are empty


I'm no fan of the current US administration but it appears that video gives a misleading impression due to it's editing.


 
My son in sfo said yesterday that they both expect to work mostly from home until the end of the year at least with some very limited group meetings commencing later this year.
They are also needing the school open before they can start getting out and about for work .
 
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I'm no fan of the current US administration but it appears that video gives a misleading impression due to it's editing.

Indeed. The recent clip of Trump rebuking a nurse who said she had reused her mask for several weeks and that supplies were 'sporadic' was also edited way out of context. Most news bulletins showed Trump cutting the nurse off in his reply. The full video showed the nurse finishing, Trump considering for a second, then coming up with a response.
 
I guess that I should be watching more of FOX NEWS (Hannity, etc) to get the real picture. 🤣

I keep being amazed that those who so dislike and criticise Fox etc seem to know so much about it. Do you watch it quite a bit already? ;) I'd never heard of Hannity until TRTMA mentioned him a week or so ago and I googled the name. Same as I'd never know what Andrew Bolt was saying except when its quoted by certain correspondents here. More secret admirers.

<snip> but it appears that video [of Pence] gives a misleading impression due to it's editing.

Shock! Horror! 🙂
 
I keep being amazed that those who so dislike and criticise Fox etc seem to know so much about it. Do you watch it quite a bit already? ;) I'd never heard of Hannity until TRTMA mentioned him a week or so ago and I googled the name. Same as I'd never know what Andrew Bolt was saying except when its quoted by certain correspondents here. More secret admirers.



Shock! Horror! 🙂

Channel surfing :) It's pretty easy to get the idea of what they're saying in 5-10 mins. Andrew Bolt you can't miss, he's all over the news because of Pell.
 
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Channel surfing :) It's pretty easy to get the idea of what they're saying in 5-10 mins. Andrew Bolt you can't miss, he's all over the news because of Pell.

Yet I still have managed to avoid 🙂 . Mind you, I'm pretty focused on my studies, right now. In front of computer and print-outs almost all day, including evenings. Thesis submission in a few weeks. 💡

Even in that little bit of telly I do watch, I don't see the point in wasting eyeball time on viewing anything where you know, by the network or program history, what is going to be said, or what type of talking head guest is going to appear. I like to be informed, not talked at. Same with web sites.
 
Sometimes I flick to Fox and I say, give them a chance, listen to them, see if you see things the same way. And about 10secs in Im wondering if theyre paid actors because no one can really believe some of the BS they are saying but yet, so many do.

This was interesting;
 
Sometimes I flick to Fox and I say, give them a chance, listen to them, see if you see things the same way. And about 10secs in Im wondering if theyre paid actors because no one can really believe some of the BS they are saying but yet, so many do ....

You sound like a glutton for punishment. 🤣
 
I am quite surprised that someone who sticks up for Fox and accuses people of never having seen it, had to google ‘Hannity’.
There are a few others on Fox in that ilk as well. Those of us who actually know something about Fox and mention it occasionally do seemingly actually know more about it. So, I for one would appreciate not being harangued about it in the future. :rolleyes:

I keep being amazed that those who so dislike and criticise Fox etc seem to know so much about it. Do you watch it quite a bit already? ;) I'd never heard of Hannity until TRTMA mentioned him a week or so ago and I googled the name. Same as I'd never know what Andrew Bolt was saying except when its quoted by certain correspondents here. More secret admirers.



Shock! Horror! 🙂
 
So by 2/4 they had the capacity to test patients leaving quarantine yet there is the case I keep going back to of the woman who tested positive in SA despite having symptoms whilst in quarantine in Sydney but not tested.FAILURE.


We are never going to agree on hotel quarantine for Covid 19 for international arrivals as our definition of what is a failure is quite different.

Your your definition of hotel quarantine failure seems to be that it has failed if a person tests positive post quarantine.


This does not seem to be the goal of those that set up hotel quarantine in Australia. Hotel quarantine in Australia was set up to prevent transmission of Covid 19. It was not set up so that everyone exiting quarantine were Covid 19 negative.

Being Covid 19 positive in itself does not mean that an individual can infect another person. They still need to be capable of infecting another person.

Just yesterday:
"We learn things every day,'' Professor Kelly said.

"We know that this is an infectious disease, that is quite clear. It is a virus, it does spread from person to person and we know it is quite infectious.

"Most of that infectiousness happens in the first five days of people being sick,'' he said.

"So far — mostly the infection is when someone is quite obviously sick, they know they are sick and they are transmitting it from person to person. Much less so before they get sick. So this is now quite clear," he said.


This is pretty much what other experts have been stating for some time.

People can infect before they show symptoms (48 hours), but not for long after they stop showing symptoms. Asymptomatic people (including those who actually have minor symptoms but that the person fails to recognise them) can infect people too, but are generally thought to not be as infectious and that again that a 14 day period will see their viral load drop to levels where they will no longer infect people. For those that are symptomatic their quarantine period can be extended beyond the 14 days depending on their symptom/s and when there last occurred.



My definition is that Covid 19 hotel quarantine has failed if a person post quarantine infects another person. Furthermore, to me if there are a small number of failures given the many thousands who have now been through hotel quarantine then that does not make the whole process a failure. Nothing in life is perfect. Vaccines are not perfect, products are not perfect etc. If there are too many individual failures then the product/processes is a failure. Individual failures are not critical unless they are catastrophic in nature.

I have yet to read of a person post quarantine infecting another person here in Australia. Yes I have read of people testing positive, but that to me is not a failure.

Remember too that quarantining everyone till they are no longer positive would mean quarantining some people for considerable periods of time. Which to me based on what is currently known is an unnecessary denial of liberty.
 
In reply to DC3:
I keep being amazed that those who so dislike and criticise Fox etc seem to know so much about it. Do you watch it quite a bit already? I'd never heard of Hannity until TRTMA mentioned him a week or so ago and I googled the name. Same as I'd never know what Andrew Bolt was saying except when its quoted by certain correspondents here. More secret admirers.

I am quite surprised that someone who sticks up for Fox and accuses people of never having seen it, had to google ‘Hannity’.
There are a few others on Fox in that ilk as well. Those of us who actually know something about Fox and mention it occasionally do seemingly actually know more about it. So, I for one would appreciate not being harangued about it in the future. :rolleyes:

(my bolding)

Feel free to quote where I 'stick up for' Fox? o_O And where I 'accuse others of never having seen it'. :rolleyes: So please, be 'harangued' not at all. 🙂

So little do I know about it, I had to Google when some-one mentioned one of the lead commentators. But It seems rather that others must watch it, since they are so knowledgeable about it and talk about it so often (yet they seem to indicate they loath it?). From what I learn form it here, it would annoy me crazy. Same with Andrew Bolt, seeming another favourite of some here.

I don't feel so much harangued as misrepresented.
 

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