General COVID-19 Vaccine Discussion

[Lynda2475]

We need evidence to know when/if boosters are needed for AZ

Watch the UK they are giving boosters to those vaccinated with AZ startig 1st September.

Strawiest strawman argument ever

Whatever, thankfully the NSW CHO isnt listening to you. Dr Chant has stated that those who shorten the gap below 8 weeks will be prioritised for boosters. Skip a booster if you think you are bullet proof, science says you shoudl get it when recommended.

 

[Must...Fly!]

Its been repeatedly mentioned in media, even Dr Chant mentioned it when she started encouraging people to shorten the gap.

If you think having AZ (especially with short gap between doses) will mean you wont need a booster you are mistaken. If AZ gave lifetime protection the UK wouldnt be giving 3rd doses to medical staff and over 50s from next month.

As far as I know you are not a doctor let alone an immunologist.

 

[Lynda2475]

As far as I know you are not a doctor let alone an immunologist.

No, and have never claimed to be.

However the NSW CHO (who is a doctor) has stated that boosters will be needed sooner if the gap is shortened, perhaps you also want to attack her credentials? Pretty sure she has access ot much better data than you do.

‘Don’t wait’: What you need to know about getting the second AstraZeneca shot earlier

Sydneysiders have been advised to bring forward their second AstraZeneca vaccine jab. What does that mean for immunity, boosters and availability?

www.theguardian.com

On Monday, Chant said “clearly, having the vaccine within the six to eight weeks trades off the duration of protection that that vaccine might provide you but we know that into the future, we will be providing booster doses of various vaccines and what we want to do is protect you”.

The RACGP NSW chair, Associate Prof Charlotte Hespe, went further, saying GPs would probably look at which patients had brought forward their interval period between doses when looking to prioritise booster appointments once approved.

 

[Princess Fiona]

Watch the UK they are giving boosters to those vaccinated with AZ startig 1st September.



Whatever, thankfully the NSW CHO isnt listening to you. Dr Chant has stated that those who shorten the gap below 8 weeks will be prioritised for boosters. Skip a booster if you think you are bullet proof, science says you shoudl get it when recommended.

The UK is not giving boosters to those vaccinated specifically with AZ starting in September.

Their version of ATAGI which is called the the JCVI has issued interim guidelines on a prospective booster program.

“In Stage 1 of a potential booster vaccination programme for 2021 to 2022, the following groups should be offered a booster dose and the flu vaccine from September:

• adults aged 16 years and over who are immunosuppressed
• those living in residential care homes for older adults
• all adults aged 70 years or over
• adults aged 16 years and over who are considered clinically extremely vulnerable
• frontline health and social care workers
• 
  
  
• 
  
  
• 
  This is not at all specific to those who have received the AZ vaccines. It’s all of the covid vaccines given in the UK. Gov.Uk
• 
  

 

[Lynda2475]

This is not at all specific to those who have received the AZ vaccines

I never stated it was exclusive to AZ but it certainly includes AZ recipients.

They arent excluding those who got AZ so they clearly feel that all approved vaccines need a boost.

I linked to the same criteria you just posted in the article I posted ont he previous page.

Unlike some here I do not belive that AZ comes with magic powers that means no boosters are needed. Nor that more evidence re the need for boosters is needed, this has already been determined.

 

[Princess Fiona]

I never stated it was exclusive to AZ but it certainly includes AZ recipients.

They arent excluding those who got AZ so they clearly feel that all approved vaccines need a boost.

I linked to the same criteria you just posted in the article I posted ont he previous page.

Unlike some here I do not belive that AZ comes with magic powers that means no boosters are needed.

No and neither do I but by mentioning it specifically when you are talking about UK boosters it seems misleading to those reading the post.
The UK is offering a booster program starting in September for anyone immunized with AZ, Pfizer and Moderna depending on which priority group you fall into.

 

[Lynda2475]

No and neither do I but by mentioning it specifically when you are talking about UK boosters it seems misleading to those reading the post.

The post I was replying to was claiming there is no eveidence to support AZ boosters. So there was no need to repeat that the MRNA vaccines will need boosters as they have been upfront since December last year that boosters would be needed, and that wasnt being contended.

Our govenrment has quite rightly ordered both Moderna and Pfizer boosters for next year. Based on the 6-8 month time frame we will need to start giving them at scale from January, and some of the early 1A recipeints (those who were fully vaccinated before end of March) will need them from Dec this year.

As soon as I am eligile for an mrna booster i will be at front of the line to get it.

 

[sjk]

Unlike some here I do not belive that AZ comes with magic powers that means no boosters are needed

The only mention of that was in your own strawman argument.

Post automatically merged: Aug 17, 2021

The post I was replying to was claiming there is no eveidence to support AZ boosters

No it was not.

 

[serfty]

Watch the UK they are giving boosters to those vaccinated with AZ startig 1st September

The BBC article you posted make no mention of vaccination branding. You are certainly strawmanning.

 

[Princess Fiona]

The post I was replying to was claiming there is no eveidence to support AZ boosters. So there was no need to repeat that the MRNA vaccines will need boosters as they have been upfront since December last year that boosters would be needed, and that wasnt being contended.

Our govenrment has quite rightly ordered both Moderna and Pfizer boosters for next year. Based on the 6-8 month time frame we will need to start giving them at scale from January, and some of the early 1A recipeints (those who were fully vaccinated before end of March) will need them from Dec this year.

As soon as I am eligile for an mrna booster i will be at front of the line to get it.

Got my second Pfizer shot at Olympic Park this morning. Arrived 20 mins early and there was zero queue (vs one that snaked right around the block last time), waved straight in. Less than 2 mins from arrival, to scan, to having the shot in my arm.

Weirdly this time I was made to wait for 30 mins observation instead of 15mins, I am allergic to Penicillin (anaphylaxis) and was sat in chair right at front, could hear the nurse asking everyone if first or second shot. Of the 100 or so people who walked past me all but two were there for 2nd shots. No idea why 15 mins was fine last time, but not this time, but nurse said I looked fine and let me leave after 25 mins anyway.

I'm guessing lock down means a lot of people with appointments from Fairfield, Liverpool and Bankstown LGAs have had to rebook into somewhere in their area and also others wouldn't want to get Public Transport as that train line goes via coughberland LGA which has very high case load too. I Ubered so no issues.

Its worth checking to see if spots have opened up at Olympic Park as was definitely much less busy than 3 weeks ago.

Interesting chatting with Uber driver who was 38, he tried to get AZ at his local GP (supply wasn't an issue obviously) and the GP refused as said under 40s not eligible, he argued and showed him the web site but no joy. So seems some GP don't understand the rules. He then went to another random GP and was jabbed yesterday. I told him to report his own GP to the AMA as the refusal wasn't based on medical advice but on the GP being ignorant of the roll-out options.

AZ and other COVID-19 vaccines approved in Australia are remarkably effective. Shortening the gap may reduce the effectiveness but it’s still very effective and a strong T-cell response from AZ may mean even with the shorter gap between doses boosters aren’t needed for a long time.

We need evidence to know when/if boosters are needed for AZ.

This is the post you replied to.
It was asking for evidence about when/ if boosters are needed for AZ.
It did not say at all that there was no evidence for them.

 

[Lynda2475]

No it was not.

LOL yeah right - the evidence is there for all to see.

mviy said:
We need evidence to know when/if boosters are needed for AZ

I pointed them to where evidence is being leveraged in the real world in the UK.

Post automatically merged: Aug 17, 2021

The BBC article you posted make no mention of vaccination branding. You are certainly straw personing.

Nope, show where AZ is being excluded form the UK booster program? You cant because it is not being excluded, and the majority of doses given to the age groups prioritised for boosters were originally given AZ, that is a matter of public record.

 

[Princess Fiona]

LOL yeah right - the evidence is there for all to see.

mviy said:
We need evidence to know when/if boosters are needed for AZ

I pointed them to where evidence is being leveraged in the real world in the UK.

Post automatically merged: Aug 17, 2021

Nope, show where AZ is being excluded form the UK booster program? You cant because it is not being excluded, and the majority of doses given to the age groups prioritised for boosters were originally given AZ, that is a matter of public record.

Can you link to the public record where the majority of those priorized were given AZ?

Pfizer was the first vaccine rolled out.
AZ one month later.
This is from a paper in the Lancet showing distribution of doses of both
AZ and Pfizer across age groups in the initial roll out. It doesn’t give the HCW but they were mostly done with Pfizer. My parents in Scotland were also part of the initial roll out and received Pfizer

 

[Lynda2475]

Can you link to the public record where the majority of those priorized were given AZ?

Read what I said "the majority of doses given to the age groups prioritised for boosters were originally given AZ"

From your own graph the majority of over 75s and just under half of the 70-74s were given AZ. The only age group who have been prioritzed solely based on age are "all adults aged 70 years or over", so no need for further evidence, given most 70+ had AZ.

 

[Princess Fiona]

Read what I said "the majority of doses given to the age groups prioritised for boosters were originally given AZ"

From your own graph the majority of over 75s and just under half of the 70-74s were given AZ. The only age group who have been prioritzed solely based on age are "all adults aged 70 years or over", so no need for further evidence, given most 70+ had AZ.

But you are aware that there are a lot more people in the priority groups for boosters and the majority of those would be Pfizer ?

The booster program in the UK will be very interesting to follow because it’s not at all limited to age or type of vaccine given and will include a large amount of recipients of an mRNA vaccine (Pfizer / Moderna) from the initial roll out.

 

[Lynda2475]

And as I said previously the need for boosters for Pfizer and Moderna has never been in dispute, that expectation was set before they even started being used.

The booster program in the UK will be very interesting to follow because it’s not at all limited to age or type of vaccine given and will include a large amount of recipients of an mRNA vaccine (Pfizer / Moderna) from the initial roll out.

The more interesting bit will be which vaccines they choose to use for the boosters.

I dont think boosters in Israel and USA are being limited on age either, although the weakening protection has been stated to be more prevalent in the older age groups.

Indonesia has been giving its hospital workers moderna boosters for a few weeks as the two doses of the Sinovac vaccine wasnt working against Delta.

Has anywhere been giving AZ boosters?

 

[serfty]

Nope, show where AZ is being excluded form the UK booster program?

You may as well ask to show where Pfizer is being excluded from the UK booster program.

Another example of your tiresome strawmanning.

A reasonable person would have either mentioned no particular brand of vaccine in their post, or all involved. But not you!

This is what you posted:

Watch the UK they are giving boosters to those vaccinated with AZ startig 1st September.

 

[Lynda2475]

This is what you posted

And once again context is everything, it was a reply to a question re evidence of boosters for AZ.

Your extrapolating of a specific repsonse to other situations is also tiring.

 

[serfty]

And once again context is everything, it was a reply to a question re evidence of boosters for AZ.

Your extrapolating of a specific repsonse to other situations is also tiring.

The instigator of references to boosters in this thread was you in post 1751.

You are again building characters made of straw.

The need for boosters has always been expected, this is not new information.

Funny that no one has mentioned that anyone who shortens their AZ gap to under 8 weeks will need a booster much sooner

Why did you not mention Pfizer recipients requiring similar - which is what the UK/Israel comparison researched.

 

[Lynda2475]

Why did you not mention Pfizer recipients requiring similar - which is what the UK/Israel comparison researched.

LOL I have been talking about the need for boosters since February (and in March, April, May) and have mentioned boosters multiple times on multiple threads this year.

I was calling for the need to secure more mrna boosters at the point when the feds had only secured the Moderna ones (not enough for everyone over 16), and was very pleased they have secured more now from Pfizer.

I have NEVER denied the need for MRNA boosters, I didnt raise it again because others had already mentioned it but conveninetly omitted mentioning that AZ boosters are also required and that the need is earlier if the dose gap is shortneed below 8 weeks.

I have no idea why so many here are acting surprised that boosters will be required, the expectation was never the contrary. Boosters are not unique to MRNA vaccines, but MRNA vaccines can be modified for variants more quickly than some other vaccine types.

 

[trevella]

I have no idea why so many here are acting surprised that boosters will be required

Right. I’m just as stunned by the concept as I was four months ago:

And the current rollout is unlikely to be enough since a booster against variants will be the general standard as of early 2022.