NBN Discussion

[Quickstatus]

Minimum speed guarantee?. Sounds good on paper but in reality would cost far in the fees of what most people will pay.

I refer again to my kids school
FW (non NBN) private connection
100/100 uncontended so the line speeds are guaranteed
>$3000 per month

25/25 uncontended was quoted at circa $1200 per month

Anytbing less than $100 per month will have to mean a contended service. There is no doubt that NBN pricing models are geared to a price point. It's just that people have an expectation that they should get super duper fibre speeds for essentially not more than ADSL pricing.

 

[ajw373]

A minimum speed doesn't mean they have to buy uncontested CVC. A company could still offer a minimum guarantee of say 25mb/s, and still only buy 5mb/s per user for example, because no one will be on using 100% 24x7. It would be up to the provider to buy sufficient bandwidth to best meet that requirement.

 

[Quickstatus]

A minimum speed doesn't mean they have to buy uncontested CVC. A company could still offer a minimum guarantee of say 25mb/s, and still only buy 5mb/s per user for example, because no one will be on using 100% 24x7. It would be up to the provider to buy sufficient bandwidth to best meet that requirement.

when lots of users are sharing there really is no way to guarantee a service without markedly reducing the contention ratio especially at peak usage times.

 

[ajw373]

Yeah, reduce the contention ratio, essentially what I was saying.

 

[amaroo]

<snip>

Anytbing less than $100 per month will have to mean a contended service. There is no doubt that NBN pricing models are geared to a price point. It's just that people have an expectation that they should get super duper fibre speeds for essentially not more than ADSL pricing.

Lets hope so! Gone with a package (speed boost) well north of $100/month .... more than happy to pay top $$ if the user pay system kicks in! If I end up in a queue with the bottom feeders .... not happy!

 

[ComeFlyWithMe]

In fact the fibre NTD's installed in homes have 4 ports Ethernet ports plus 2 voice ports, so it is already technically possible for a single NBN FTTP customer to have 4x200mb/s services plus two voice channels, so add in another 32-64mb/s depending upon voice compression running over that fibre. Try and do that with FTTN or FTTC.

To correct you, a voice channel needs only 32-64kbps not mb/s.
FTTN/C will handle 1Gbps theoretical and easily those two voice channels, which themselves can run over ADSL1 now.
Obviously the quality and distance of the copper will vary the outcome.
VDSL (copper) is already delivering 100Mbps which is the highest available NBN plan now.

 

[Quickstatus]

Yeah, reduce the contention ratio, essentially what I was saying.

Reducing the contention ratio will mean everyone sharing that line will pay more not just the person wanting the ratio reduced.
Won't happen

 

[ajw373]

VDSL you say is delivering 100mb/s which is right but hardly the norm, most places struggle to get that. Look st this thread. Then you say FTTN/C can deliver 1Gb/s. Well yeah kinda g.fast but not really in practice and besides not what is being rolled out.

There is a reason g.fast since it was first developed in 2013 hasn't gone further and that is because it is a waste of time except in ideal conditions. Which the real world is not ideal. Refer to this thread.

And there are plenty of higher than 100mb/s nbn fibre plans out there. Sky mesh for one.

And thanks for fixing my type re voice speed.

 

[moa999]

And there are plenty of higher than 100mb/s nbn fibre plans out there. Sky mesh for one..

Not exactly plenty (or cheap). Suspect it's a very small number using these plans.

I'm sure FTTB/FTTC will get g.fast, xg.fast upgrades, as HFC will get DOCSIS 3.1

As for most of FTTN.. sorry

 

[rogerkambah]

i have water all the time in the pit outside my place. It's often underwater. But the copper connection is silicone sealed so no issues there. Ive had problems with the adsl when the pit is dry and no issues when flooded. Pits are often flooded.

Youtube for the innovation nation? Unfortunately most will be using such "enabling" infrastructure to consume YouTube. Very innovative!

Just had a problem with my LL going AWOL. The ADSL was still operating albeit often slowly.

However, to get to the point, the tech came and ran a couple of tests, predicting there was a fault in one of the pair in a pit 160m away. He returned around 30 mins later and said that the silicon that had been used to protect the cu had reacted with it over time and destroyed the connection.

Currently in my 'burb the NBN racks are being installed in the exchange about 900m away and its going to be cu from there. I'm not anticipating the NBN to be very fast.

 

[jb747]

Not exactly plenty (or cheap). Suspect it's a very small number using these plans.

I'm sure FTTB/FTTC will get g.fast, xg.fast upgrades, as HFC will get DOCSIS 3.1

As for most of FTTN.. sorry

Just looking at an NBN planning map (NBN MTM Alpha), and FTTN is already starting to be supplanted....FTTC seems quite widespread through Melbourne.

 

[whatmeworry]

Just looking at an NBN planning map (NBN MTM Alpha), and FTTN is already starting to be supplanted....FTTC seems quite widespread through Melbourne.

With being denied FTTP 3 years ago and now only 500 metres from a FTTP street, I just manged to scrape into a FTTC zone (pending) with the next street in a HFC zone.

 

[straitman]

We have a new date of 12th June. We'll be in Singapore so it has a month of settling time form our perspective.

 

[docjames]

/interweb for idiots question/

What are the relative benefits / drawbacks of FTTN (Fibre to the Node) connection versus HFC (hybrid Firbe Coaxial) - I gather HFC connects via existing "foxtel" or "optus" pay tv (which i think it may be) style cabling?

If i have HFC (as per the nbn site), am i better trying to get them to install FTTN (and remove the HFC cabling)?

Can I get FTTN installed underground (as opposed to the HFC which i think is strung across from power line)?

TIA.

 

[whatmeworry]

/interweb for idiots question/

What are the relative benefits / drawbacks of FTTN (Fibre to the Node) connection versus HFC (hybrid Firbe Coaxial) - I gather HFC connects via existing "foxtel" or "optus" pay tv (which i think it may be) style cabling?

If i have HFC (as per the nbn site), am i better trying to get them to install FTTN (and remove the HFC cabling)?

Can I get FTTN installed underground (as opposed to the HFC which i think is strung across from power line)?

TIA.

If they are going with HFC, then not much option going to FTTN. They would have to wire the copper from the node to your home. You would have to pay a couple hundred just for the application. They might quote you a couple hundred or a couple thousand for the job.

The Coaxial is a higher quality copper line but is shared with your neighbours which can get congested.

A copper line from the node is poorer quality line but is only for you.

HFC on Docsis 3.1 can support gigabit speeds, fttn vdsl can't.

 

[Quickstatus]

All the gigabit speed and no app

https://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/06/...ernet-speed-search-for-a-killer-app.html?_r=1

 

[coriander]

Just had a problem with my LL going AWOL. The ADSL was still operating albeit often slowly.

We have this happen about every 12 months at work, ADSL usually drops from its blazingly fast 2.25 Mbps down to <0.5Mbps. Telstra turn up and move my connection (we have a 50 pair cable into the business) to another pair of cables they retrieve from the muddy pit outside and all is well for another year. Techs have told me that the cable in the street should have been replaced years ago, but all maintenance and renewal was cancelled with the advent of NBN v1.0.

We're slated for HFC at work end of year; just looking at prices, NBN is much more expensive than FTTB we have at home for the same speed.

What I am puzzled by is a green FTTN cabinet installed over 12 months ago in an area where there are no residences and only a few business in the immediate area: why put one there?

 

[whatmeworry]

We have this happen about every 12 months at work, ADSL usually drops from its blazingly fast 2.25 Mbps down to <0.5Mbps. Telstra turn up and move my connection (we have a 50 pair cable into the business) to another pair of cables they retrieve from the muddy pit outside and all is well for another year. Techs have told me that the cable in the street should have been replaced years ago, but all maintenance and renewal was cancelled with the advent of NBN v1.0.

We're slated for HFC at work end of year; just looking at prices, NBN is much more expensive than FTTB we have at home for the same speed.

What I am puzzled by is a green FTTN cabinet installed over 12 months ago in an area where there are no residences and only a few business in the immediate area: why put one there?

View attachment 97985

Obviously the government believes their will be a revival in industry and manufacturing once they cut company tax by 1%.

But geez that area is a bit depressing from street view and satellite seeing how much industry has gone. Driving down Somerville Road you can see these properties won't be redeveloped for anything, anytime soon.

 

[Quickstatus]

Here is some other tech for NBN's MTM platform.
Such as this:
https://x.company/loon/
Currently one is hovering over Fiji islands
Cheap as chips

 

[jb747]

It might bring new meaning to the internet going "down".