Oneworld separate ticket interline changes

[Aumelle]

Answering my own question, Qantas was unable/unwilling to check through my luggage. Getting a supervisor involved and showing the internal note did not make a difference. Very frustrating and thus a complete waste of points!

 

[ozbeachbabe]

As I said, functionally no different. It's marginal benefit through checking in these circumstances ( a minute?).

And never going to be protected on separate itineraries irrespective of through checking.

ISTR one of the Conventions (Montreal, Geneva etc) stating in the rules that a through check on separate tickets should be treated in the same manner as if both flights were all on a single ticket. Actually it may have been a OW airlines' ruling on their own website that stated that come to think of it.

I remember someone on AFF had a issue where AY in HEL through checked their bag to a QF flight BKK/SYD on a separate ticket and issued all boarding passes. AY were late HEL/BKK resulting in the pax mis-connecting with QF BKK/SYD however AY refused to take responsibility citing separate tickets which I believe was wrong on their part.

Despite this occurring prior to 01 June 2016 when One World introduced the updated policy, it seems that even within an alliance airlines still make up the rules as they see fit.

One of the contributing reasons QF ceased through checking to any airline in November 2010 (unless OW or EK at the time) was the eruption of Iceland's Eyjafjallajokull Volcano that caused massive disruptions for days. They had to feed and accommodate and book new flights for people on separate tickets who were stranded in places such as SIN as they didn't have any ticketing agreements to reissue tickets on carriers outside of the OW alliance nor access to these separate bookings/tickets to see where on earth the passengers were meant to be going.

As we all know as of 01 Sep 2016 the no checking through on separate tickets of OW carriers came into effect of QF with the exception of a combination of commercial and award tickets that is hit and miss going by the posts on this thread.

 

[Himeno]

The current official known cross ticket/PNR interline polices of oneworld airlines:
Yes
CX, JL, MH, QR, UL
AY - only to itself

No
BA, IB, LA
AA, QF - will interline if connecting between revenue and award tickets

Unknown
AB, RJ, S7


I'm trying to work out how to get different tickets issued within the same PNR. It is meant to be possible, and if the different tickets are in the same PNR, throughcheck across them should be possible.
I asked my travel agent to do this when booking my holiday last year, and all 4 tickets (DONE3, DAS13 and 2 x extra side trips) were all booked within the same PNR, but when they went to the airlines to get issued, the PNR was split.
Thankfully, the only cross ticket connections I had were with JL connecting to AA.

Before the alliance wide change last year, the only time I had an issue with cross ticket through check was IB in BCN checking through MAD and LHR to DXB (computer didn't want to print connecting baggage tag - though did the boarding passes without issue, and manual tag was used. Bag got delayed at LHR).

Also once had AY in BCN refuse to check through to AY in HEL onto ARN, on the same ticket, claiming that the HEL-ARN flight "wasn't AY". It was a contract flight for AY operated by FlyBe, which is like saying Eastern Australian isn't Qantas or an American Eagle branded flight isn't AA.

 

[ozbeachbabe]

The current official known cross ticket/PNR interline polices of oneworld airlines:

AA, QF - will interline if connecting between revenue and award tickets

I though the commercial & award combo was only QF to AA - not AA to QF?

I believe AA will sometimes through check to QF but I don't think that's limited to any specific ticket combo the pax is travelling on - either they will or they won't.

 

[Himeno]

I though the commercial & award combo was only QF to AA - not AA to QF?

I believe AA will sometimes through check to QF but I don't think that's limited to any specific ticket combo the pax is travelling on - either they will or they won't.

AA and QF both have the same official policy. They will only interline across tickets to is one is an award and one is a revenue ticket and both flights are oneworld members.

 

[Happy Trails]

OT, but when I checked in with TG at SYD last month the agent offered to check my bag through to my AY BKK-HEL booking, before I pointed out that that flight was actually five days later.

 

[madrooster]

I'm trying to work out how to get different tickets issued within the same PNR. It is meant to be possible, and if the different tickets are in the same PNR, throughcheck across them should be possible.I asked my travel agent to do this when booking my holiday last year, and all 4 tickets (DONE3, DAS13 and 2 x extra side trips) were all booked within the same PNR, but when they went to the airlines to get issued, the PNR was split. Thankfully, the only cross ticket connections I had were with JL connecting to AA.

AU based agent? Where were the tickets originating from? You can't split segments off a PNR, only passengers. It sounds like they cancelled the segments from the agency PNR and then rebooked the segments separately in a new PNR.

 

[dajop]

ISTR one of the Conventions (Montreal, Geneva etc) stating in the rules that a through check on separate tickets should be treated in the same manner as if both flights were all on a single ticket. Actually it may have been a OW airlines' ruling on their own website that stated that come to think of it.

Which may well be why that many airlines refuse to do it. So it seems it's all (protected flights, baggage through check etc) or nothing. Net result? Disadvantage to all pax, because instead of just covering the through checked baggage, it sounds like the rule makes it cover everything to do with the ticket(s)... which ultimately means everyone loses out because airlines don't want to do any of it. Al

 

[Himeno]

AU based agent? Where were the tickets originating from? You can't split segments off a PNR, only passengers. It sounds like they cancelled the segments from the agency PNR and then rebooked the segments separately in a new PNR.

It was a CBR-CBR oneworld circle Asia/SWP, a TYO-TYO oneworld explorer RTW, a JFK-TYO return and a JFK-BOS oneway. All booked at the same time and entered in the same PNR. Once paid, the agent queued the tickets for issuing and each ticket was sent to the operator of the longest flight on that ticket (QF, QR and AA). When they were issued, the 4 tickets were in 3 PNRs.

 

[madrooster]

When they were issued, the 4 tickets were in 3 PNRs.

Were they ticketed in AUD? I'm trying to understand what point of sale was used. The TYO-TYO explorer I would imagine would've been sold in JPY from a JP point of sale... The JFK-TYO return shouldn't have mattered where it was sold, same with the JFK-BOS one way.

It seems like they rebooked the segments in a new PNR before ticketing it, I doubt ticketing caused it to split. I've never seen such a thing happen from ticketing.

 

[Himeno]

Were they ticketed in AUD? I'm trying to understand what point of sale was used. The TYO-TYO explorer I would imagine would've been sold in JPY from a JP point of sale... The JFK-TYO return shouldn't have mattered where it was sold, same with the JFK-BOS one way.

Yes. AUD. A rule change to the xONEx early last year allowed them to be sold at the departure point price converted to the sale point currency rather then the sale point price (ie, it was sold at JP price with JPY amount converted to AUD instead of old rule where more expensive AU price would be used).

I was trying to get them all in the same PNR because of the interline changes, the xONEx pricing rule change helped matters (before I had to get an agent in JP to remotely book with).
The agent I use knows that I understand a lot of the systems/lingo, so often shows me her screen when she is in the booking and I verified that all the tickets were in the same PNR within Galileo. All I know is that at some point during the ticketing process, the PNR was split. I guess it is related in some way to the transfer from Galileo to Sabre and Amadeus.

 

[madrooster]

The agent I use knows that I understand a lot of the systems/lingo, so often shows me her screen when she is in the booking and I verified that all the tickets were in the same PNR within Galileo. All I know is that at some point during
the ticketing process, the PNR was split. I guess it is related in some way to the transfer from Galileo to Sabre and Amadeus.

Galileo is most likely your problem... it's a cough system. Flight Centre is dumping it and moving to Sabre soon...

Why is your agent sending them to the airline to issue? Agencies can issue oneworld products in-house if they want to.

I frequently put numerous tickets in a single PNR (the max I've done is 7 tickets in a single PNR) without any issues, and that is on PNRs containing awards or just all commercial tickets. It helps that most of oneworld is in the same system (Amadeus) as what I use.

 

[Himeno]

Galileo is most likely your problem... it's a cough system. Flight Centre is dumping it and moving to Sabre soon...

When is "soon"? Does that include their other brands (such as Escape Travel)?

hmm.... seems the FC/Travelport contract ended in June, so the switch to Sabre should have happened 3 weeks ago.
Hopefully that means booking this years trip will go better.

 

[wandering_fred]

Galileo is most likely your problem... it's a cough system. Flight Centre is dumping it and moving to Sabre soon...
Why is your agent sending them to the airline to issue? Agencies can issue oneworld products in-house if they want to.
I frequently put numerous tickets in a single PNR (the max I've done is 7 tickets in a single PNR) without any issues, and that is on PNRs containing awards or just all commercial tickets. It helps that most of oneworld is in the same system (Amadeus) as what I use.

Historically, I believe the [Australian] agency has to have plating "rights" for the airline. When I wanted an AA issued ticket (xONEx of seriously past years) they had to send to a consolidator who had the correct "permissions".

YMMV especially as I am wandering

Fred

 

[madrooster]

When is "soon"? Does that include their other brands (such as Escape Travel)?

hmm.... seems the FC/Travelport contract ended in June, so the switch to Sabre should have happened 3 weeks ago.
Hopefully that means booking this years trip will go better.

If it's Escape Travel, they queue PNRs to a back office for ticket issuing. They do not queue to the airline to issue the ticket (agents are generally forbidden from doing so except in special circumstances).

The entire FC group is moving over to Sabre but I don't know when the migration is supposed to be finished as it's a huge migration. FC was one of Galileo's biggest customers pretty much.

Having used Galileo, Sabre and Amadeus, I have the least issues on Amadeus and as such it's a no brainer that it's my preferred GDS.

Happy to plate it in Amadeus for you if you want to give that a go to see if that breaks.

 

[ozbeachbabe]

The agent I use knows that I understand a lot of the systems/lingo, so often shows me her screen when she is in the booking and I verified that all the tickets were in the same PNR within Galileo.

All I know is that at some point during the ticketing process, the PNR was split. I guess it is related in some way to the transfer from Galileo to Sabre and Amadeus.

I think it only works with Amadeus, well at least if segments are added at a later date.

It may be possible that if all flights (even if to be ticketed separately) are booked at the same time through a Galileo agent ie when pnr is initially created, that a OW airline can see your oncarriage flight but not 100% sure on that.

As Mad Rooster said the pnr can only have names divided out not flights so I'd say that when your TA has added the flights at a later stage, despite them being in the same Galileo pnr, the flights did not generate as information segments to the OW carrier in a way that would display them as oncarriage flights in the checkin system of the first airline.

 

[madrooster]

I think it only works with Amadeus, well at least if segments are added at a later date.

It may be possible that if all flights (even if to be ticketed separately) are booked at the same time through a Galileo agent ie when pnr is initially created, that a OW airline can see your oncarriage flight but not 100% sure on that.

As Mad Rooster said the pnr can only have names divided out not flights so I'd say that when your TA has added the flights at a later stage, despite them being in the same Galileo pnr, the flights did not generate as information segments to the OW carrier in a way that would display them as oncarriage flights in the checkin system of the first airline.

All 3 major GDSes behave the same for this particular purpose. It doesn't matter if there's 3 flights with 3 different tickets involved - if these 3 flights are within 24 hours of each other, then the accepting carrier (ie. the first carrier performing the check in) will see all 3 segments.

 

[ozbeachbabe]

All 3 major GDSes behave the same for this particular purpose. It doesn't matter if there's 3 flights with 3 different tickets involved - if these 3 flights are within 24 hours of each other, then the accepting carrier (ie. the first carrier performing the check in) will see all 3 segments.

That might be so in the airline res system/GDS but what about the checkin system?

A CSA will only be able to through check if the oncarriage is visible in the checkin system.....or if the accepting airline will interline on separate tickets.

It's possible that a flight info segment may not be viewable in the checkin system despite being visible in the GDS res pnr.

 

[madrooster]

That might be so in the airline res system/GDS but what about the checkin system?

A CSA will only be able to through check if the oncarriage is visible in the checkin system.....or if the accepting airline will interline on separate tickets.

It's possible that a flight info segment may not be viewable in the checkin system despite being visible in the GDS res pnr.

For carriers where the DCS is also their GDS reservations provider, eg. Amadeus or Sabre, what's in the GDS PNR is what shows in the DCS for check in purposes. The more oddball ones where I'm not sure is where the carrier uses some archaic system, eg. UA using SHARES.

 

[dfcatch]

AA and QF both have the same official policy. They will only interline across tickets to is one is an award and one is a revenue ticket and both flights are oneworld members.

Except that the execution is different.

With QF - you just need to have a rev/award combo itinerary.

With AA - you actually need to proactively call up to get the rev/award combo issued into a single PNR - you can't just rock up with a rev/award combo in separate PNRs